Why I Appreciate the Koran...
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30-03-2013, 05:30 AM
Why I Appreciate the Koran...
I don't like the Koran, but I appreciate the way it was written for it makes it quite easy to debunk - even when a Koran apologist tries his best. Unlike the Bible, the Koran was written by just one homicidal maniac - and this guy shut the door to alternative interpretation. Unlike the Bible, there is no room for a Koran Apologist - it must be taken literally by the faithful. This is done through three "Gifts".

The first gift of the Koran is Sura 3:7 which says that all interpretations of the Koran should be literal - and is given from God -to- Muhammed -to- the Koran - just like everything said in the Koran. Sura 3:7 reads as:

Sura 3:7 It is God who has revealed the Book to you in which some verses are clear statements (which accept no interpretation) and these are the fundamental ideas of the Book, while other verses may have several possibilities. Those whose hearts are perverse, follow the unclear statements in pursuit of their own mischievous goals by interpreting them in a way that will suit their own purpose. No one knows its true interpretations except God and those who have a firm grounding in knowledge say, "We believe in it. All its verses are from our Lord." No one can grasp this fact except the people of reason.


Not much wiggle room there for the Koran Apologists! The door is pretty-much closed.

The next gift of the Koran is that it slams the door on conflicting verses via the Princple of Abrogation. The verse is Sura 2:106 and reads

Sura 2:106 We do not abrogate a verse or cause it to be forgotten except that We bring forth [one] better than it or similar to it. Do you not know that Allah is over all things competent?

Bang! The door is shut for the Koran Apologist. All one needs to know now is the order in which the Sura were revealed, and they in the chronological order as specified by: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_suras_in_the_Quran (There are 114 Suras, so I shall spare you listing them here)

The door is now locked tight! The Koran is rigidly and literally defined.

So...don't let any Muslim tell you that the Koran must be interpreted so he can explain away its ugliness, because that would be against "Allahs Law".

Hope this info helps.

Julius
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30-03-2013, 06:10 AM
RE: Why I Appreciate the Koran...
But it does leave the door open to the claim that our "hearts are perverse" we are misinterpreting because we don't have a firm "grounding in knowledge".

Given that it's unalterable, how come some English versions have added "with a feather" to the section of Sura 4 that gives advice on how to beat one's wife?

It's confusing and I'm worried I might be doing it wrong.

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30-03-2013, 06:50 AM
RE: Why I Appreciate the Koran...
(30-03-2013 06:10 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Given that it's unalterable, how come some English versions have added "with a feather" to the section of Sura 4 that gives advice on how to beat one's wife?

It's confusing and I'm worried I might be doing it wrong.

A "Feather"? No...that's a deliberate mistranslation. Here's one from the Koran posted on the University of Michigan website: (http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/ko...te=114839)

[4.34] Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion, admonish them, and leave them alone in the sleeping-places and beat them; then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them; surely Allah is High, Great.
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30-03-2013, 07:18 AM
RE: Why I Appreciate the Koran...
Oh! Right!

So I should have been beating the sleeping-places not beating the women who are my property.

See? I knew I was doing it wrong.

Blush

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30-03-2013, 08:05 AM (This post was last modified: 30-03-2013 08:38 AM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Why I Appreciate the Koran...
Unless it was all just a hoax, just like Christianity may have been.



Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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30-03-2013, 08:05 AM
RE: Why I Appreciate the Koran...
I appreciate the koran, also the bible and all the other holy books. They all make an excellent fire starter.
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30-03-2013, 08:09 AM
RE: Why I Appreciate the Koran...
(30-03-2013 05:30 AM)Julius Wrote:  I don't like the Koran, but I appreciate the way it was written for it makes it quite easy to debunk - even when a Koran apologist tries his best. Unlike the Bible, the Koran was written by just one homicidal maniac...

As far as I'm aware, it isn't written so much as "compiled", and rather than "by just one homicidal maniac", the words came from several people who allegedly heard these sayings from Mohammad (but obviously may have not, since a great majority of the things that were not accepted into the Koran were things like previous scripture that clearly were not based on Mohammad's teachings).

Also, while you may or may not be right to correct DLJ's "translation" of the Qur'an, it's noteworthy that the original Arabic that the Qur'an was written in is very ambiguous due to its lack of punctuation ("diacritical marks") that exist in modern Arabic. While leading scholars may agree with you about this particular passage (and it appears that they do), much of it is probably due to bias towards probability (this passage, for example, seems ridiculous if translated as DLJ suggests). I'm not suggesting that this bias is wrong (I would do the same), but let's not treat it as absolute.

My girlfriend is mad at me. Perhaps I shouldn't have tried cooking a stick in her non-stick pan.
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