Why Are PMD Christians So Obsessed With The Antichrist?
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10-09-2013, 12:46 PM
RE: Why Are PMD Christians So Obsessed With The Antichrist?
(10-09-2013 12:36 PM)Raptor Jesus Wrote:  Things my rature-end-of-the-world friend post on her forum groups...

Cut & Pasted:

"Re: The Back Peddling on the Syrian Crisis
1.) The fact that things got stalled does NOT mean things are slowing down. Jesus said "wars and RUMORS of wars" we are STILL in that position, we have NOT back peddeled Smile

2.) I heard rumor that Saudi Arabia has offered Russia a hand in the global oil trade and rights to control their own gas lines IF they back away from Assad. However, this is from people who are saying that this whole Syrian uprising has to do with Syria's refusal to allow other countries to build a pipe line through Syria. How much of this is true, I don't know. My dad worked in the ME on oil companies in a very high up rank and he believes this information to be true based on his experiences in the ME. So, could this be an attempt to say "hey, we tried to back you, you didn't do what we asked so we are done with you, good luck!" in the event that Assad does not follow through to the T?

3.) Isaiah 17 to me kinda says that the nations will roar against Syria/Israel but appears that God may rebuke them BEFORE they attack and then after that there is a night of terror (by who though?) and then all is destroyed by morning. Since I interpret it this way, I have not believed that the US would do anything at all this whole time, so I am NOT surprised by the "back peddling."

4.) The rapture is to take place while people are marrying, giving in marriage, eating and drinking, etc. If the US attacked Syria and they/their neighbors attacked Israel and then Israel destroyed Syria, how can we all be living like in the days of Noah?! All this panic of WWIII needs to go away so that the scoffers can make fun of us and say "haha and you thought your savior was going to come for you? Where is he?" and then they can get back to their lives and when all seems normal again...BAM! God acts and nobody will second guess it. I'm sticking to something natural, like a massive earthquake/volcanic eruption/tsunami/meteor/etc. I think God's sudden destruction will obviously come from him and not from man so I'm not looking for WWIII to break out first, I'm looking for a calmness to come, peace talks to resume, and life to get back to normal. This is when I think it will happen, so no, this should not be a disappointment, but a sign of how much closer we are getting.


HEADS UP PEEPS!!
Re: Dis - appointed.....
I'm so sorry that you are disappointed TR, and to all of you others. I knew this was going to happen, and I know how bad it feels b/c I was extremely disappointed last Spring when the rapture didn't happen (b/c I knew that meant at least one more year of waiting).

I will not get my hopes up of a rapture until our anniversary comes near. Passover is the day Jesus paid the dowry, and to me it would be fitting to make the Jews jealous by taking us on the day they are waiting for their Messiah.

However, another way that I've been thinking could make the Jews jealous is if we are raptured (and it is made clear to the world how we disappeared) is to take us on a non-feast day. Since the Jews believe that God only acts on His feast days, this may be a shocker to them to see God act on a non-feast day and may make the Jews jealous.

Either way, if the start of WWIII starts this week, I don't know how we can make it to Spring (even though things have been unfolding very slowly and despite the fact that I believe we will see some horrible things before going home).

I do not think we will make it past Spring though, I just can't imagine how, unless everything to just stops in its place and nothing else happens. Which could happen, afterall, look at North Korea, they had their missiles all ready to go and then quietly cowered down. So anything is fair game right now. Keep your heads up folks, God has a purpose for us and we are NOT done with our job yet!


Re: Dis - appointed.....
Shiloh said: I wonder if this mystery (as to the day of our departure) is to throw satan off guard.

Shiloh, I just had a picture in my head. Everytime a "high watch" date comes up it seems like things in the world get turned up to a boil and then when the date passes, things calm down (like they are right now with Syria). Could this be Satan trying to amp things up so that if the rapture happens on that day he can cause some type of catastrophe to take people's attention off of all the missing people?

If so, then I can see why it would be a moment we last expect, and an even better argument for a non-feast day. So that God can be like, "nope Satan, you aren't going to be able to explain this one away very easily!""



For some of ^^^these^^^ people, this is the only part of the bible they focus on or care about. Just the end of the world and destruction of all man kind.

There are studies of people's temperment and their interpretation of their understanding of the bible, and it shows, not suprising, that their temperment influences their interpretation and understanding of the bible. ...or their understanding of the bible influences their temprament. That actually is not clear which is which. It's a chicken or the egg kind of thing, but it is strongly corrolated.

What does it do to people who focus their lives on this interpetation of the message of the bible, and what does it say about them? I feel sad for my friend because she has the bible in her life, because she just focuses on the mystery of the world and the sadness in it, rather than seeing how amazing and incredable it all really is.

The world is this endlessly amazing increadible place to me, and for her it's just misery to suffer through until it's over. That's not appealing to me at all.

...
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10-09-2013, 12:58 PM
RE: Why Are PMD Christians So Obsessed With The Antichrist?
(09-09-2013 03:07 PM)Philosoraptor Wrote:  
(09-09-2013 02:22 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  [...] Jesus said the Jewish people will be in Israel when He returns (in NT eschaton scriptures).

Jesus said he would return within the lifetimes of his followers. Not +/- 2,000 years.

Absolutely not. The word "generation" has six different meanings in Greek, three or four of them (from memory) indicate that Jewish people, not "the disciples of Jesus" will be on the mountains of Jerusalem when Christ returns. And what do you know? There they are. Be logical. "Generation" would be the wrong word to use for "my disciples", right?

Paul and Peter made statements like "Finally... after the Antichrist sits in Jerusalem [in the coming third temple] this age will end..." Both Peter and Paul indicated their own martyrdom would come before Christ would return! Peter said "Don't think His return is slow, a day is like a thousand years..."

The fallacy of the imminent return of Christ is a scholarly straw man.
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10-09-2013, 01:12 PM
RE: Why Are PMD Christians So Obsessed With The Antichrist?
Like every good story there needs to be a villain. Therefore the antichrist...cause god and jebus

...are such good

...guys

...yeah, nevermind.

I'm not anti-social. I'm pro-solitude. Sleepy
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10-09-2013, 01:13 PM (This post was last modified: 11-09-2013 07:52 AM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Why Are PMD Christians So Obsessed With The Antichrist?
(10-09-2013 12:58 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  
(09-09-2013 03:07 PM)Philosoraptor Wrote:  Jesus said he would return within the lifetimes of his followers. Not +/- 2,000 years.

Absolutely not. The word "generation" has six different meanings in Greek, three or four of them (from memory) indicate that Jewish people, not "the disciples of Jesus" will be on the mountains of Jerusalem when Christ returns. And what do you know? There they are. Be logical. "Generation" would be the wrong word to use for "my disciples", right?

Paul and Peter made statements like "Finally... after the Antichrist sits in Jerusalem [in the coming third temple] this age will end..." Both Peter and Paul indicated their own martyrdom would come before Christ would return! Peter said "Don't think His return is slow, a day is like a thousand years..."

The fallacy of the imminent return of Christ is a scholarly straw man.

Jebus, (if he existed) was one of the many apocalyptic preachers. In that context, (and the general context we KNOW their thinking existed from the Dead Sea Scrolls, and other apocalyptic literature from the period), this is 110% pure crap, and you know it. The apocalyptics thought the "end of the age" was immanent. The lame attempt by Christian Fundie apologists to explain away the failure falls flat on it's ass. The FACT is, Jebus was an apocalyptic, if he was real, he existed in the apocalyptic group. and we KNOW what they expected. Trying to carve out an exception for him individually is intellectually dishonest. So, stop lying PleaseJebus. Stop trying to rationalize your nonsense. It makes you look even dumber than you already do.

Jebus is Lard.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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10-09-2013, 01:48 PM
 
RE: Why Are PMD Christians So Obsessed With The Antichrist?
(10-09-2013 12:58 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  
(09-09-2013 03:07 PM)Philosoraptor Wrote:  Jesus said he would return within the lifetimes of his followers. Not +/- 2,000 years.

Absolutely not. The word "generation" has six different meanings in Greek, three or four of them (from memory) indicate that Jewish people, not "the disciples of Jesus" will be on the mountains of Jerusalem when Christ returns. And what do you know? There they are. Be logical. "Generation" would be the wrong word to use for "my disciples", right?

Paul and Peter made statements like "Finally... after the Antichrist sits in Jerusalem [in the coming third temple] this age will end..." Both Peter and Paul indicated their own martyrdom would come before Christ would return! Peter said "Don't think His return is slow, a day is like a thousand years..."

The fallacy of the imminent return of Christ is a scholarly straw man.

As Bucky Ball said, this is pure crap.

Authors of the New Testament thought they were living in the "last days". James 5:7-8, 1 John 2:18, 1 Peter 1:20, 1 Peter 4:7, Rom. 13:11-12, 16:20; Heb. 1:1-2, 9:26, 10:37; 1 Cor. 7:29... This is only a part, there's more.

"Peter said..." That wasn't Peter, PJ. Peter died in the 60s (at least according to "tradition"), and the 2nd epistle of "Peter" was written decades later, when all the apostles died out (3:4), and people started asking questions. Of course, "Peter" responded in a proper, Christian way, with threats of fire and whatever other flammable stuff.

As for the word "genea", in that context it was obviously referring to a generation, because Jesus also used other words to describe the same thing, and they indicated his arrival within his disciples' lifetimes.

"For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.
" (Matt. 16:27-28)

Also Luke 9:27 and Mark 9:1.

Look what he said to a high priest:
"But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed? And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven." (Mark 14:61-62)

"You shall see him coming." Well, he didn't. That high priest died in the 1st century, or even 2nd if he lived a long life, but he didn't see Jesus coming in the clouds of heaven. Fail.

Interesting how the gospel of John doesn't contain these apocalyptic predictions. That's because it was written after the apostles' lifetimes.
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11-09-2013, 06:43 AM
RE: Why Are PMD Christians So Obsessed With The Antichrist?
(10-09-2013 01:48 PM)Philosoraptor Wrote:  " ..... and whatever other *flammable stuff*."

ROTFL

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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12-09-2013, 02:58 PM
RE: Why Are PMD Christians So Obsessed With The Antichrist?
(10-09-2013 01:48 PM)Philosoraptor Wrote:  
(10-09-2013 12:58 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  Absolutely not. The word "generation" has six different meanings in Greek, three or four of them (from memory) indicate that Jewish people, not "the disciples of Jesus" will be on the mountains of Jerusalem when Christ returns. And what do you know? There they are. Be logical. "Generation" would be the wrong word to use for "my disciples", right?

Paul and Peter made statements like "Finally... after the Antichrist sits in Jerusalem [in the coming third temple] this age will end..." Both Peter and Paul indicated their own martyrdom would come before Christ would return! Peter said "Don't think His return is slow, a day is like a thousand years..."

The fallacy of the imminent return of Christ is a scholarly straw man.

As Bucky Ball said, this is pure crap.

Authors of the New Testament thought they were living in the "last days". James 5:7-8, 1 John 2:18, 1 Peter 1:20, 1 Peter 4:7, Rom. 13:11-12, 16:20; Heb. 1:1-2, 9:26, 10:37; 1 Cor. 7:29... This is only a part, there's more.

Correct. The last days between the gospel and the return. Correct. Also called by Jesus in the eschatons "this age". The last days add up to an "age".

Quote:"Peter said..." That wasn't Peter, PJ. Peter died in the 60s (at least according to "tradition"), and the 2nd epistle of "Peter" was written decades later, when all the apostles died out (3:4), and people started asking questions. Of course, "Peter" responded in a proper, Christian way, with threats of fire and whatever other flammable stuff.

If you say so, it must be true. However, 2 Pet 3:4 doesn't say the apostles died, it says, "They will say, “Where is this ‘coming’ he promised? Ever since our ancestors died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation.”

Quote:As for the word "genea", in that context it was obviously referring to a generation, because Jesus also used other words to describe the same thing, and they indicated his arrival within his disciples' lifetimes.

"For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.
" (Matt. 16:27-28)

LOL. Matthew 16 is the "immediate context" of Matthew 24? Matthew 17 is the context of Matthew 16. IMMEDIATELY following all three synoptic statements about "SOME of y'all will see" is the TRANSFIGURATION. You atheists troll the mainline scholars for crap I teach first-month Bible students, who raise the same dopey questions.

Quote:Also Luke 9:27 and Mark 9:1.

Now who is proof texting? The transfiguration is why SOME of them saw the Kingdom Matthew 16-17. EVERYONE will see the RETURN. Revelation 1:9 - "Even those who pierced Him, and ALL the peoples of the Earth will mourn because of Him."

Quote:Look what he said to a high priest:
"But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed? And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven." (Mark 14:61-62)

"You shall see him coming." Well, he didn't. That high priest died in the 1st century, or even 2nd if he lived a long life, but he didn't see Jesus coming in the clouds of heaven. Fail.

Are you being serious or spurious? Hard for me to know reading words online only. The High Priest, and Hitler, and "cavemen" will see Jesus on judgment day. Do you REALLY not know THIS doctrine of Christianity? Really?! Even Job wrote about his passing to say "My eyes will see him".

Quote:Interesting how the gospel of John doesn't contain these apocalyptic predictions. That's because it was written after the apostles' lifetimes.

Yes, that is the ONLY difference in John, right? Wrong.

PS. John wrote a 22-chapter-long APOCALYPSE so he spared atheists the gory details in his gospel. I mean, bubba, youse gotta be puttin' me on!

I mean, I love coming to this forum because EVERY FREAKIN' thing I try or say or argue is COMPLETELY assaulted. It purifies my thinking, assuages the skeptic in me, and um, pleasures me. I know other Christians shouldn't be here because they would be moved to tears by the abuse.

But at least, you, Raptor, who seem VERY smart, and BB, who I KNOW is HIGHLY intelligent, can stop tossing canards at me from secular university "wise guys". I don't know how old you both are but I was dealing with this kind of horse puckey over 20 years ago when I was a Religion major in school.

"Oooh, John's different than the synoptics so he took a left turn when he couldn't talk to Q."

"Wow. The NT is UTTERLY invalidated because Jesus never came back. Oops, we forgot, he never left! He never resurrected! oooooh..."

YAWN. PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, can't you and BB come up with an original... anything... besides ad homs and tired crap I take out in fifteen seconds when I preach on a college campus?

PLEASE? Or is this really true:

For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written:

“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”

20 Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 21 For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 22 Jews demand signs and Greeks look for wisdom, 23 but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, 24 but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25 For the foolishness of God is wiser than human wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than human strength.

Translation: You guys got nuttin'.
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12-09-2013, 02:59 PM
RE: Why Are PMD Christians So Obsessed With The Antichrist?
PS. Nuttin' except my undying love and fealty for your souls. Rock on, Jesus!
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12-09-2013, 05:27 PM
RE: Why Are PMD Christians So Obsessed With The Antichrist?
I thought Zee Devil was supposed to fill the role of 'bad guy' with demons and Harry Potter as his henchmen. Anti-Christ not needed.

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12-09-2013, 05:52 PM
RE: Why Are PMD Christians So Obsessed With The Antichrist?
(12-09-2013 02:59 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  PS. Nuttin' except my undying love and fealty for your souls. Rock on, Jesus!

There is no evidence for the existence of souls.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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