Why I think the doctrine of Hell is problematic for Christianity
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22-12-2015, 12:21 PM
RE: Why I think the doctrine of Hell is problematic for Christianity
(22-12-2015 12:14 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(22-12-2015 11:52 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  If there was courses on religion, and test that gauged our understanding of the material, and we scored equally well, would that falsify your conclusion that I'm not rational on the subject?

No. Memorizing material says nothing about one's intelligence or ability to critically think and evaluate information. The fact that you could spout off a plethora of religious bullshit and the corresponding scripture, means only that you know how to memorize bullshit.

Who said anything about memorization? Memorization of the material and understanding of the material are not the same thing.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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22-12-2015, 12:31 PM
RE: Why I think the doctrine of Hell is problematic for Christianity
(22-12-2015 12:21 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(22-12-2015 12:14 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  No. Memorizing material says nothing about one's intelligence or ability to critically think and evaluate information. The fact that you could spout off a plethora of religious bullshit and the corresponding scripture, means only that you know how to memorize bullshit.

Who said anything about memorization? Memorization of the material and understanding of the material are not the same thing.

And all you keep proposing are instances where it is not possible to assess whether someone has memorized an answer or learned an answer. I am certain you are not so braindead as to be unable to take a class and memorize enough material to pass it, but that doesn't make you intelligent or capable of critical thought.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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22-12-2015, 12:33 PM
RE: Why I think the doctrine of Hell is problematic for Christianity
(22-12-2015 12:31 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(22-12-2015 12:21 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  Who said anything about memorization? Memorization of the material and understanding of the material are not the same thing.

And all you keep proposing are instances where it is not possible to assess whether someone has memorized an answer or learned an answer. I am certain you are not so braindead as to be unable to take a class and memorize enough material to pass it, but that doesn't make you intelligent or capable of critical thought.

What I am certain of though, is that you do not possess critical thinking skills or the ability to be logical or rational about any subject relating to religion. Because you are so biased in favor of your religious dogma, that you can see only special pleading arguments to propagate it. All while lying about your intentions Drinking Beverage

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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22-12-2015, 01:03 PM
RE: Why I think the doctrine of Hell is problematic for Christianity
(22-12-2015 09:58 AM)jennybee Wrote:  
(22-12-2015 09:33 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  God is talking to no one. The authors are putting words (their own ideas) in his mouth. It's called a "literary device".

There is no "person" named *Lucifer* in the Bible. It's actually a rather poetic term. It means something like the "daystar".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer

Agreed re: "the satan." I'm referring to Job 38 where God and Job are "talking." It's classified as "wisdom literature." I do think there are many interpretations to Job, but I like scholar Christine Hayes' take on it (at around the 25:00 mark).




That was an interesting video, so her take is God didn't want any moral accountability for bad things happening. Somehow having a world of God-driven moral accountability would cause humans to do good for a perceived reward system instead of from their own choice.

Of course! Wouldn't want us to behave better now, do we?

It's still a pathetic god that the writers portray, he washes his hands of everything that happens, the world plods on without his interference, just as he never existed.

The writers were trying to have their cake and eat it too, claiming an all powerful god that absolves himself from everything that happens. The world is what it is, therefore believe god and don't blame him for bad stuff. Facepalm

It seems they were somewhat aware of what a monster they constructed as they attempt to salvage their pathetic god concept at the end by writing about Job being restored.

This is one of the most repugnant stories in the bible.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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22-12-2015, 01:19 PM
RE: Why I think the doctrine of Hell is problematic for Christianity
(22-12-2015 12:31 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  And all you keep proposing are instances where it is not possible to assess whether someone has memorized an answer or learned an answer. I am certain you are not so braindead as to be unable to take a class and memorize enough material to pass it, but that doesn't make you intelligent or capable of critical thought.

I think you can test and gauge people's understanding of a topic, as opposed to memorization of the material. Perhaps in your particular major, someone who merely memorizes the material is able to do just as well as those who actually understood it?

In my major, the material, the test, were designed in a way that those who merely memorized the material wouldn't do well at all, you'd have to understand the material to do well.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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22-12-2015, 01:20 PM
RE: Why I think the doctrine of Hell is problematic for Christianity
(22-12-2015 01:19 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(22-12-2015 12:31 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  And all you keep proposing are instances where it is not possible to assess whether someone has memorized an answer or learned an answer. I am certain you are not so braindead as to be unable to take a class and memorize enough material to pass it, but that doesn't make you intelligent or capable of critical thought.

I think you can test and gauge people's understanding of a topic, as opposed to memorization of the material. Perhaps in your particular major, someone who merely memorizes the material is able to do just as well as those who actually understood it?

In my major, the material, the test, were designed in a way that those who merely memorized the material wouldn't do well at all, you'd have to understand the material to do well.

Your comprehension has been tested, as have your critical and skeptical thinking skills. You are a memorizer of religious doctrine with an inability to critically think.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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22-12-2015, 01:21 PM
RE: Why I think the doctrine of Hell is problematic for Christianity
(22-12-2015 01:20 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(22-12-2015 01:19 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  I think you can test and gauge people's understanding of a topic, as opposed to memorization of the material. Perhaps in your particular major, someone who merely memorizes the material is able to do just as well as those who actually understood it?

In my major, the material, the test, were designed in a way that those who merely memorized the material wouldn't do well at all, you'd have to understand the material to do well.

Your comprehension has been tested, as have your critical and skeptical thinking skills. You are a memorizer of religious doctrine with an inability to critically think.

And this is why your propositions of taking tests and/or classes to compare yourself to others, does not provide a measure of equality between you and others. You have already failed the tests of intelligence. Laughat

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
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22-12-2015, 01:23 PM
RE: Why I think the doctrine of Hell is problematic for Christianity
(22-12-2015 01:20 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  You are a memorizer of religious doctrine with an inability to critically think.

Ah okay, so I'm a memorizer of religious doctrine, while you and other atheists here understand religious doctrine?

Can you provide an example of a religious doctrine your understand, that I don't?

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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22-12-2015, 01:26 PM
RE: Why I think the doctrine of Hell is problematic for Christianity
(22-12-2015 01:23 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(22-12-2015 01:20 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  You are a memorizer of religious doctrine with an inability to critically think.

Ah okay, so I'm a memorizer of religious doctrine, while you and other atheists here understand religious doctrine?

Can you provide an example of a religious doctrine your understand, that I don't?

At what point did I ever claim that atheists "know" religious doctrine? Many atheists here have shown you that they have an understanding of comprehension of religious dogma, but this is irrelevant to me pointing out your stupidity.

What the fuck are you talking about? I have pointed out your inability to comprehend or critically evaluate any argument against your religious dogma.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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22-12-2015, 01:29 PM
RE: Why I think the doctrine of Hell is problematic for Christianity
(22-12-2015 01:26 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  What the fuck are you talking about? I have pointed out your inability to comprehend or critically evaluate any argument against your religious dogma.

Please, point out one argument against my religious dogma that you believe I can't comprehend.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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