Poll: Do you believe in atheism?
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Why I Don't Believe in Atheism
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11-08-2014, 01:50 AM
RE: Why I Don't Believe in Atheism
Paul entered a life of incredible hardship as a Christian when he didn't need to. He had a successful career going on in Judaism as a Pharisee.
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11-08-2014, 01:52 AM
RE: Why I Don't Believe in Atheism
(11-08-2014 01:47 AM)hbl Wrote:  It's interesting that the two people Paul mentions in 1 Corinthians 15 and Galatians 1 are the first two original Apostles he met in Jerusalem after he had spent three years in Damascus. For two weeks in Jerusalem on a fact finding trip he met with Peter and James. We have good evidence in the gospels none of the brothers of Jesus believed he was the Messiah, until that day James saw Jesus resurrected. In fact, Jesus' brothers tried to goad him into a deathtrap by showing himself publically at a feast when they knew the Jewish leaders were trying to persecute and kill him. But then James emerges as one of pillars of the NT church and one of its leaders.

Even if Paul didn't mention James seeing Jesus resurrected, you would have to invent something to account for his transformation and leadership in the church. What would it take to make you believe your brother was the Lord if you didn't see him alive from the dead? He willingly went to his death in AD 67 by the Jewish Sanhedrin for his belief Jesus was Lord, Son of God, resurrected Messiah!

Bible is a claim, not evidence for the claim try again. Also Paul was a delusional and lying fucktard if he existed at all. Not a reliable source, keep trying son.
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11-08-2014, 01:53 AM
RE: Why I Don't Believe in Atheism
(11-08-2014 01:50 AM)hbl Wrote:  With John in the Temple Peter said, "You killed the author of life, but God raised him to life. And we are witnesses of this fact!" (Acts 3.15). Not just Peter, but "all the Apostles" (1 Cor. 15.7).

Again, Peter said, "Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly; Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead" (Acts 10.40-41). This verse does not say He showed Himself only to those who he ate and drank with before He died, but He ate and drank with those He appeared to after He was resurrected.

Made up. Keep trying.
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11-08-2014, 01:53 AM
RE: Why I Don't Believe in Atheism
(11-08-2014 01:50 AM)hbl Wrote:  Paul entered a life of incredible hardship as a Christian when he didn't need to. He had a successful career going on in Judaism as a Pharisee.

Nope.
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11-08-2014, 01:54 AM
RE: Why I Don't Believe in Atheism
Paul died in the Neronian persecution in 64-65 AD. Luke set forth the biography of Paul in Acts and his mission activities but makes no mention of his death. At the end of the book Paul had not yet died. So Acts had to have been written before his death. Had he died the author would have mentioned it especially considering Paul almost died seven times in the Scriptures. Death is important in a biography so that places Acts around 55 A.D.

Luke said in the book of Acts: "The former treatise have I made, O Theophilus, of all that Jesus began both to do and teach, Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen: To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God: And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me. For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence" (1.1-5).

The former treaty by Luke to Theophilus was the Gospel of Luke: "Forasmuch as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us, Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word; It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus, That thou mightest know the certainty of those things, wherein thou hast been instructed" (1.1-4).

We keep moving back from the 64-65 A.D. Since Acts was written about 55 A.D., Luke would be even earlier around 45 A.D. Even more, Luke took in part from Mark so that places Mark around 35 A.D. just 2 years after the cross. And Mark worked closely with Peter so that places Peter’s two books quite early as well. These primary sources are all within a decade or two after the cross exactly what historians like to see. Amen.

Cool!
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11-08-2014, 01:55 AM
RE: Why I Don't Believe in Atheism
What was the origin of the disciples’ beliefs? It couldn't have been the result of Christian influences for the simple reason, there wasn't any Christianity yet and they were the first believers. The origin of their beliefs can't be pagan such as Adonis and Osiris since the disciples don't make the claim they are attached to any of these mythical gods. Rather, they are just symbols for passage of the seasons. The god dies in the winter and comes back to life as a new crop in the spring. It would be simply unthinkable for the disciples to believe this is what Jesus meant. There is actually not only no causal relationship, but in first century Palestine these myths of dying and rising gods was a later invention added in, and the disciples had no contact with these sorts of things. Therefore, the best explanation is Jesus rose from the dead.
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11-08-2014, 01:56 AM
RE: Why I Don't Believe in Atheism
Quoting the Bible to prove the Bible, is like quoting the Koran to prove the Koran.

How come you aren't a Muslim hbl? The Koran says that Muhammad is the final prophet of your God, and you know it's true because it's in the Koran, and you can trust the Koran because the Koran says so.

Allahu Akbar hbl, Allahu Akbar... Drinking Beverage

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11-08-2014, 01:58 AM
RE: Why I Don't Believe in Atheism
To the best of my knowledge, there is nothing recorded in antiquity so close to the events that happened and number of sources. Therefore, it is holding the highest of standards of historical record. Jesus has 45 sources of Him within 150 years of His death. Tiberius died on just 4 years after Jesus and only had 9 sources. Actually, Jesus has more sources about Him than any ten figures from antiquity.

Paul said in Gal. 1 & 2 he met James and Peter a few years after the cross as indicated in 1 Cor. 15 in which he says he is delivering what he received from them. Scholars place his conversion two years after the cross. Galatians says it was "3 years" after his conversion he met James and Peter, so that's five years after the cross he met original eyewitness Apostles. And it's safe to say they talked about more than just the weather.

Altogether, there is Paul's writings, oral traditions in creeds, hymns and sermon summaries in various NT books, and writings of the early church fathers such as Polycarp and Clement of Rome who personally knew the Apostles John and Peter. Polycarp was a student of John and Clement of Rome was a friend of Peter. Clement is mentioned in the Bible in addition to extra-Biblical sources.
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11-08-2014, 02:00 AM
RE: Why I Don't Believe in Atheism
Now if so many people saw Jesus resurrected, is it really so hard to believe the saved will be resurrected at the consummation of the age of the dispensation of grace, the end of the mystery age of the Church? As Christians died with Christ we shall be resurrected in a resurrection like His. Even the unsaved will be resurrected though a thousand years later to the Great White Throne to be sentenced to burn for eternity in the Lake of Fire. They would rather burn and be tortured than to be saved by accepting Christ as their Savior.

Truly evil people!
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11-08-2014, 02:02 AM
RE: Why I Don't Believe in Atheism
(11-08-2014 01:54 AM)hbl Wrote:  Paul died in the Neronian persecution in 64-65 AD. Luke set forth the biography of Paul in Acts and his mission activities but makes no mention of his death. At the end of the book Paul had not yet died. So Acts had to have been written before his death. Had he died the author would have mentioned it especially considering Paul almost died seven times in the Scriptures. Death is important in a biography so that places Acts around 55 A.D.

Luke said in the book of Acts: "The former treatise have I made, O Theophilus, of all that Jesus began both to do and teach, Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen: To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God: And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me. For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence" (1.1-5).

The former treaty by Luke to Theophilus was the Gospel of Luke: "Forasmuch as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us, Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word; It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus, That thou mightest know the certainty of those things, wherein thou hast been instructed" (1.1-4).

We keep moving back from the 64-65 A.D. Since Acts was written about 55 A.D., Luke would be even earlier around 45 A.D. Even more, Luke took in part from Mark so that places Mark around 35 A.D. just 2 years after the cross. And Mark worked closely with Peter so that places Peter’s two books quite early as well. These primary sources are all within a decade or two after the cross exactly what historians like to see. Amen.

Cool!

That your fairytale agrees with its own narrative is not impressive, nor is it evidence, its not even interesting. Your desperation is showing.
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