Why are we obsessed with feminism again?
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28-08-2017, 10:22 AM
RE: Why are we obsessed with feminism again?
(28-08-2017 10:08 AM)ELK12695 Wrote:  
(28-08-2017 08:43 AM)morondog Wrote:  Zeke's a good kid. He's not dogmatic and doesn't hold onto positions rigidly. Like a lot of young people he's been drawn to authoritarian and right-wing-ish ideas, IIRC, but he's always been fairly open to discussing and possibly changing them. I think he'll be a fine human at some point.

He's been a fine human all his life. Having different political ideas does not paint the full picture of a man.

Mmm. But having sound judgement is something that only develops over time. I'll say that Zeke has been a caterpillar for a while, and a good caterpillar. I'm waiting for him to emerge from his chrysalis as a well-informed, skeptical moth Smile Which he may well have done already. He's been away from the forum for a bit recently.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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28-08-2017, 10:30 AM
RE: Why are we obsessed with feminism again?
(28-08-2017 10:08 AM)ELK12695 Wrote:  
(28-08-2017 08:43 AM)morondog Wrote:  Zeke's a good kid. He's not dogmatic and doesn't hold onto positions rigidly. Like a lot of young people he's been drawn to authoritarian and right-wing-ish ideas, IIRC, but he's always been fairly open to discussing and possibly changing them. I think he'll be a fine human at some point.

He's been a fine human all his life. Having different political ideas does not paint the full picture of a man.

Idk- it depends on what those views are. I don't know anything about this Zeke character, and my statement isn't a judgement on him. But- just in general, some peoples' political ideas can be pretty damn foul and indicate that they are pretty damn foul humans.
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28-08-2017, 10:45 AM
RE: Why are we obsessed with feminism again?
(28-08-2017 10:22 AM)morondog Wrote:  Mmm. But having sound judgement is something that only develops over time. I'll say that Zeke has been a caterpillar for a while, and a good caterpillar. I'm waiting for him to emerge from his chrysalis as a well-informed, skeptical moth Smile Which he may well have done already. He's been away from the forum for a bit recently.

(28-08-2017 10:30 AM)Emma Wrote:  Idk- it depends on what those views are. I don't know anything about this Zeke character, and my statement isn't a judgement on him. But- just in general, some peoples' political ideas can be pretty damn foul and indicate that they are pretty damn foul humans.

Doesn't matter. He hasn't been here a while, and I don't think he's coming back. Wouldn't want me to talk about him much either.

Forget I said anything.

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28-08-2017, 10:57 AM
RE: Why are we obsessed with feminism again?
Walk around the world as a woman (especially as a young woman) for a few months. You will understand why we need feminism.

"If you don't have a seat at the table, you're probably on the menu."

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28-08-2017, 10:59 AM
RE: Why are we obsessed with feminism again?
(28-08-2017 10:57 AM)ShadowProject Wrote:  Walk around the world as a woman (especially as a young woman) for a few months. ...

Huh

...How?

More Min Gee Ziss
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28-08-2017, 11:06 AM
RE: Why are we obsessed with feminism again?
Exactly my point...So if you can't, then you cannot possibly understand the levels of shit women and girls have to put up with. But remember, we have to put up with it while wearing a smile! Because otherwise we are just bitches.

"If you don't have a seat at the table, you're probably on the menu."

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28-08-2017, 02:23 PM (This post was last modified: 28-08-2017 02:40 PM by Emma.)
RE: Why are we obsessed with feminism again?
(28-08-2017 10:59 AM)TSG Wrote:  
(28-08-2017 10:57 AM)ShadowProject Wrote:  Walk around the world as a woman (especially as a young woman) for a few months. ...

Huh

...How?

Lots of ways. But everything I'm going to tell you is anecdotal, of course. Cold-hard numbers are difficult to compile for stuff like this, and since men don't really experience this stuff in the same way, it's more difficult for them to perceive it. Many dudes often think that women are overreacting or making it up.

One particular thing that sticks out to me over the couple of years as being perceived as a woman instead of a man is that many men treat you very differently. The first time you have a dude get real close to you and quietly say something lewd to you as you were just walking by, leaving you looking over your shoulder the rest of day, is something you won't easily forget. In a man's mind, it's a compliment. A man thought you were pretty or sexy or whatever. In a woman's mind, it's far more complicated. Many dudes are bigger and stronger, more aggressive, more intimidating, more willing to invade personal space of a woman (not usually other guys, though), and you never can really tell which dude is going to be the wrong mix these traits.

I've been harassed going into supermarkets, driving my car (lots of stares, dudes trying to get my attention at stoplights, yelling at me, honking at me- one guy even demanded my phone number at a stop light, I shit you not... wtf), at a liquor store, and online.

I never had any experience even remotely similar as a man. I had the occasional flirty woman in a drive through, but I never got the impression that they'd stop traffic to try to fuck me right then and there. And I never got the impression as a guy that if I wasn't nice back, I'd get harassed even more for being "rude" or "a bitch". Dudes are only called a "bitch" when they are being demeaned as not masculine enough. When they are too feminine that's something to be mocked. Masculine is the ideal in our society. Women who are into traditionally masculine things- like sports- are cheered. While men who give up masculinity or are seen as less masculine are demeaned. For example, women can wear men's clothes, while men cannot wear women's clothes. To me, this points to a problem in our society where the feminine is clearly the subordinate of the masculine.

There's also that some guys resent taking instruction from women. At my job we just let go of a guy who argued every time he was being trained, and after he was let go, he wrote an email to one of my coworkers to complain that my boss, a woman, only wants weak men to work under her so she can boss them around. This is far from the first time she's had problems with both subordinates, peers, and seniors in the company. She's not weak, and she's not overpowering. She's a rather middle-of-the-road person, but she's blunt about what she expects and needs. And bluntness that throws men off sometimes, I guess.

There is too much to list, so that's just some anecdotal experiences along with my some of my impressions of them. It's fascinating to me the differences I've experienced walking in the public as both a man and a woman.
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28-08-2017, 02:38 PM
RE: Why are we obsessed with feminism again?
(28-08-2017 02:23 PM)Emma Wrote:  I never had any experience even remotely similar as a man.

Yeah, it was news to me when I first heard of this behaviour. I've never been aware of it as a man. Lady friends have confirmed to me that harassment happens to them all the time. Still shocking every time I think about it.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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28-08-2017, 04:31 PM
RE: Why are we obsessed with feminism again?
(28-08-2017 10:59 AM)TSG Wrote:  
(28-08-2017 10:57 AM)ShadowProject Wrote:  Walk around the world as a woman (especially as a young woman) for a few months. ...

Huh

...How?

Like this.
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#sigh
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28-08-2017, 04:31 PM
RE: Why are we obsessed with feminism again?
When your first experience with sexual aggression is at age 11 and a 30ish year old man says absolutely disgusting things to you that you barely understand but know it feels very, very wrong (age 11 remember), you learn quickly that the world isn't the best place for girls and women. And it all goes downhill from there.

I am just really fucking tired of men telling women "we" don't need feminism.

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