Why are creationists so against evolution?
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11-05-2015, 06:37 PM
RE: Why are creationists so against evolution?
(07-05-2015 07:21 PM)peacefrog Wrote:  ...the evidence would lead scientists to...
That's the problem right there.

Creationism (and religion in general) is the opposite of science. Its anti-science

With Science all hypothesis need to be falsifiable and require supporting evidence and require a skeptical challenge.

With religion all ideas need to be unfalsifiable, need to not be able to be assessed via evidence, need acceptance rather than skepticism. When the head boffins sit around the table and concoct an idea like transubstantiation, they make damn sure that it will never be verifiable before they then preach it to the sheep.

"blessed are those who have not seen and yet believe"
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12-05-2015, 12:00 AM
RE: Why are creationists so against evolution?
(11-05-2015 06:37 PM)Stevil Wrote:  "blessed are those who have not seen and yet believe"

I can remember being told as a kid not to be such a "doubting Thomas"... He was the only schmuck outta alla those schmucks who had a grain of common sense. Anyway, the magic fairy granted his request. When I doubted there wasn't *nobody* who appeared outta thin air and encouraged me to stick my finger in them...

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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12-05-2015, 03:13 AM
RE: Why are creationists so against evolution?
(07-05-2015 07:26 PM)jennybee Wrote:  
(07-05-2015 07:21 PM)peacefrog Wrote:  Of course, the answer to us is obvious. But firm their perspective, why are they so opposed to investigating it? Why do they not believe that, if creationism was true, the evidence would lead scientists to that conclusion?

They are afraid kids will be swayed by science (instead of the science fiction that is found in the Bible) and leave their faith (which would cause their children to wind up in hell). Christians will often cite incidences where science has changed over time as new information/discoveries have been brought into the fold. Christians believe that science one day will be proven wrong and the Bible will win out in the end.

But the ultimate Irony is... The only thing that can prove science wrong is SCIENCE.

Same as Piltdown man. The religious can't wait to point out how it was a fraud etc, while at the same time conveniently forgetting that religion didn't prove it to be incorrect... Science proved it to be incorrect.

Either way, science gives the religious people the facts that they try to use against science.

My head hurts now.
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13-05-2015, 10:13 AM
RE: Why are creationists so against evolution?
[Image: 2013-04-09.jpg]

Don't Live each day like it's your last. Live each day like you have 541 days after that one where every choice you make will have lasting implications to you and the world around you. ~ Tim Minchin
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28-06-2015, 10:21 PM
RE: Why are creationists so against evolution?
Would you like some scientific evidence against evolution? Try this; it is impossible. What you see in animals that change over time is adaptation, an ability of advanced life forms ( and some not so advanced). Life should certainly have had no problem organizing all of the necessary parts to create a self replicating organism, right? Impossible!. How can I say this? All creatures, no matter how simple, are made up of all of their needed parts in order to exist. If any one needed part is not there, the organism ceases to be. In other words, each animal, cell, creature, in existence, is a coordinated system, with all of it's parts working together for the life of the whole. A system CAN NOT EVOLVE! Each part of the creature had to start off life all at once since each part of the creature needs the support of all of the other parts AT ONCE or the organism never sees life for the first time. Said again another way; without the support of all of the parts that make a complete whole, all of them have to begin at the same time. Would you still think that it takes years to complete the process? Again I say impossible! A half formed organism would never have the time to wait for all of the needed parts to arrive before that creature ever got a start. This applies to the simplest cells. Each cell requires thousands of chemical reactions and processes to operate simultaneously in order for that cell to have its start. Once they do, they also have to operate within a complete set of operating instructions so each part can be reproduced at a later time. Could millions of bits of instructions just be waiting around in the environment for the happen-chance arrangement to be perfected before establishing reproduction? What could possibly be the reason for those astronomical odds and chance just be waiting around for the first available cell to jump into? No reason at all could explain how reproduction could get it's start this way, especially when the first cells did not even have all of it's parts ready yet in order to survive. Accidental arrangements do not happen. You would have to expect that in-numerable atomic reactions and connections to happen to organize an incredibly complex system that could support life, with absolutely no reason, to make ANYTHING AT ALL! The intelligent design argument means that all of these reactions would happen at one time so that all of the independent parts could support each other for life.
It's amazing to me to think that all of our reasoning about evolution begins backwards-intelligent creatures that have the ability to reproduce, change over time, adapt to suit their environment as times and places change, all of this getting people to believe that it must have started this way. If the ideas currently accepted for evolution are true, they have to work for everything right from the beginning. No evolutionist starts from the beginning-that's bio-genesis don't you see. That certainly can have nothing to do with evolution. The beginning of life should establish the pattern by which all life exists. Let's establish the needed life parameters right from the start and advance from there. That is the problem with conventional thinking on this subject. Simple parts do not gather together to make anything called life. Remember, a system can not evolve. All of the needed parts have to be assembled together at the same moment for life to start. If a key component in a cell is not there yet, there is no life, and non- life can't reproduce to make more non-life.
This concept of life's beginnings is certainly a shock to those whose faith is in the scientist who does everything in his power to prove to us that God can not exist. I say, think again. Maybe the Biblical events that speak of creation are figurative, and not precise in any scientific way, it still can contain some general themes for us to think about when we wonder where we came from.
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28-06-2015, 10:53 PM
RE: Why are creationists so against evolution?
(10-05-2015 09:48 PM)Shadow Fox Wrote:  because if Genesis; the very foundation on which the bible is built upon is false-than that would open up the rest of the bible to being wrong which would mean that there is no such thing as god and we do not have an afterlife. Meaning that the worst fears that we as humans have, namely the fear of death-comes to realization that it really is the end for us and we do not have a continuation afterwards; and they are afraid.
That kind of reasoning does not work well in analyzing the Bible. 2nd Corinthians Ch.3 talks about the blindness that people had in the old testament in regards to the methods and teachings of Christ. Paul repeats himself twice about the blindness of people who are putting their beliefs in the O.T. Christ did not teach us to kill, but to forgive our enemies. Jesus will not change a standard such as; love your enemies as yourself, if He had the intention of throwing anyone into hell or killing them later on. I know that the old and new are completely opposite in their discourses on the nature of God. God can not be the way that He is portrayed in the old if Jesus is correct. Jesus said; do not throw stones at the lady caught in adultery. He didn't want imperfect people thinking that it was a good thing to do those commands of Moses; kill the adulterers. Most Christians don't read enough of their own book to find these things.
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28-06-2015, 11:30 PM
RE: Why are creationists so against evolution?
Welcome to TTA, RDK.

I'm looking forward to the educating and enlightening posts that are soon to follow.

This is my prophecy.

Big Grin

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28-06-2015, 11:33 PM
RE: Why are creationists so against evolution?
Hello RDK! Big Grin

First, try putting gaps and spaces in some of your longer posts, it will help others with comprehending them.

Second, I look forwards to those more knowledgeable in the subject of evolution coming along and correcting a lot of your poor understanding of the subject.

Third, before you begin using something as a reference, perhaps you should provide something to support the thing your using as a reference.

Fourth, I look forwards to GWG coming along and providing more knowledge on the subject of the thing you're using as resource/reference material.

In both cases, both evolution and the bible, said other posts are always interesting and informative.

Much cheers to all.
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29-06-2015, 12:05 AM
RE: Why are creationists so against evolution?
RDK, you don't seem to have a very firm grasp of how evolution actually works.
I'm no expert by any stretch of the imagination, but you seem confused by the distinction between evolution and abiogenesis as well.
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29-06-2015, 01:08 AM
RE: Why are creationists so against evolution?
(28-06-2015 10:21 PM)RDK Wrote:  Would you like some scientific evidence against evolution? Try this; it is impossible.
Argument from incredulity.
Quote:All creatures, no matter how simple, are made up of all of their needed parts in order to exist. If any one needed part is not there, the organism ceases to be. In other words, each animal, cell, creature, in existence, is a coordinated system, with all of it's parts working together for the life of the whole.
I agree, it is amazing how complex systems such as living organisms appear to be designed.
Until Darwin came along, many intellectuals were convinced the complexity must have come from god. Even Darwin was of this opinion, until he started to investigate nature and inheretance. Now 100+ years later we have heaps and heaps and heaps of supporting scientific evidence.
Quote:Could millions of bits of instructions just be waiting around in the environment for the happen-chance arrangement to be perfected before establishing reproduction?
No, that would seem highly unlikely.
Quote: What could possibly be the reason for those astronomical odds and chance just be waiting around for the first available cell to jump into?

Perhaps those structures better able to utilise the resources and better able to replicate (even in a very crude and primitive way) had an advantage and were able to proliferate more than those structures less suited.
Perhaps over time, competition for the limited resources ensured those structures which were randomly better suited could out replicate those that were good performers of yesteryear but poor performers in comparison to today's competitors. Perhaps this competition went on for hundreds of millions of years, hundreds of millions of generations...?
Perhaps even an eye could evolve, or a wing, or gills or lungs, sounds cool huh?

Quote:Maybe the Biblical events that speak of creation are figurative, and not precise in any scientific way, it still can contain some general themes for us to think about when we wonder where we came from.
The bible is not of any interest to me. However evolution is interesting, we could talk about that.
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