Why Only Christianity?
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03-08-2011, 03:45 PM (This post was last modified: 03-08-2011 03:49 PM by angry_liberal.)
RE: Why Only Christianity?
(03-08-2011 03:39 PM)monkeyshine89 Wrote:  
(03-08-2011 03:32 PM)angry_liberal Wrote:  
(03-08-2011 02:52 PM)monkeyshine89 Wrote:  
Quote:Seems quite a bit more likley than a new Universe forming every time a quantum event orccurs with multiple possibiliteis. (which it always is)

um... what? Is this a personal theory or do you have ANY evidence for that claim? I'm sorry but this last part is absolutely incoherent, it seems as if you threw a couple of big 'sciencey' words together randomly.

The OP is referring to the a well known but currently untestable theory. Personally I find it rather unattractive. However this does not really scratch my atheism, since what we do know for more or less certain hangs together a lot better than any form of theism - even those accomodating to science like the OP's.

Now that I look at it, it does seem a little more familiar. This particular multiverse theory just seems a bit...odd to me. Then again I'm not a physicist. Is this a well accepted theory? Because to me it seems a lot like theoretical musing.

At the moment yes it is just a load of theoretical musing. However physics always has been in some ways. Someone puts together a theory as to how the universe works. The next generation work out a way of testing the theory. The theory lasts for a bit (about 400 years in Newton's case) until something crops up that it cannot explain. So the search starts for a more refined theory and so the cycle continues. At the moment the accepted theories (quantum mechanics, general relativity) have flaws (integrating gravity and quantum mechanics is the biggie), and the more refined theories (1001 varieties of string theory) look just about testable. But the multiverse stuff as it stands is untestable.
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03-08-2011, 03:52 PM
RE: Why Only Christianity?
See that's where me and theoretical physics just part ways. I've never been a fan of 'think up crazy shit and let's look for evidence to back it up after I made a conclusion'. Personally I'm more of a fan of applied science, but theoretical science has made some awesome contributions to our everyday life as well.

IDK, perhaps I'm just not enough of a brilliant mathematician/physicist to 'get' the theory. However in it's plain form it just seems like a lot of assumptions based on nothing.

I guess in the end, let the egg heads talk about crazy stuff, it's not hurting anyone.

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03-08-2011, 03:57 PM
RE: Why Only Christianity?
(03-08-2011 03:52 PM)monkeyshine89 Wrote:  See that's where me and theoretical physics just part ways. I've never been a fan of 'think up crazy shit and let's look for evidence to back it up after I made a conclusion'. Personally I'm more of a fan of applied science, but theoretical science has made some awesome contributions to our everyday life as well.

IDK, perhaps I'm just not enough of a brilliant mathematician/physicist to 'get' the theory. However in it's plain form it just seems like a lot of assumptions based on nothing.

I guess in the end, let the egg heads talk about crazy stuff, it's not hurting anyone.

Well I got bored with physics for a time after people started looking at the structure of quarks and when string theory seemed to go nowhere. But when I found theologians trying to use it arguments, I felt I needed to get upto speed.
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03-08-2011, 04:10 PM
RE: Why Only Christianity?
You're a better person then me for that, although I like to keep somewhat up on the world of physics and science (though not enough it seems), I'm not that vested to go research new theories to keep up with the insanity of apologetic. All it will leave me is a better understand of physics, but total hair loss (from pulling it out in frustration).

Nah, it's just best for me to claim ignorance on the more complex theories and pass it along to you guys Wink

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03-08-2011, 08:27 PM
RE: Why Only Christianity?
I don't see any threat from the theologians. They're generally too lazy and complacent to learn more than a couple of buzz-words, and the way they apply those would only convince a moron.... which, i guess is what they consider their standard audience.
Anyway, what they seem to come up with is some version of:
"The universe is so big and so much weird shit is going on out there that nobody fully understands, how can you be sure some of it isn't our kind of weird shit? Gotcha!"

If you pray to anything, you're prey to anything.
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03-08-2011, 10:20 PM
RE: Why Only Christianity?
(03-08-2011 09:11 AM)An_Actual_Theist Wrote:  Why is it that every post I see is about disproving Christianity? Nobbodyon here has ever discussed other valid forms of Theism. For example, what I believe in, an omnipotent being that controls the outcome of quantum events to work his/her/its will on the Universe.

There are 21 major religions in the modern world. There are 38,000 different sects of Christianity alone. Including the deities of the ancient Greeks, Romans, Egyptians, Chinese, Japanese, Aztecs, Norse, Mayans, and so on and so on, etc and the different personal definitions of each one of those deities... there are hundreds of thousands of "gods" that exist in human history. And since none of those deities have ever been proven false (that's the beauty of being an invisible god), they are just as likely to exist as our popular, modern ones.

So to try and address each god equally would be futile. So we choose the gods that affect our lives. Most of us are Americans, so we rip apart Jesus and Jehovah and their gay-bashing, child-molesting ways. The few of us from the middle east or familiar with Islam do what we can to expose Allah and his child-rapist sidekick Mohammed with the same ridiculous paintbrush. Other than that, I'm not constantly being suicide bombed by Buddhists, so I don't care to address it.

If it really bothers you, present the case for "your" deity and we'll gladly discuss his attributes, morals, and proof of evidence.

"Ain't got no last words to say, yellow streak right up my spine. The gun in my mouth was real and the taste blew my mind."

"We see you cry. We turn your head. Then we slap your face. We see you try. We see you fail. Some things never change."
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04-08-2011, 02:05 AM (This post was last modified: 04-08-2011 02:15 AM by Lilith Pride.)
RE: Why Only Christianity?
Generally we discuss Bhuddism positively. I've not seen many times where Bhuddism is brought up and we ready the pitchforks.

As was said by my like-minded associate MonkeyShine, "valid religion"? Religion is pretty much what you accept in order to avoid thinking about really complex and useless crap. You accept that god is in control of X so that you don't have to think about X. Almost all of the religions fulfill this just fine. The Greeks didn't really feel that the gods were controlling that much, and a few religions don't have gods at all.

I'm one of the many oppressed by christians, and if you would like the root cause for us to be so anti-christian here. Seth, The Thinkining Atheist, was a christian and makes silly videos denouncing his former religion along with podcasts and blogs. It's only natural that the people who would join a forum linked to a denouncer of christianity would focus on christianity. We have some people of different religions, but Seth doesn't really inspire complaints about muslims so much, or jainists (all religions are just as valid =p).

And on the topic of Jainism, how exactly do you succeed in not harming any life, if you eat plants? Plants are alive. To truly succeed in fully not destroying life you better start eating rocks and hope they don't have algae on them. Another question on Jainism. How does Jainism accept that fact that the body is a complex system of smaller organisms, and every action we as the complex organism takes kills countless smaller forms of life? I would think that science makes Jainism impossible. Obviously if plants don't count as life to you, then you're being biased.

Quote:wikipedia
All living beings require food for their survival. Jains practice strict vegetarianism. The practice of vegetarianism is instrumental for the practice of non-violence and peaceful co-operative co-existence. Basic non-violence principles can be performed depending on one's capability and specific situation in terms of meeting one's life's demands and expectations. Jainism acknowledges that it is impossible to discharge one's duties without some degree of himsa/violence, but encourages to minimise as much as possible.Jains are strictly forbidden to use any leather products since they are derived by merciless and inhumane killing of animals. Jains usually do not consume root vegetables such as potatoes, garlic, onions, carrots, radishes, cassava, sweet potatoes, turnips, etc., as the plant needed to be killed in the process of accessing these prior to their end of life cycle. In addition, the root vegetables interact with soil and therefore contain far more micro-organisms than other vegetables. However, they consume rhizomes such as dried turmeric and dried ginger. Brinjals are also not consumed by some Jains owing to the large number of seeds in the vegetable, as a seed is a form of life. Some Jains do not consume food left overnight because of contamination by microbes. Most Jain recipes substitute potato with plantain.

I guess this could be an answer to the question, but I just don't see limiting as the same as not doing.

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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04-08-2011, 05:57 PM
RE: Why Only Christianity?
(03-08-2011 10:20 PM)Buddy Christ Wrote:  Most of us are Americans, so we rip apart Jesus and Jehovah and their gay-bashing, child-molesting ways. The few of us from the middle east or familiar with Islam do what we can to expose Allah and his child-rapist sidekick Mohammed with the same ridiculous paintbrush. Other than that, I'm not constantly being suicide bombed by Buddhists, so I don't care to address it.

Yeah, that. And besides Jesus was a Buddha anyways.

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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05-08-2011, 08:18 AM
 
RE: Why Only Christianity?
(03-08-2011 09:21 AM)lucradis Wrote:  I would like to hear more about your beliefs if you wouldn't mind writing some more.

This is more speculation then anything, but I think that creation of like was influenced by God, and that our conscious minds are just little pieces of God that return to become part of hom, who is essentially a universal conscience, when we die.

(03-08-2011 09:57 AM)Sus Barbatus Wrote:  
(03-08-2011 09:11 AM)An_Actual_Theist Wrote:  Why is it that every post I see is about disproving Christianity? Nobbodyon here has ever discussed other valid forms of Theism. For example, what I believe in, an omnipotent being that controls the outcome of quantum events to work his/her/its will on the Universe.

Seems quite a bit more likley than a new Universe forming every time a quantum event orccurs with multiple possibiliteis. (which it always is)

Thoughts?

First of all, the arguments supporting the God of Islam, for example, are just as ridiculous as the arguments supporting the God of Christianity, (which I suppose could be argued as the same God). The reason why I, personally, talk more about Christianity is simply because that's what I'm surrounded by more than anything else, as an American living in the midwest.

Having said that, I think you'll find that most atheists here will be happy to point out why any belief in a god or gods, be it deist, pantheist, or theist is completely absurd and contrary to reality and/or completely unnecessary.

Your belief sounds, at the very least and by the little information you've given, to fit into the latter category as of right now. Completely unnecessary. But like the above poster I'm open to hearing you elaborate.

If YOU actually understood what I am saying, you would realize that God is more of a necessity in this case then a fact. Watch this video (below) to get an explanation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfPeprQ7oGc
The two schools of thought are either the universe multiples into two every time electrons have to make a "choice". And I do not think that spontaneous creation of matter and energy is more likely then a universal conscience, a.k.a God.

(03-08-2011 01:08 PM)The_observer Wrote:  Douchebag mode engaged!
(03-08-2011 09:11 AM)An_Actual_Theist Wrote:  For example, what I believe in, an omnipotent being that controls the outcome of quantum events to work his/her/its will on the Universe.
Try and prove that it exists, then build physical means of worship around it with strong influence into society and/or politics! If not, your deity is nothing more then a hypothesis, mainly harmless and part of your personal freedom.
Douchebag mode disengaged!


Welcome to the forums by the way. I wish you a pleasant and insightful stay. Smile
I might not have to prove it, that will be done or not for me. There are actually a lot of scientists who believe in "my" God. Thanks.

(03-08-2011 02:10 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  
(03-08-2011 09:11 AM)An_Actual_Theist Wrote:  Why is it that every post I see is about disproving Christianity? Nobbodyon here has ever discussed other valid forms of Theism.

If it's a valid form, it's probably been discussed. If it has sociopolitical relevance, it has probably been discussed exhaustively.

Quote: For example, what I believe in, an omnipotent being that controls the outcome of quantum events to work his/her/its will on the Universe.

Tell us more and it will probably be discussed.

Quote:Seems quite a bit more likley than a new Universe forming every time a quantum event orccurs with multiple possibiliteis. (which it always is)

Thoughts?

My first thought on this: "Wha...?" is closely followed by "How would we know it had happened? Even how-er would we know that it will/might/must happen [?again]" But i'm willing to discuss it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfPeprQ7oGc is where I learned abbout this from. Anyone can understand it, really.
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05-08-2011, 10:49 AM
RE: Why Only Christianity?
(03-08-2011 09:11 AM)An_Actual_Theist Wrote:  Why is it that every post I see is about disproving Christianity? Nobbodyon here has ever discussed other valid forms of Theism. For example, what I believe in, an omnipotent being that controls the outcome of quantum events to work his/her/its will on the Universe.

Seems quite a bit more likley than a new Universe forming every time a quantum event orccurs with multiple possibiliteis. (which it always is)

Thoughts?

Isn't that deism or pandeism?



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