Why can't I find a woman who is willing to serve me?
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12-10-2014, 03:49 PM
RE: Why can't I find a woman who is willing to serve me?
(12-10-2014 03:47 PM)Forbes Wrote:  
(12-10-2014 03:40 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  It sounds like you don't really understand social relationships Forbes, in much the same way that someone with Asperger's has trouble understanding the theory of mind. My brother-in-law seems insincere and manipulative and from what I can tell he lacks empathy and does not understand the need that people have for social company.

I'm not suggesting that you yourself are manipulative, my brother-in-law is a special case in that he is a sociopath and that's one way that he adapted to the world. You seem though to see relationships in terms of transactions.

Many people lack certain neural functions that the rest of us take for granted. My father has undiagnosed Aspergers. I once knew someone who was unable form pictures in his mind. I knew someone else who was convinced that love didn't exist because he himself was unable to feel it. I myself am asexual and anorgasmic, many religious zealots lack the ability to think in terms of anything other than absolutes.

One way to determine whether this is the case for you or not is to ask what is the single greatest reason why you want a partner? Are you driven by sexual desire? Do you feel lonely without a companion? Do you think that life would be easier and more productive if you shared your life with another?

I see where you're going but as i'm sure you're aware, when you're not face to face with someone it can be hard to get your point across accurately. So let me clarify.

What has happened is that I've noticed a pattern of behaviour in the women that i've been with, and also in those that I've had dates with.

What do you think are the most important reasons to have relationships?
What did you look for when finding girlfriends in the past?
What have you been looking for when finding dates?

Swing with me a while, we can listen to the birds call, we can keep each other warm.
Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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12-10-2014, 03:50 PM
RE: Why can't I find a woman who is willing to serve me?
(12-10-2014 03:43 PM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  
(12-10-2014 03:00 PM)Forbes Wrote:  I may have given the impression that i'm a doormat. Ok let me clarify. All I do is what is reasonable. That's it.

When you have a girlfriend or a wife, or a platonic friend for that matter, there are things that are expected. After all, no one becomes friends or dates or marries just anybody. A friendship or partnership of any kind comes with expectations. I've been fulfilling mine, and within the construct / social agreement, it's understood that it's a two way thing. So in that sense, yes, both parties do owe the other. Otherwise what are you doing together.

Hmm...I have a friend. I babysit her kids sometimes. I bought her some food when she was struggling a couple of times. She didn't ask me to do it. I just knew she could use the help and I was in a situation where I was able to offer it. The only thing I expect from her is her friendship and her time(when she has it), and that's all she expects from me. We are in it because we enjoy each other, we laugh together, we cry together, we talk. I don't understand these expectations of favors in a relationship. Perhaps I've been doing it wrong this whole time. I like favors too...

Same here. I give friendship, but unlike you, I don't get it in return. sure, I have laughs and chats with them, but anybody can have a laugh and a chat. I've had laughs and chats with guys down the pub, guys that I barely know. Even with people that I don't trust much. But when it comes to reciprocating the important things in a friendship / partnership, unfortunately, it's very one sided in regards to the women that I've been with and had dates with.
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12-10-2014, 03:52 PM
RE: Why can't I find a woman who is willing to serve me?
(12-10-2014 03:47 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(12-10-2014 03:43 PM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  Hmm...I have a friend. I babysit her kids sometimes. I bought her some food when she was struggling a couple of times. She didn't ask me to do it. I just knew she could use the help and I was in a situation where I was able to offer it.

And more importantly you wanted to help her out because being a friend you cared about her well being. Giving is it's own reward and all that ...

Yes giving is rewarding. But if the person who is supposed to be on your side doesn't give back, it becomes draining, not rewarding.
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12-10-2014, 03:52 PM
RE: Why can't I find a woman who is willing to serve me?
(12-10-2014 03:50 PM)Forbes Wrote:  
(12-10-2014 03:43 PM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  Hmm...I have a friend. I babysit her kids sometimes. I bought her some food when she was struggling a couple of times. She didn't ask me to do it. I just knew she could use the help and I was in a situation where I was able to offer it. The only thing I expect from her is her friendship and her time(when she has it), and that's all she expects from me. We are in it because we enjoy each other, we laugh together, we cry together, we talk. I don't understand these expectations of favors in a relationship. Perhaps I've been doing it wrong this whole time. I like favors too...

Same here. I give friendship, but unlike you, I don't get it in return. sure, I have laughs and chats with them, but anybody can have a laugh and a chat. I've had laughs and chats with guys down the pub, guys that I barely know. Even with people that I don't trust much. But when it comes to reciprocating the important things in a friendship / partnership, unfortunately, it's very one sided in regards to the women that I've been with and had dates with.

I want to give you advice, but I need you to tell me what you consider to be important things in a relationship and why.

Swing with me a while, we can listen to the birds call, we can keep each other warm.
Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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12-10-2014, 03:53 PM
RE: Why can't I find a woman who is willing to serve me?
(12-10-2014 03:52 PM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  
(12-10-2014 03:50 PM)Forbes Wrote:  Same here. I give friendship, but unlike you, I don't get it in return. sure, I have laughs and chats with them, but anybody can have a laugh and a chat. I've had laughs and chats with guys down the pub, guys that I barely know. Even with people that I don't trust much. But when it comes to reciprocating the important things in a friendship / partnership, unfortunately, it's very one sided in regards to the women that I've been with and had dates with.

I want to give you advice, but I need you to tell me what you consider to be important things in a relationship and why.

Companionship. Helping each other. Bringing out the best in each other.
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12-10-2014, 03:56 PM
RE: Why can't I find a woman who is willing to serve me?
(12-10-2014 03:53 PM)Forbes Wrote:  
(12-10-2014 03:52 PM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  I want to give you advice, but I need you to tell me what you consider to be important things in a relationship and why.

Companionship. Helping each other. Bringing out the best in each other.

Can you tell me more about what these things mean to you?
When you think of a person offering companionship, what do you see? More details, my dear. I really think your biggest issue is that you're looking for the wrong type of women and/or you don't know what qualities to look for to find what you want.

Swing with me a while, we can listen to the birds call, we can keep each other warm.
Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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12-10-2014, 03:58 PM
RE: Why can't I find a woman who is willing to serve me?
(12-10-2014 03:47 PM)Forbes Wrote:  I see where you're going but as i'm sure you're aware, when you're not face to face with someone it can be hard to get your point across accurately. So let me clarify.

What has happened is that I've noticed a pattern of behaviour in the women that i've been with, and also in those that I've had dates with.

OK sorry, it was worthwhile considering.

Just understand that the right person is out there and there are actually plenty of people who would qualify as the right person, but something is going wrong for you.

For example I had a flatmate once who always complained that she couldn't find the right bloke. Nothing ever lasted and it always ended in sex. The reason was obvious to everyone else. She used to regularly go to night clubs which were 'meat-markets' and dance until she got chatted up.

I have another friend who has never managed to find a long term partner. She wanted a family but she was always holding out for the ideal man and would never give anyone that fell short the slightest consideration. The reasons for dumping them were ridiculous. For example, the man could never be under 6'2" because she didn't want to feel too tall when she wore high heels. She's a professional photographer and she got into a relationship with another photographer but he was more advanced in his career in hers so she dumped him. Another time she dumped Mr Perfect because after 6 months the magic left the relationship.

So it might be that you are just going about meeting the right person in the wrong way. It can be difficult. Also all relationships, no matter how good they are, need constant maintenance and you both need to compromise. Or maybe your initial criteria which seem important when selecting a partner aren't actually as important as you imagine them to be.
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12-10-2014, 04:06 PM
RE: Why can't I find a woman who is willing to serve me?
(12-10-2014 03:58 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(12-10-2014 03:47 PM)Forbes Wrote:  I see where you're going but as i'm sure you're aware, when you're not face to face with someone it can be hard to get your point across accurately. So let me clarify.

What has happened is that I've noticed a pattern of behaviour in the women that i've been with, and also in those that I've had dates with.

OK sorry, it was worthwhile considering.

Just understand that the right person is out there and there are actually plenty of people who would qualify as the right person, but something is going wrong for you.

For example I had a flat mate once who always complained that she couldn't find the right bloke. Nothing ever lasted and it always ended in sex. The reason was obvious to everyone else. She used to regularly go to night clubs which were 'meat-markets' and dance until she got chatted up.

I have another friend who has never managed to find a long term partner. She wanted a family but she was always holding out for the ideal man and would never give anyone that fell short the slightest consideration. The reasons for dumping them were ridiculous. For example, the man could never be under 6'2" because she didn't want to feel too tall when she wore high heels. She's a professional photographer and she got into a relationship with another photographer but he was more advanced in his career in hers so she dumped him. Another time she dumped Mr Perfect because after 6 months the magic left the relationship.

So it might be that you are just going about meeting the right person in the wrong way. It can be difficult. Also all relationships, no matter how good they are, need constant maintenance and you both need to compromise. Or maybe your initial criteria which seem important when selecting a partner aren't actually as important as you imagine them to be.

Thanks but has it occurred to you that I'm a normal, pretty cool guy who just likes to be kind to his girlfriends, and who is doing nothing wrong, nor expecting anything unreasonable or unrealistic, and keeps having bad luck due to a shortage of women who are prepared to do something for someone other than themselves?

What I mean is, the examples you've given are of people who are doing things all wrong. Whereas in my case, it's the women I've dated who are unreasonable. Perhaps you should consider that maybe there is a big issue with modern women, and by that I mean women in this country and others like it.

I'm sure we've all seen the articles saying that men are immature, avoid commitment, are selfish in bed, and on it goes. No one bats an eyelid and everyone has a good chuckle. Maybe, in the spirit of equality, we should take a good, honest look at what's really coming from the other side. Instead of looking for every possible angle as to why this must be about me.
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12-10-2014, 04:08 PM
RE: Why can't I find a woman who is willing to serve me?
(12-10-2014 01:28 PM)Forbes Wrote:  
(12-10-2014 12:49 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  Funny thing, I am incredibly bossy. I tend to order my friends and family around, but when it comes to girls I like it just the opposite. I want a girl to order me around.

I think what you need is a submissive woman. That shouldn't be hard to find. Just look at how popular Fifty Shades of Grey is.

Oh no, that's not what I want at all. All I want is a woman who is normal and reasonable, and reciprocates kindness.

The thing is, people choose their friends based on what they have to offer as friends. For example, I doubt if anyone would choose friends who never offer to help them out, or do all the other things that are considered to be what is expected of a friend.

If someone came to the realisation that their so called friend in fact didn't have the qualities of a friend, they would stop associating with them.

Likewise, the role of boyfriend, husband, girlfriend or wife has its own criteria. Although it's not quite the same as a platonic friendship, there are similarities, and if someone isn't prepared to do things for the benefit of the other, then they're not a good girlfriend, wife, boyfriend or husband.

I admit, I've foolishly chosen women who are not good girlfriend material, because they aren't prepared to serve the other person even though they're happy to be served, without reciprocating.

But that's not a huge issue just as long as I admit that, and I do. I can change that. But the real major problem is that I can't find anyone who isn't selfish and one sided. I live in London by the way.

Stop treating woman as objects. You may think you are being kind by giving everything, but all your doing is putting them on a pedestal. It is not a healthy way to start a relationship. A relationship is a partnership. If you are not having your needs met than stop being a twat and tell them.
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12-10-2014, 04:09 PM
RE: Why can't I find a woman who is willing to serve me?
(12-10-2014 04:06 PM)Forbes Wrote:  What I mean is, the examples you've given are of people who are doing things all wrong. Whereas in my case, it's the women I've dated who are unreasonable. Perhaps you should consider that maybe there is a big issue with modern women, and by that I mean women in this country and others like it.

Bingo, he wants a 50s woman.

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF

We're all mad here. The Cheshire Cat
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