Why I Believe
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12-04-2017, 01:15 PM
RE: Why I Believe
(12-04-2017 12:47 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 11:38 AM)SeaJay Wrote:  The thing is that I do still (just about) believe and I think that's primarily down to fear, which I am working on every day.

As I struggled with many, if not all, of the very things you so eloquently describe SeaJay there finally came a day when I crossed the Rubicon of “safety”.

Until that day I had struggled with the thought of, “How can God not save my soul even as I lose faith in Him, surely He must know the sincerity of my doubts.”

It was as though I had been walking a metaphysical tight-wire in my mind and fully believing that a safety net lay below me to catch me if I slipped and fell. Then on that day I looked down and realized that no net existed, it never had, and I had been making my way along my life’s journey without an invisible hand to catch me.

That moment was both frightening and liberating. I had made it this far I thought, not with the help of a god but with the help of my family and friends, through my own internal struggles and victories. The moment was not unlike hearing gunfire and explosions all around you and realizing that you were unscathed and unhurt.

Outwardly nothing had happened to me, but emotionally and intellectually I had set myself free like a beaten dog who one day breaks the chains tied to a stake in the ground. I stopped being confused and afraid, my life and everything and everyone around me came into sharp focus and life become more urgent. I found that I loved deeper than ever before.

Now that I only had to answer to myself I became my harshest critic, asking for forgiveness of no one but me and this has made me a more caring person, more aware of others and their struggles, and hopefully a more understanding human being. I think I am an infinitely better person than I used to be when I thought I could always be forgiven by a higher power because now I take full responsibility knowing that no safety net exists.

I am completely at peace with this. I know my life will end and the only things left will be the memories I create in others. With this in mind I constantly work on being kinder, more understanding, show my affections more often and go out of my way to help others. The rewards for me are immediate, just as when I fail to live up to my own expectations the punishment is immediate.

I do not fear death, what I fear is not helping and loving others to my fullest while I’m alive.

It is my hope that by sharing this you find a small morsel of insight that helps you through your own struggles and fears.

Good luck,
FC
Thanks for the reply Full Circle, very insightful

“I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying.” ~ Oscar Wilde
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12-04-2017, 01:17 PM
RE: Why I Believe
(12-04-2017 01:07 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 12:58 PM)SeaJay Wrote:  Interfering with life and tired of the cognitive dissonance

What are Gwynnies?

Gwynnies is the goddess. Although as atheists we are required to affirm that she does not exist, she qualifies under special exception paragraph 3 a "Minor deities of unquestionable benevolence". Plus she's hot.
Works for me!

“I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying.” ~ Oscar Wilde
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12-04-2017, 01:18 PM (This post was last modified: 12-04-2017 01:21 PM by Deesse23.)
RE: Why I Believe
(12-04-2017 01:05 PM)SeaJay Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 12:07 PM)Deesse23 Wrote:  Thumbsup Thumbsup Thumbsup

Thumbsup Thumbsup Thumbsup
But you have demonstrated that those experiences are no good evidence at all.

It is not very subjective. Lets approach this problem in small steps, aka with "salami tactics".
Is faith a good enough reason to believe in anything? Well, depends. What is the goal in your life? If it is something like "i want to believe as many true things as possible and as few false things as possible", then you are interested in someting like "truth" (not the "personal truth" bullshit, but the one and single truth about all things around us). True is what can be shown to be real. Is that good enough for you? Ok.
Back to faith. Is faith a good tool to find out what is true and false about anything? Well, since you can believe in about everything by faith alone, even things contradicting each other, it obviously is not a good tool to find out what is true about anything.
Can it be a good tool to believe in (any) god? Wink
Good post.

Faith isn't a good tool to believe in anything. I don't even have faith my wife loves me, I have confidence in the fact she loves me. I trust her too, but that's not really faith either
Thumbsup Thumbsup Thumbsup
Trust is based on previous experience and input called "data". It is rational to trust somebody/thing based on this.
Faith, well you already have explained that this is:
Quote:the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen
Believing in things just because you hope them to be true, that is irrational and not a good tool to find out what is true.

Example: I hope to own a million €. Ergo i believe (on faith) i own a million €. Boy, you dont have the slightest clue how hard i hoped for that to be true! *runs off to the nearest brothel in the hope of staying there for at least a year consecutively*

Do you think this was a good idea? Not the part with the brothel in patrticular, but the part about someting becoming true, because i hope for it?

Ceterum censeo, religionem delendam esse
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12-04-2017, 02:46 PM
RE: Why I Believe
(05-04-2017 05:40 AM)SeaJay Wrote:  Fear is the key. Not sure if anyone expected that answer, but it's true. For the most part fear is the key. I mean, it's not just fear, I do have a belief it is true. But here's the situation:

I have major issues with Christianity, from slavery, brutality, misogynistic practices, the need for a human sacrifice, the threat of an eternal agonising afterlife for some, the need for any of this. But I am scared of being wrong. I have a real phobia about going to hell. I feel trapped and as I see it, there are only two ways out for me.

1. To be convinced there is no hell (not possible – as we cannot say either way for sure)

2. To, not believe. All I will say is that I have major doubts. I'm having a real crisis of faith.

That was what kept me Christian for a good two years. I got to a point where I knew I didn't believe, but feared I was failing a test and would go to hell. It took six months past that point for me to get comfortable in my disbelief.

Also, you don't have to 100% disprove hell to not believe in it. Think about it this way; how much sleep have you lost that you're going to Muslim hell for not believing in Allah? Just because one of an infinite varieties of hell COULD exist doesn't mean it's worth fretting over.

I got a lot of peace of mind once I stopped worrying about other people's nonfalsifiable theories.
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12-04-2017, 03:19 PM
RE: Why I Believe
I wish, Girly, I wish. There ain't enough booze in the world (and I've been frightfully sober since what feels like forever. No wonder my mind's been trying to commit seppuku in my head Dodgy )

Keep dismantling it, SeaJay, bit by bit until it fall crumbles to the ground and you're left free. You'll get there.

(And faith (even if this is what my name actually means Rolleyes ) is the worst thing to base your entire life on. Not on something no one has ever seen anyway.)

"E se non passa la tristezza con altri occhi la guarderò."
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12-04-2017, 03:42 PM
RE: Why I Believe
(12-04-2017 03:19 PM)Vera Wrote:  I wish, Girly, I wish. There ain't enough booze in the world (and I've been frightfully sober since what feels like forever. No wonder my mind's been trying to commit seppuku in my head Dodgy )

Keep dismantling it, SeaJay, bit by bit until it fall crumbles to the ground and you're left free. You'll get there.

(And faith (even if this is what my name actually means Rolleyes ) is the worst thing to base your entire life on. Not on something no one has ever seen anyway.)

I just figured out that seppuku is not a form of bukakke. The more you know.

#sigh
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12-04-2017, 03:47 PM
RE: Why I Believe
Wow. With that outta the way, allow me to toss in one of my favorite youtubes everz.




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12-04-2017, 03:49 PM
RE: Why I Believe
(12-04-2017 03:42 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I just figured out that seppuku is not a form of bukakke. The more you know.

Laugh out loadLaugh out loadLaugh out load

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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12-04-2017, 03:56 PM
RE: Why I Believe
(12-04-2017 03:42 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I just figured out that seppuku is not a form of bukakke. The more you know.

And I know just enough *not* to google bukkake.

[Image: sumo.gif]

"E se non passa la tristezza con altri occhi la guarderò."
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12-04-2017, 03:59 PM
RE: Why I Believe
Do not use google to translate Girly

should be a forum rule. Angel

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