Why be smug and condescending? Turning people off to your beliefs
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
24-04-2014, 02:20 PM
RE: Why be smug and condescending? Turning people off to your beliefs
(24-04-2014 11:21 AM)Plan 9 from OS Wrote:  There seems to be a tone that resonates with a lot of arrogance and smug behavior. I get it, because just the other day I started a thread on here that I shouldn't have where I was ridiculing Fundamentalist Christians for believing some of the stupidity with a literal interpretation of the bible, young earth creationism, etc. I was thinking that people like Baptists, Evangelicals and Fundamentalists who go door to door trying to convert the unwashed masses most likely push more people away from Christianity than they do to convert people to it. I think people who believe that there is no God can come across with an abrasive attitude that can push people towards Christianity/Islam/Judaism than to guide them away from those faiths.

I'm coming from the point that at this point in my life I'm fully open to exploring POV's between theistic and atheistic ideals, so maybe I'm biased in my thoughts about this. Also, I can understand most people who are atheists not caring if theists are offended by comments because atheism is typically not in the business of trying to convert people unlike religion. But for me, I do not know any avowed atheists personally. I'm sure there are a few who are in the closet or like me who don't know what to believe. I know at the end of the day if I take that final plunge and embrace atheism (which looks like I'm moving down this path), I will have to remain in the closet for some time based on my current relationships.

My question is why heap so much ridicule on theists if you're sure you are correct? IMHO, if someone chooses to remain ignorant, that's on them. I'm eager to see your thoughts on this.


My experience with religion growing up as a child was virtually zero. I'm probably unique around these parts because I almost had no contact with anything religious and didn't even realize people had a belief in deities until I was probably 10 or so. So unlike many other atheists who have deconverted I never went through that process and I tend to not get angry with theists -except when they try to slip their rules into our secular laws. But the bigger problem I have with theists, particularly the conservative ones, is their reluctance to accept scientific evidence for global warming. It's becomes a domino effect. For theists to accept global warming they may have to accept that scientists are intelligent knowledgeable people and that other scientific evidence might be true, like evolution. If evolution is true and the world isn't 6000 years old then it puts a belief in god in jeopardy and maybe Jesus isn't going to return on some glorious cloud.

Hell, I don't care if people want to worship my cat's poop, but when it effects their inability to respond to a world crisis or deny that there is a world crisis because they can't think past some religious mumbo-jumbo, then yeah, I got a problem with the proponents of religion.

I'd guess most of everyones problem with theists is that they don't want to THINK.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like dancefortwo's post
24-04-2014, 02:29 PM
RE: Why be smug and condescending? Turning people off to your beliefs
(24-04-2014 01:19 PM)RobbyPants Wrote:  
(24-04-2014 12:29 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  I am constructed out of solid smugness, I cannot be otherwise. Undecided

You're the fifth element.


I knew that Multipass would come in handy...


[Image: multipass.jpg]

[Image: E3WvRwZ.gif]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like EvolutionKills's post
24-04-2014, 02:29 PM
RE: Why be smug and condescending? Turning people off to your beliefs
Personally I give new posters the benefit of the doubt even when they come out with christian arguments. After all, for a lot of people, it's the only way they know how to think because they have been steeped in apologetics their entire life. You can quickly tell though whether they do or do not want to learn. If they ask further questions and don't keep reverting back to arguments that people have taken time to refute then they are probably just trying to get their head round a completely new way of thinking. If they persist with a line of question and are trying to dismiss any answers given to them then they have a different agenda.

I do understand why some atheists express a lot of anger. When something intrudes upon your life and degrades it to a significant extent and you have no way out then it helps to have a place to rant. It can be hard to appreciate that if religion hasn't intruded on your life. Religion hasn't been a problem for me but there have been other times in my life which are comparable.

Some trolls really do just need their arses kicked by the bulldogs on the forum otherwise it can look like their bullshit is given more respect than it actually is. The problem is that the bulldogs can sniff out false positives with those genuinely trying to develop their own fledgling critical thinking skills whilst at the same time shaking off a lifetime's worth of conditioning.

We're all different, we've all led different lives and we're all at different stages in our lives.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 9 users Like Mathilda's post
24-04-2014, 03:54 PM
RE: Why be smug and condescending? Turning people off to your beliefs
You may not realize, but there is a Christian administrator on this forum. Many here think he is slightly loco, but he is also highly respected here and rightfully so. I tell you this so that you know that the atheists here are not just out to get Christians. If you're a troll, be afraid. If you're not a troll, just be comfy! Relax, ask, read, play around in the play portions of the forum, stuff like that! Smile

Also.... pay attention to Mathilda. She's kind of a mother hen around here, full of wisdom, intelligence and compassion, and yet she will not hesitate to give you a swift, sharp smack if you need one. A bit like a nun. No, I'm kidding. (she's going to kill me for that)
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 6 users Like Charis's post
24-04-2014, 04:50 PM
RE: Why be smug and condescending? Turning people off to your beliefs
(24-04-2014 11:21 AM)Plan 9 from OS Wrote:  There seems to be a tone that resonates with a lot of arrogance and smug behavior. I get it, because just the other day I started a thread on here that I shouldn't have where I was ridiculing Fundamentalist Christians for believing some of the stupidity with a literal interpretation of the bible, young earth creationism, etc. I was thinking that people like Baptists, Evangelicals and Fundamentalists who go door to door trying to convert the unwashed masses most likely push more people away from Christianity than they do to convert people to it. I think people who believe that there is no God can come across with an abrasive attitude that can push people towards Christianity/Islam/Judaism than to guide them away from those faiths.

I'm coming from the point that at this point in my life I'm fully open to exploring POV's between theistic and atheistic ideals, so maybe I'm biased in my thoughts about this. Also, I can understand most people who are atheists not caring if theists are offended by comments because atheism is typically not in the business of trying to convert people unlike religion. But for me, I do not know any avowed atheists personally. I'm sure there are a few who are in the closet or like me who don't know what to believe. I know at the end of the day if I take that final plunge and embrace atheism (which looks like I'm moving down this path), I will have to remain in the closet for some time based on my current relationships.

My question is why heap so much ridicule on theists if you're sure you are correct? IMHO, if someone chooses to remain ignorant, that's on them. I'm eager to see your thoughts on this.

Plan 9. I take it you're on the fence about religion which is fine. You seem like you're a thinking person. You might be interested in this.





This is part 1 of a 2 part video.

By the way, love your name, Plan Nine From Outerspace. Great (?!) movie.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
24-04-2014, 05:21 PM
RE: Why be smug and condescending? Turning people off to your beliefs
(24-04-2014 11:21 AM)Plan 9 from OS Wrote:  My question is why heap so much ridicule on theists if you're sure you are correct?

I don't.

(24-04-2014 11:21 AM)Plan 9 from OS Wrote:  IMHO, if someone chooses to remain ignorant, that's on them.

As I told my children when they asked about my metaphysics in their teens, "Bottom line is any bullshit promise of a postmortem preservation is utterly untenable. It's nonsense. What's left to talk about? But you gotta make your own metaphysics. What you got going for you is you get to choose the construction material. Choose well."

#sigh
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes GirlyMan's post
24-04-2014, 05:23 PM
RE: Why be smug and condescending? Turning people off to your beliefs
(24-04-2014 11:21 AM)Plan 9 from OS Wrote:  There seems to be a tone that resonates with a lot of arrogance and smug behavior. I get it, because just the other day I started a thread on here that I shouldn't have where I was ridiculing Fundamentalist Christians for believing some of the stupidity with a literal interpretation of the bible, young earth creationism, etc. I was thinking that people like Baptists, Evangelicals and Fundamentalists who go door to door trying to convert the unwashed masses most likely push more people away from Christianity than they do to convert people to it. I think people who believe that there is no God can come across with an abrasive attitude that can push people towards Christianity/Islam/Judaism than to guide them away from those faiths.

I'm coming from the point that at this point in my life I'm fully open to exploring POV's between theistic and atheistic ideals, so maybe I'm biased in my thoughts about this. Also, I can understand most people who are atheists not caring if theists are offended by comments because atheism is typically not in the business of trying to convert people unlike religion. But for me, I do not know any avowed atheists personally. I'm sure there are a few who are in the closet or like me who don't know what to believe. I know at the end of the day if I take that final plunge and embrace atheism (which looks like I'm moving down this path), I will have to remain in the closet for some time based on my current relationships.

My question is why heap so much ridicule on theists if you're sure you are correct? IMHO, if someone chooses to remain ignorant, that's on them. I'm eager to see your thoughts on this.

I haven't failed to notice the irony here, that you take issue with a certain tone. Not two sentences into your post I began to take issue with its tone. I am literally past my patience on many of the topics you mentioned here. Since the same issues continue to raise their ugly head, I feel compelled to speak out repetitively.

It offends my intelligence that so many people are more concerned with tone or attitude than factual information. Those things only matter when you have a sale to pitch. People with facts don't bother with it. They just publish a journal. Take any tone you want, the earth is still not six thousand years old. That is a scientific fact. Just exactly how arrogant or smug do I have to be to make it not a fact?

The proselyting that religions engage in is absolutely not equivalent in any way to the behavior of the atheist community. There is no competition between doctrines or sects. There is only one decision to be made, are you going to think critically or based on faith? Atheism is the default position supported by logic, reason, and evidence. In order for a society that values these things, religion has to be undone. Atheists are invested in creating other Atheists perhaps even more than the religious need to convert. The difference, which is so important, is that Atheists are not converting, we are stripping away a conversion, a perversion of who people are inside. Religion is a mental slavery, harmful to a persons identity and will. Atheism is emancipation, which is only the beginning of what this world has in store for us. Ask yourself, what is the moral difference between attempting to assimilate someone into a cult where they take orders or giving them the freedom to live life for themselves free of judgement and recrimination?

Ridicule is one of the best weapons in our arsenal. This isn't because we enjoy evoking feelings of embarrassment in others, but because it is an excellent means of pointing out what is ridiculous to those who do not detect it well on their own. The pious melodramatic seriousness that permeates religion can be dispelled with one sacrilegious joke. Ridicule helps get through the smoke and mirrors to the man behind the curtain.

I am at the end of my patience when it comes to reading about how yet again Atheism is being compared to religion as though it were the same or similar. What is so difficult about the definition of Atheism? That basic label stating what we are not doesn't even begin to touch what we value or who we are as human beings. I don't know a single Atheist who considers a lack of religion to be his or her identity. We are stuck with the damn label out of necessity. If religion weren't so common, maybe we wouldn't need the label to separate ourselves from the madness.

Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness.

-Karl Marx
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Dark Phoenix's post
25-04-2014, 06:28 AM
RE: Why be smug and condescending? Turning people off to your beliefs
[Image: 491d006a94474ef189d9a0de6fa988fd.jpg]

Drinking Beverage

[Image: E3WvRwZ.gif]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes EvolutionKills's post
25-04-2014, 07:55 AM
RE: Why be smug and condescending? Turning people off to your beliefs
(24-04-2014 04:50 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  
(24-04-2014 11:21 AM)Plan 9 from OS Wrote:  There seems to be a tone that resonates with a lot of arrogance and smug behavior. I get it, because just the other day I started a thread on here that I shouldn't have where I was ridiculing Fundamentalist Christians for believing some of the stupidity with a literal interpretation of the bible, young earth creationism, etc. I was thinking that people like Baptists, Evangelicals and Fundamentalists who go door to door trying to convert the unwashed masses most likely push more people away from Christianity than they do to convert people to it. I think people who believe that there is no God can come across with an abrasive attitude that can push people towards Christianity/Islam/Judaism than to guide them away from those faiths.

I'm coming from the point that at this point in my life I'm fully open to exploring POV's between theistic and atheistic ideals, so maybe I'm biased in my thoughts about this. Also, I can understand most people who are atheists not caring if theists are offended by comments because atheism is typically not in the business of trying to convert people unlike religion. But for me, I do not know any avowed atheists personally. I'm sure there are a few who are in the closet or like me who don't know what to believe. I know at the end of the day if I take that final plunge and embrace atheism (which looks like I'm moving down this path), I will have to remain in the closet for some time based on my current relationships.

My question is why heap so much ridicule on theists if you're sure you are correct? IMHO, if someone chooses to remain ignorant, that's on them. I'm eager to see your thoughts on this.

Plan 9. I take it you're on the fence about religion which is fine. You seem like you're a thinking person. You might be interested in this.





This is part 1 of a 2 part video.

By the way, love your name, Plan Nine From Outerspace. Great (?!) movie.

Thanks. I am on the fence as of now. I've been uncomfortable with the explanations I've seen about belief for some time. It always seems to boil down to a feeling. Everyone can be fooled by a feeling.

Gotta love Ed Wood! Thumbsup
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Plan 9 from OS's post
25-04-2014, 08:03 AM
RE: Why be smug and condescending? Turning people off to your beliefs
(24-04-2014 02:29 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  Personally I give new posters the benefit of the doubt even when they come out with christian arguments. After all, for a lot of people, it's the only way they know how to think because they have been steeped in apologetics their entire life. You can quickly tell though whether they do or do not want to learn. If they ask further questions and don't keep reverting back to arguments that people have taken time to refute then they are probably just trying to get their head round a completely new way of thinking. If they persist with a line of question and are trying to dismiss any answers given to them then they have a different agenda.

I do understand why some atheists express a lot of anger. When something intrudes upon your life and degrades it to a significant extent and you have no way out then it helps to have a place to rant. It can be hard to appreciate that if religion hasn't intruded on your life. Religion hasn't been a problem for me but there have been other times in my life which are comparable.

Some trolls really do just need their arses kicked by the bulldogs on the forum otherwise it can look like their bullshit is given more respect than it actually is. The problem is that the bulldogs can sniff out false positives with those genuinely trying to develop their own fledgling critical thinking skills whilst at the same time shaking off a lifetime's worth of conditioning.

We're all different, we've all led different lives and we're all at different stages in our lives.

Thanks for the benefit of the doubt. I promise all of you that I am not a troll and that I am serious about seeking out the truth about faith.

Someone mentioned that they are sick and tired about seeing Atheism treated as another faith. I didn't mean to do that if I did, and I know that it is not a faith.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Plan 9 from OS's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: