Why Prayers Aren't Answered
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16-05-2017, 03:56 PM
RE: Why Prayers Aren't Answered
(16-05-2017 03:45 PM)ColdComfort Wrote:  
(16-05-2017 02:38 PM)morondog Wrote:  Can you cite an example of something that is demonstrably an answered prayer?

Not in detail. It's never happened to me but I don't tend to ask for things. Every time Rome canonizes a saint, except martyrs, careful investigation is made of cures after an individual prayers for one. I know the answer 1) They are liars 2) How do you know it was God even if doctors can't find an explanation. The answer to 1) They are not 2) You can't with certainty I suppose.

Er... they are not liars because you trust them not to lie? I have heard of this vatican miracle review process before... funnily enough I can't recall any major news headlines about confirmed miracles recently...? I mean surely pretty much everyone would be interested in it?

OK so lets say a miracle occurs and Johnny gets cured of cancer. I still fail to see how a giant invisible being who somehow cares about Johnny but not millions of other kids is a reasonable explanation for this. It would help if God would stick a great big sign up every time he did something "It was me, your humble Lord and Saviour. I stopped the war." But instead all we have is post-hoc explanations of events that seem to be perfectly explainable without a deity.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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16-05-2017, 03:59 PM
RE: Why Prayers Aren't Answered
(16-05-2017 02:48 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Actually JESUS said, if one asked for ANYTHING in his name, it would be granted.
John 14:14
"You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it."

Apparently this one thinks he knows better than Jesus.
See my signature. Tongue

I'll do anything if you stop cherry picking bible verses. Read the preceding verse at least.
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16-05-2017, 04:01 PM
RE: Why Prayers Aren't Answered
(16-05-2017 03:53 PM)ColdComfort Wrote:  The proposition I'm contending with is God will give you anything you ask for.
I can't derive much from it.Can you elaborate.
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16-05-2017, 04:02 PM
RE: Why Prayers Aren't Answered
(16-05-2017 03:45 PM)ColdComfort Wrote:  
(16-05-2017 02:38 PM)morondog Wrote:  Can you cite an example of something that is demonstrably an answered prayer?

Not in detail. It's never happened to me but I don't tend to ask for things. Every time Rome canonizes a saint, except martyrs, careful investigation is made of cures after an individual prayers for one. I know the answer 1) They are liars 2) How do you know it was God even if doctors can't find an explanation. The answer to 1) They are not 2) You can't with certainty I suppose.

Actually that's not true.
It's "prays for one", not "prayers for one".
Rome doesn't require answered prayers for canonization.
They require miracles, not answered prayers. The number of them has changed recently. Sometimes things don't work out too well, and the miracle cure ain't really what they thought.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/john-paul-ii...rutinized/

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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16-05-2017, 04:11 PM
RE: Why Prayers Aren't Answered
(16-05-2017 03:56 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(16-05-2017 03:45 PM)ColdComfort Wrote:  Not in detail. It's never happened to me but I don't tend to ask for things. Every time Rome canonizes a saint, except martyrs, careful investigation is made of cures after an individual prayers for one. I know the answer 1) They are liars 2) How do you know it was God even if doctors can't find an explanation. The answer to 1) They are not 2) You can't with certainty I suppose.

Er... they are not liars because you trust them not to lie? I have heard of this vatican miracle review process before... funnily enough I can't recall any major news headlines about confirmed miracles recently...? I mean surely pretty much everyone would be interested in it?

OK so lets say a miracle occurs and Johnny gets cured of cancer. I still fail to see how a giant invisible being who somehow cares about Johnny but not millions of other kids is a reasonable explanation for this. It would help if God would stick a great big sign up every time he did something "It was me, your humble Lord and Saviour. I stopped the war." But instead all we have is post-hoc explanations of events that seem to be perfectly explainable without a deity.

That too is another issue. Why God cures some and not others? Fast answer is death is not the worst thing that can happen to someone for Christians. In fact, everyone dies. It's our eternal fate that is at issue.

Yes I do trust them. Not blindly. I've read about the procedures they follow.

Why is everything but the kitchen sink being thrown at me? I said the Bible or any other source of Christian faith does not say 'God will give you anything you ask for'. Now you're asking me why God doesn't communicate on CNN.
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16-05-2017, 04:16 PM
RE: Why Prayers Aren't Answered
Never mind what the Bible says (as unfogged noted, you can quote the Bible to support just about anything). I take a common-sense approach to this question.

The almighty, all-knowing creator of the universe, who already knows everything that's ever going to happen, is going to change his plans because little old me asks him to?

Laugh out loadLaugh out loadLaugh out loadLaugh out loadLaugh out load

Fat chance.
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16-05-2017, 04:21 PM
RE: Why Prayers Aren't Answered
(16-05-2017 03:48 PM)ColdComfort Wrote:  
(16-05-2017 03:12 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  Why are you pretending to ignore the millions of evangelicals that believe this?

Maybe you are the wacked-out Christian, or the One True Scotsman.

I'm not pretending. I've never heard an evangelical say God will give you anything you ask for. If I'm wrong, and there are millions who believe that, they are wrong.
Opinions are like assholes and all that. Drinking Beverage

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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16-05-2017, 04:21 PM
RE: Why Prayers Aren't Answered
(16-05-2017 04:02 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(16-05-2017 03:45 PM)ColdComfort Wrote:  Not in detail. It's never happened to me but I don't tend to ask for things. Every time Rome canonizes a saint, except martyrs, careful investigation is made of cures after an individual prayers for one. I know the answer 1) They are liars 2) How do you know it was God even if doctors can't find an explanation. The answer to 1) They are not 2) You can't with certainty I suppose.

Actually that's not true.
It's "prays for one", not "prayers for one".
Rome doesn't require answered prayers for canonization.
They require miracles, not answered prayers. The number of them has changed recently. Sometimes things don't work out too well, and the miracle cure ain't really what they thought.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/john-paul-ii...rutinized/

I was aware of that one in a general way because it involved a Pope. Not sure what the article is saying. You have to wait until she dies in case the illness returns? She may have has ALS or something but not Parkinsons? The article does say the cure was complete and instantaneous. Seven years ago too. Any update?
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16-05-2017, 04:26 PM
RE: Why Prayers Aren't Answered
(16-05-2017 04:21 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  
(16-05-2017 03:48 PM)ColdComfort Wrote:  I'm not pretending. I've never heard an evangelical say God will give you anything you ask for. If I'm wrong, and there are millions who believe that, they are wrong.
Opinions are like assholes and all that. Drinking Beverage

Show me evidence of these millions. Admittedly I don't move in evangelical circles but if what you say is true you must be able to show some evidence. They would still be wrong likely relying on the cherry picking I see here.
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16-05-2017, 04:32 PM
RE: Why Prayers Aren't Answered
(16-05-2017 03:59 PM)ColdComfort Wrote:  
(16-05-2017 02:48 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Actually JESUS said, if one asked for ANYTHING in his name, it would be granted.
John 14:14
"You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it."

Apparently this one thinks he knows better than Jesus.
See my signature. Tongue

I'll do anything if you stop cherry picking bible verses. Read the preceding verse at least.

I know it well. It changes nothing. It's YOU that's cherry-picking your verses. Jesus SAID he would give anything asked in his name. YOU contradicted him what Jesus SAID.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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