Why Must Children Suffer? [The Astonishing Sequel]
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23-09-2013, 04:50 PM
RE: Why Must Children Suffer? [The Astonishing Sequel]
(23-09-2013 02:53 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  Stepping back further, is there a better way, rather than eternal punishment, for not having forgiveness for sins? {Fixed}

Fixed? Very cute.

Yes, there is a better way. You know that 'heaven' place you talk about, where we spend eternity in perfection (but never get bored)? It looks like god was indeed capable of creating a place without sin or suffering. With all the Stockholm Syndrome displayed by his followers, however, he doesn't really need to deliver a heaven. You'll make excuses for him until you're blue in the face. Heck, in the last few weeks I've learned that the Earth was smooth rolling hills and that we'd be bored without suffering, but not in heaven. Lol.

(23-09-2013 02:53 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  In that sense, yes. God chose to create someone knowing they will pick not just “heaven or hell” but one or the other. Yes. And? Not a problem if Hell is a reasonable punishment or Heaven a reasonable reward.

Not a problem until you try and sell free will. Even this simplest of dilemmas crumbles your arguments.

If Jesus died for our sins, why is there still sin? If man was created from dust, why is there still dust? If Americans came from Europe, why are there still Europeans?
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23-09-2013, 05:11 PM
 
RE: Why Must Children Suffer? [The Astonishing Sequel]
(23-09-2013 03:24 PM)morondog Wrote:  Do you reckon maybe God has a MetaGod... maybe that's why he's so dumb ? He spends all his intelligence and creativity trying to satisfy some super-being's arbitrary rules for his morality...

Would that mean that Jesus has a grandfather?

"Yo dawg... I heard you're very religious, so we created a god for your god, so you can worship while you worship."
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23-09-2013, 08:24 PM
RE: Why Must Children Suffer? [The Astonishing Sequel]
(23-09-2013 05:11 PM)Philosoraptor Wrote:  
(23-09-2013 03:24 PM)morondog Wrote:  Do you reckon maybe God has a MetaGod... maybe that's why he's so dumb ? He spends all his intelligence and creativity trying to satisfy some super-being's arbitrary rules for his morality...

Would that mean that Jesus has a grandfather?

"Yo dawg... I heard you're very religious, so we created a god for your god, so you can worship while you worship."


That god's name is Ao, the Overgod. He's just a metaphor for the DM... oh shit... Blink


What if we're all characters in a table top RPG and we don't know it... Weeping

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24-09-2013, 09:28 AM
RE: Why Must Children Suffer? [The Astonishing Sequel]
Quote: I've said multiple times that a god that gives a fuck is incompatible. That means, if you took the time to pull your head out of you ass to notice, that an not-benevolent god would be perfectly fine with allowing suffering. This does however fly in the face of mainstream Christology. The problem of Evil is not a problem for an asshole god, but most Christains can not or will not even contemplate such a thing for their god.

Okay so do you now admit that based on our universe, that if a god does exist, he's not a benevolent one? Because this is what I've been saying all along; that any god responsible for this universe, and if in possession of the limitless powers of creation, is a fucking asshole.

EK:

KC and I have both contemplated precisely that, actually. It’s a necessity when digesting all this free will and predestination stuff and Hell and etc. I think it’s fine to contemplate.

But have you received any grace (unmerited favor) in this universe? I mean, if I take your post as 100% your convictions, surely you would have killed yourself by now over all the meaninglessness and injustice out here “in this universe”.

Quote:That doesn't answer the question dickwad. The only universe we have to judge against your god claim is the one we have now, and the universe we have now is incompatible with an all powerful benevolent god. See above.

Are you calling me a name so I continue to view atheists as reasonable, level-headed people? It’s not helping. I cannot call you that name because I respect you as a person.

You are saying this time-space with no Heaven is not compatible with god’s benevolence. Yet I see god’s grace (unmerited favor) in action quite frequently. It sure sounds like your glass is (less than) half full. What am I not understanding about you personally?

Quote: Not making Hell, as a place of infinite punishment is the exact opposite of what we would expect from a remotely intelligent being; let alone an all-knowing, all-powerful, and (as many claim) all-benevolent god. Also unless you can prove Hell actually exists, you can't claim warning us away from it as a defense for suffering in this universe, because Hell hasn't been proven to exist in this universe. Suffering cannot be justified in avoiding Hell the way you are attempting, if Hell is simply a lie.

Hell is not a place of infinite punishment.

Quote: You're logic is broken. You cannot make the jump from 'I am suffering from starvation/rape/injury/disease/malnutrition/whatever' to 'therefore a god exists and he cares about me'. If you think that jump makes sense, we'd all be better off if you let your house plants type your forum posts from now on.

You’re right, that is a jump. Tell me, if free will exists, wouldn’t it be more accurate to say “god causes some suffering and people cause some suffering”?

Quote: Any warning would not be necessary, as your creator god could have made knowledge of his existence/rules/expectations innate to us, but he choose not too. Funny how he seemingly 'choose' to make all of these problem in believing in the one true god of all of creation, seems like he fucked the pooch on that one. That you can't think of better solution to avoiding Hell than 'plague/famine/disease/war/rape/suffering', once again, speak of your staggering lack of imagination. We have to keep coming back to this, you couldn't imagine your way out of an imaginary paper bag...

But god did no such thing, making the problems roll up into “believing in the one true god”. The problems and their solutions lie in the realms of sin and righteousness.

Quote: I don't need any more examples to further prove just how much of a fucking mental slave you are. You are a sick in the head, sad little man.

Well, it sounds as though you’ve concluded that 100% of suffering is pointless and meaningless. So, what will you do if you should personally experience suffering?
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24-09-2013, 09:31 AM
 
RE: Why Must Children Suffer? [The Astonishing Sequel]
PleaseJesus, today you've started earlier than usual - are you slacking off at work maybe? Big Grin
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24-09-2013, 09:50 AM
RE: Why Must Children Suffer? [The Astonishing Sequel]
(19-09-2013 02:36 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  Pj... Your examples of "suffering is good" require there to be a creation of Worse suffering. (or something worse than suffering)

Your hell warning example is essentially: some suffering is a good because it can warn you from his worse suffering.

Notice this, God created that hell.. Him creating a path to avoid hell isn't an example of being good or need of suffering. THERE IS NO NEED FOR HELL.

You say you have examples that would bore... Maybe using examples that explain better than just arguing in denial for tons of posts.

Let me ask you, do you have an example where God making suffering is good, which doesn't require something God created that's worse to be involved?

Not suffering to overcome pain or suffering to learn to avoid hell... Maybe if you could, you would actually have a point.

I don't follow. There is a need for Hell if the Bible rubric re: sin and justice is factual.

However, you raise an interesting point. It sounds like you feel suffering is wrong, and I mean literally, you feel that. Do you believe all truth is rooted in logic and facts or may some truths be felt as well?
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24-09-2013, 09:53 AM
RE: Why Must Children Suffer? [The Astonishing Sequel]
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24-09-2013, 09:53 AM
RE: Why Must Children Suffer? [The Astonishing Sequel]
(24-09-2013 09:31 AM)Philosoraptor Wrote:  PleaseJesus, today you've started earlier than usual - are you slacking off at work maybe? Big Grin

No, god told me in an audible voice that you would be reading my posts today and learning new things, and to thus serve you.
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24-09-2013, 10:12 AM
RE: Why Must Children Suffer? [The Astonishing Sequel]
Well. We all knew he was nuts. And he just admitted it.
Hopefully when Jebus tell him to kill his kids, as he did all the other insane
people who experience auditory hallucinations, someone will put him in the straight jacket he needs. Jebus is lard. Halleluiah. Amen.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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24-09-2013, 10:32 AM
RE: Why Must Children Suffer? [The Astonishing Sequel]
So your god creates people for the sole purpose of having them inflict pain on others and then go to hell?

Pretty nasty, no?

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