Why are people so convinced that they've heard/seen a deity?
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16-12-2013, 07:26 PM
RE: Why are people so convinced that they've heard/seen a deity?
(16-12-2013 07:13 PM)sporehux Wrote:  I actually know several people who claim to have had a personal "experience" with god or Jesus.
With this sample I can say that none of them are lying, at least not consciously.
But along with their subconscious pulling confirmation bias strings and pissing logic out the window, it also prevents them from exploring the "experience".

From the mouth of two of them (after i badgered them) , "I know what I experienced, who am i to question its authenticity".
Sometimes I think that is all it takes to be an Atheist, that is to question the motivation of ones self conscious.

My mother thinks she had an encounter with angels.
She's probably not lying about her "experience."

For someone to even want to understand something they do have to willingly question their beliefs...It's like a trap- If you question anything then you are immediately betraying the deity but if you don't question you may not know what you are missing out on.

I admire those who have at least tried to understand what's beyond their faith. It must be difficult.
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16-12-2013, 07:28 PM
RE: Why are people so convinced that they've heard/seen a deity?
(16-12-2013 07:19 PM)Cardinal Smurf Wrote:  You may have indoctrinated yourself for the most part, but you didn't invent the religion or foster its hold on society to the extent it has today.....did you? We are talking about Christianity, right? I should have asked. Because yeah, if you invented the whole thing on your own, I agree, that's pretty messed up. Very creative, but still messed up...in a way.
Yes, I concede your point. I did manage (when I wasn't psychotic) to proselytize some of my family members which makes me very conscious of my own guilt before blaming other people who taught me the 'gospel' because they thought it was true.

“The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is because vampires are allergic to bullshit.” ― Richard Pryor
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16-12-2013, 07:31 PM
RE: Why are people so convinced that they've heard/seen a deity?
(16-12-2013 07:23 PM)grizzlysnake Wrote:  
(16-12-2013 06:58 PM)thedudette Wrote:  Oops XD

I don't know much about Schizophrenia but if someone who was officially diagnosed by a doctor had to take medicine, and therapy shouldn't the person understand that it was just a hallucination? If they knew that their experience was a matter of the Schizophrenia I'd hope that it would make them stop telling people that they've genuinely talked to their deity.
If they are diagnosed. If they seek treatment. Lets not forget about all these cults around all claiming they have some special message from god or aliens Its all very confusing you can only speculate what is wrong with them. They scariest scenario would be if just one of them was genuine. Now how would that be proven?

We can't disprove they had the experience and they can't prove that they did.

I'd just hope they were attention seeking.
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16-12-2013, 07:34 PM
RE: Why are people so convinced that they've heard/seen a deity?
(16-12-2013 07:19 PM)cheapthrillseaker Wrote:  Manipulation. It's scary how easily it can be done.

I don't have much experience in converting people (I never did, as a young Jehovah's Witness), but I do understand somewhat the mechanics behind it, to the point where if I ever did want to go back to that faith, I could easily get reprogrammed back into their ways. I was raised in that cult, and have seen many people leave and come back and become assimilated back into the collective within months. Again, it's scary how easily it can be done.

What made me want to go back was an easy enough answer: I wanted to be happy. I wanted that conscious contact with that god again because it made me feel happy.

But the more complicated question was this: what was making me happy? I understand now religion to be a man-made construct. So, the emotions might be real and what I felt was very powerful - very much what I wanted - but that version of artificial happy concoction doesn't do it for me anymore. Why? Because I understand that the manipulation behind it serves someone Else's purpose and not mine. It serves that or an organization; a cult.

Some people believe in what they believe because it makes them happy, because they want to feel happy. It makes them as individuals, with their experiences, feel validated and reinforces their happiness to the nth degree. It satisfies in its own way what people want in an instant. Who actively seeks out being unhappy? We as humans go to great lengths, even to a point of suffering from delusions sometimes. It's a scary thought.

It is Sad
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16-12-2013, 07:48 PM (This post was last modified: 16-12-2013 07:53 PM by The Misanthrope.)
RE: Why are people so convinced that they've heard/seen a deity?
(16-12-2013 03:36 PM)thedudette Wrote:  This a question that I've been wanting to ask for awhile.

If they aren't lying about the experience then what could it be?
Hallucinations?

If anyone has an article about this I'd be happy to read it!

.....and why does Jewsis always look like Fabbio and dress in the clothes of Palestinian peasant circa 6 BC? And how come no one ever sees him in jeans, a jock strap, a track suit, or dressed as a bloke like him would naturally dress....like Boy George?



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16-12-2013, 07:59 PM
RE: Why are people so convinced that they've heard/seen a deity?
(16-12-2013 07:48 PM)The Misanthrope Wrote:  
(16-12-2013 03:36 PM)thedudette Wrote:  This a question that I've been wanting to ask for awhile.

If they aren't lying about the experience then what could it be?
Hallucinations?

If anyone has an article about this I'd be happy to read it!

.....and why does Jewsis always look like Fabbio and dress in the clothes of Palestinian peasant circa 6 BC? And how come no one ever sees him in jeans, a jock strap, a track suit, or dressed as a bloke like him would naturally dress....like Boy George?





That just made my day. :')
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16-12-2013, 08:03 PM
RE: Why are people so convinced that they've heard/seen a deity?
(16-12-2013 06:37 PM)thedudette Wrote:  
(16-12-2013 06:06 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I think a lot of it confirmation bias. People want to believe so they do.

Surely they must realize that their experience with the deity was false if they just want to believe it so and they know it didn't actually happen. Could someone really convince themselves of that?

It's like when someone says "they have a bad feeling" about something, then they rip their pants or something...

They just knew something would happen.

It's like people who believe in psychics. The psychic could say 50 things that completely wrong...but tell them that there's a person with a name beginning with an J who's "passed" and they'll mentally dig up uncle John...and that's what they remember. They instantly forget the "misses" and concentrate on the one thing they got right.

If they're rational they might realize that it's just coincidence. If they're not -- then its god.

It also comes down to people needing to feel special "god revealed himself to love me more because he always answered my prayers -- even if he doesn't.".


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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16-12-2013, 08:15 PM
RE: Why are people so convinced that they've heard/seen a deity?
(16-12-2013 08:03 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(16-12-2013 06:37 PM)thedudette Wrote:  Surely they must realize that their experience with the deity was false if they just want to believe it so and they know it didn't actually happen. Could someone really convince themselves of that?

It's like when someone says "they have a bad feeling" about something, then they rip their pants or something...

They just knew something would happen.

It's like people who believe in psychics. The psychic could say 50 things that completely wrong...but tell them that there's a person with a name beginning with an J who's "passed" and they'll mentally dig up uncle John...and that's what they remember. They instantly forget the "misses" and concentrate on the one thing they got right.

If they're rational they might realize that it's just coincidence. If they're not -- then its god.

It also comes down to people needing to feel special "god revealed himself to love me more because he always answered my prayers -- even if he doesn't.".





Cold Readings can go very very wrong.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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16-12-2013, 08:20 PM
RE: Why are people so convinced that they've heard/seen a deity?
(16-12-2013 08:15 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(16-12-2013 08:03 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  It's like when someone says "they have a bad feeling" about something, then they rip their pants or something...

They just knew something would happen.

It's like people who believe in psychics. The psychic could say 50 things that completely wrong...but tell them that there's a person with a name beginning with an J who's "passed" and they'll mentally dig up uncle John...and that's what they remember. They instantly forget the "misses" and concentrate on the one thing they got right.

If they're rational they might realize that it's just coincidence. If they're not -- then its god.

It also comes down to people needing to feel special "god revealed himself to love me more because he always answered my prayers -- even if he doesn't.".





Cold Readings can go very very wrong.

Yes, they can. It can be a cheap thrill sometimes. *wink wink*

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16-12-2013, 08:24 PM
RE: Why are people so convinced that they've heard/seen a deity?
(16-12-2013 08:15 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(16-12-2013 08:03 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  It's like when someone says "they have a bad feeling" about something, then they rip their pants or something...

They just knew something would happen.

It's like people who believe in psychics. The psychic could say 50 things that completely wrong...but tell them that there's a person with a name beginning with an J who's "passed" and they'll mentally dig up uncle John...and that's what they remember. They instantly forget the "misses" and concentrate on the one thing they got right.

If they're rational they might realize that it's just coincidence. If they're not -- then its god.

It also comes down to people needing to feel special "god revealed himself to love me more because he always answered my prayers -- even if he doesn't.".





Cold Readings can go very very wrong.
Oh yeah, here's another case. He along with Uri Geller and others were proven to be frauds yet people still believe. All they can do is attack the skeptics with character assaults and slander.

"I don't have to have faith, I have experience." Joseph Campbell
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