Why do atheists become atheists?
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13-01-2015, 10:56 AM
RE: Why do atheists become atheists?
TBD you took the words right out if my mouth.

As a teenager I always thought that the reason I didn't understand the dogma was that I wasn't mature or knowledgeable enough but I went with the flow because I followed the examples of all the adults that I respected.

And then I started to see hypocrisy in actions vs words, preaching one thing and doing quite another.

It all came to a head when I fell in love with a Jewish girl, my Jesus loving Catholic family turned into a religious Mr. Hyde.

Looking for answers to see if my girlfriend really was going to burn in hell led me down the path of atheism, the more I looked for a just and loving god the less I found.

Now I'm a 6.99999 on the scale.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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13-01-2015, 11:04 AM
RE: Why do atheists become atheists?
(13-01-2015 10:56 AM)Full Circle Wrote:  TBD you took the words right out if my mouth.

As a teenager I always thought that the reason I didn't understand the dogma was that I wasn't mature or knowledgeable enough but I went with the flow because I followed the examples of all the adults that I respected.

And then I started to see hypocrisy in actions vs words, preaching one thing and doing quite another.

It all came to a head when I fell in love with a Jewish girl, my Jesus loving Catholic family turned into a religious Mr. Hyde.

Looking for answers to see if my girlfriend really was going to burn in hell led me down the path of atheism, the more I looked for a just and loving god the less I found.

Now I'm a 6.99999 on the scale.

The push over the edge for me was that youth minister. He was mad at his grandmother because he believed he'd never see her again because she committed suicide. It was such a selfish reason, not to mention that he was telling kids this when the discussion should have been about recognizing and helping people who are depressed, not being so afraid that you simply avoid it.

I couldn't reconcile the bible or god with a decree that suicide = hell. And I couldn't trust the religious opinion of others because some of them clearly believed this, which went counter to my own inner morality. And if I couldn't seek out people who were supposed to be experts, and I couldn't take the bible literally, then I had no way of knowing whether or not to even trust my own interpretation of the bible. The result was a realization that the bible had as much value as any other book if all you were doing was interpreting it through your own inner moral compass.

Religion just faded away as being of any importance to me after that. The words of Picard, McGonagall, Dumbledore, and Gandalf meant far more than Jesus to me.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
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13-01-2015, 11:13 AM
RE: Why do atheists become atheists?
(13-01-2015 08:48 AM)Chas Wrote:  Sure, you keep telling yourself that and using absurd sources to confirm your bias.

There were no scientific studies on that link.

I think Tomasia was trying to make a joke; at least I hope so. It can be hard to tell sometimes.

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13-01-2015, 11:29 AM
RE: Why do atheists become atheists?
(13-01-2015 11:04 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  The push over the edge for me was that youth minister. He was mad at his grandmother because he believed he'd never see her again because she committed suicide. It was such a selfish reason, not to mention that he was telling kids this when the discussion should have been about recognizing and helping people who are depressed, not being so afraid that you simply avoid it.

I couldn't reconcile the bible or god with a decree that suicide = hell. And I couldn't trust the religious opinion of others because some of them clearly believed this, which went counter to my own inner morality. And if I couldn't seek out people who were supposed to be experts, and I couldn't take the bible literally, then I had no way of knowing whether or not to even trust my own interpretation of the bible. The result was a realization that the bible had as much value as any other book if all you were doing was interpreting it through your own inner moral compass.

Religion just faded away as being of any importance to me after that. The words of Picard, McGonagall, Dumbledore, and Gandalf meant far more than Jesus to me.

It didn't happen all at once did it? I wanted to believe but I kept smashing upon teachings that went against my inner moral compass (as you say).

Bits and pieces of the many years of indoctrination fell by the wayside until I just stopped thinking about it, God would help me sort it out someday I thought.

But as I began to look at the misery religion was causing around the world just like it had in my own life, I dropped all the pretense, I could not reconcile what I saw in the world with what religions claimed, it all bubbled to the top and now here I am, a crusader (pun intended) against barbaric, thought-crushing myths.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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13-01-2015, 01:30 PM
RE: Why do atheists become atheists?
I find agnostic Atheism to be very very silly. I mean ... think about this:

Can you say that all the other gods never existed and be certain of it? How about any one of the thousands of gods that have come and gone over the course of history?

If you are a 100% atheist against all the other gods in history, what excuse do you have for not taking it just 1 god further and being 100% atheist about the Christian god?

What's the fucking problem people?

I am a 7.0 on the Dawkins Scale, and the reason I am 7.0 is that I am just as certain that the Christian god does not exist as I am about any one of the thousands of other gods do not exist.

I am a mother fucking hard-core atheist and damn proud of it.

Drinking Beverage

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13-01-2015, 01:55 PM
RE: Why do atheists become atheists?
(13-01-2015 01:30 PM)Free Wrote:  I find agnostic Atheism to be very very silly. I mean ... think about this:

Can you say that all the other gods never existed and be certain of it? How about any one of the thousands of gods that have come and gone over the course of history?

If you are a 100% atheist against all the other gods in history, what excuse do you have for not taking it just 1 god further and being 100% atheist about the Christian god?

What's the fucking problem people?

I am a 7.0 on the Dawkins Scale, and the reason I am 7.0 is that I am just as certain that the Christian god does not exist as I am about any one of the thousands of other gods do not exist.

I am a mother fucking hard-core atheist and damn proud of it.

Drinking Beverage

Yep, and that's the mentality I don't quite get. Because it's admitting to being certain of something you're not logically certain of. That's along the same lines of, this is the idea that makes sense to me so I believe it must be true. It's not a completely sound position, so I don't desire to take it.

I don't believe you can disprove a deistic God. Yeah it's the dumb scenario of you can't disprove a negative, but if you care for holding a position you can prove as more true than false, agnostic atheism is the position to take.

You're proud of that.. good for you. I base more of a pride in positions I take being consistently defensible and provable.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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13-01-2015, 02:14 PM
RE: Why do atheists become atheists?
(13-01-2015 11:29 AM)Full Circle Wrote:  
(13-01-2015 11:04 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  The push over the edge for me was that youth minister. He was mad at his grandmother because he believed he'd never see her again because she committed suicide. It was such a selfish reason, not to mention that he was telling kids this when the discussion should have been about recognizing and helping people who are depressed, not being so afraid that you simply avoid it.

I couldn't reconcile the bible or god with a decree that suicide = hell. And I couldn't trust the religious opinion of others because some of them clearly believed this, which went counter to my own inner morality. And if I couldn't seek out people who were supposed to be experts, and I couldn't take the bible literally, then I had no way of knowing whether or not to even trust my own interpretation of the bible. The result was a realization that the bible had as much value as any other book if all you were doing was interpreting it through your own inner moral compass.

Religion just faded away as being of any importance to me after that. The words of Picard, McGonagall, Dumbledore, and Gandalf meant far more than Jesus to me.

It didn't happen all at once did it? I wanted to believe but I kept smashing upon teachings that went against my inner moral compass (as you say).

Bits and pieces of the many years of indoctrination fell by the wayside until I just stopped thinking about it, God would help me sort it out someday I thought.

But as I began to look at the misery religion was causing around the world just like it had in my own life, I dropped all the pretense, I could not reconcile what I saw in the world with what religions claimed, it all bubbled to the top and now here I am, a crusader (pun intended) against barbaric, thought-crushing myths.

It didn't happen all at once. It took me 3-4 years from when I really started scrutinizing religion to realization I was an atheist.

And I went through all manner of silliness during that time from the "I'm not religious, I am a Christian" to "I don't know if I am a Christian, but I like Jesus" or everybody's favorite "I'm not religious, I'm spiritual." I considered reincarnation and variations on Buddhist cycles, etc.

Eventually a friend asked me if I really believed all of the drivel coming out of my mouth, and I realized I didn't. The next morning, I was an atheist.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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13-01-2015, 02:18 PM
RE: Why do atheists become atheists?
And, in the interest of trying to be clever, there is an even simpler answer to the question.

Why do atheists become atheists? For better reasons than anyone who becomes a theist.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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13-01-2015, 02:18 PM
RE: Why do atheists become atheists?
That's the question that befuddles me the most now. With the truth so readily available via the world wide web, how are so many theists content with sticking their head in the sand? I guess I just don't understand the "security blank" over natural curiosity.

It always makes me laugh when theists say, "Atheists know God exists", because I personally believe the opposite. I think most theists, in the back of their mind, know that it's all bullshit. But that lingering fear pushed by the idea of eternity in Hell keeps them coming back every Sunday just in case God's watching.
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13-01-2015, 02:24 PM
RE: Why do atheists become atheists?
(13-01-2015 01:55 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  
(13-01-2015 01:30 PM)Free Wrote:  I find agnostic Atheism to be very very silly. I mean ... think about this:

Can you say that all the other gods never existed and be certain of it? How about any one of the thousands of gods that have come and gone over the course of history?

If you are a 100% atheist against all the other gods in history, what excuse do you have for not taking it just 1 god further and being 100% atheist about the Christian god?

What's the fucking problem people?

I am a 7.0 on the Dawkins Scale, and the reason I am 7.0 is that I am just as certain that the Christian god does not exist as I am about any one of the thousands of other gods do not exist.

I am a mother fucking hard-core atheist and damn proud of it.

Drinking Beverage

Yep, and that's the mentality I don't quite get. Because it's admitting to being certain of something you're not logically certain of.

I AM logically certain of it. Using your very same position, we can therefore say that ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING we could possibly think about actually exists.

Right now there is 111111111 billion tap dancing woolly mammoths flying 100 feet above the ground all around the earth.

Now tell me; is it logically sound to state with certainty that there are NOT 111111111 billion tap dancing woolly mammoths flying 100 feet above the ground all around the earth?


Quote:That's along the same lines of, this is the idea that makes sense to me so I believe it must be true. It's not a completely sound position, so I don't desire to take it.

It is a solid position to take given the fact there is no evidence to create any doubt.

Quote:I don't believe you can disprove a deistic God.

It is not a matter of disproving, but rather a matter that there is nothing to disprove. When you have nothing to disprove, then NOTHING EXISTS.

Quote:I base more of a pride in positions I take being consistently defensible and provable.

If that's the case, then anything anybody could possibly think of actually exists, all because you "don't know."

Right?

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