Why do cartoons suck?
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27-05-2014, 10:17 PM (This post was last modified: 27-05-2014 10:25 PM by Alex_Leonardo.)
RE: Why do cartoons suck?
The cartoons now are meh...
I tried to watch cartoon network, but the only stuff worth recording is Adventure Time and The Amazing world of Gumball because they have so many different styles and art mixed into one show, and the characters are vibrant, and they actually try to teach a life lesson during most of the episodes. (usually with both "sides" of the lesson acted out by Gumball and Darwin, showing there can be a subjective stance on life, usually with Darwin acting out the socially "Moral" side and Gumball acting out the "What anyone would do" side.). Regular Show is a bit below average because it seems that the same things always happen during every episode, and there's no continuity. (Except that stuff with Margret, there's no story.)
I don't even watch the rest of the crap. For adult cartoons, Family guy is pretty stupid, including all of the spin-offs. South park is okay, and the Simpsons still seems to be fresh. I can't believe they cancelled Futurama, for like what? The third time?
I don't really agree with the "90's and 80's were better" crap. It's just that our culture is changing. I watched some of the "old" cartoons, and they seemed to be as good as they are today. See, you always have a few overall good ones that everyone likes in a pile of subjective crap. I liked Chowder a bit while it aired, and Billy and Mandy were pretty good. Courage was pretty weird during my times. It was like a darker "Uncle grandpa." Edd, Ed, and Eddy is basically the equivalent of "Johnny test" or one of those shows that they air for six hours during the summer and you don't want to change the channel because there's nothing on.

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27-05-2014, 10:25 PM (This post was last modified: 27-05-2014 10:31 PM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: Why do cartoons suck?
(27-05-2014 10:04 PM)Ducky Wrote:  
(27-05-2014 09:34 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Except that Duck Tales, Tiny Toon Adventures, the Animaniacs, and Darkwing Duck were not the standard; they were the exception. They were either done by Disney (which invested better talent and more money into their cartoons), or in the case of Animaniacs and Tiny Toons they were the pet projects of Steven Spielberg; and likewise had the better budgets and had to compete with the higher quality that Disney had established. The standard frames per second for film (animated or otherwise) is 24fps. Cartoons in the 80's, in an effort to save time and money, often animated at half of that (12 frames per second). They basically shot each animation frame twice to get it to 24fps. Japanese cartoons of the time (Gundam, Voltron, etc.) look even worse because they were made at 6 frames per second. Then you also take into account their other cost saving techniques, like the static action shot that relies on a moving color background without actually animating the character to represent 'movement' or 'action', and you can see the origin of many Japanese animation tropes (like the shots of people's heads with just their mouth moving for lots of the dialogue or recycled animation shots like the transformation of the Sailor Scouts).


You may not like the 'style' of the newer cartoons, but with the advent of computers it made it easier to get animation back to 24fps. Powerpuff Girls and Samurai Jack (and just about anything else on Cartoon Network at that time) were better animated that anything from the 80's that was not a feature length film (and in the case of Yellow Submarine, substantially better than some films). Animation is about movement and weight, and some modern cartoons come pretty close to nailing it (My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic comes to mind).

Now, now, there's no need to get all defensive. I was simply reiterating what undergroundp stated earlier: the decade one grew up in influences the opinion one has over which cartoons were the "best." I grew up in the 80s and early 90s, so I favor those cartoons and don't care for a lot of the modern ones. That doesn't mean that everything on TV now is crap (I'm also a fan of MLP), it just means that I favor a different style of animation because that's what I grew up with. I also hold the opinion that the shorts produced by Warner Bros and Disney back in the Golden Age of animation were the very best. Does that mean that it's necessarily true? Perhaps, perhaps not. Those are just the cartoons I watched growing up, so that's the standard I hold other cartoons to.

I'm not being defensive, just pointing out that the style of drawing and the quality of the animation itself are not one in the same. I was an animation major, so this kind of thing is sorta my wheelhouse. So when you disparage things with the phrase 'style of animation', it sounds like you don't know what you are talking about because you are conflating the two.

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28-05-2014, 12:19 AM
RE: Why do cartoons suck?
(26-05-2014 02:38 PM)Ferdinand Wrote:  The only good cartoons now-a-days are Adventure Time and Regular Show. They're modernized, but they're down to earth, and not stupid and shitty like Uncle Grandpa and all of that other shit that comes on.

I miss the days of Courage the Cowardly Dog, Ed, Edd and Eddy, and The Powerpuff Girls.

Sad


These were my homies.

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The real deal. Sad

Holy crap that brings back memories

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28-05-2014, 02:16 AM (This post was last modified: 28-05-2014 02:29 AM by Ducky.)
RE: Why do cartoons suck?
(27-05-2014 10:25 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  it sounds like you don't know what you are talking about because you are conflating the two.

There's also no need to resort to personal insults or assumptions about knowledge, because this isn't an argument. I was responding to a post about personal taste, and I gave my opinion. Throwing credentials around is also unnecessary; this isn't a contest about who has the must knowledge about the industry, but if you insist, I am also an animation major, but that has no bearing on opinion or personal taste or this conversation. I mentioned a particular style of animation (or style of drawing) because it was just that. The thick-line, limited animation style (or technique if you want to get nit-picky about terminology) used in Powerpuff Girls became very popular during that time and was prevalent among the cartoons which aired on Cartoon Network in the late 90s. But Adventure Time also has its own style, whether you want to use that word or not. It's very loose, and the characters don't seem to have any bones. Does that mean you can't like it? No, but it doesn't meant that I have to be impressed by it, either.

I should also mention that I understand that animation and storytelling are not co-dependent. A show can be poorly animated (or poorly drawn) and still be a good show with quality writing. I personally don't feel that Bob's Burgers accomplishes either good drawing or good writing, but once again, that is my personal opinion that doesn't need to be shot down or insulted just because you don't agree.

I don't understand why you're getting so worked up this. It's not that important.

Edit: I should stress AGAIN that I wasn't implying the cartoons of the 80s and 90s were better, I was agreeing with the theory posed in an earlier post that the decade a person grew up in influences their opinion about which cartoons were good. I grew up in the 80s and early 90s, so those are the cartoons I enjoyed the most. That's it.
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28-05-2014, 02:27 AM
RE: Why do cartoons suck?
(28-05-2014 02:16 AM)Ducky Wrote:  
(27-05-2014 10:25 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  it sounds like you don't know what you are talking about because you are conflating the two.

There's also no need to resort to personal insults or assumptions about knowledge, because this isn't an argument. I was responding to a post about personal taste, and I gave my opinion. Throwing credentials around is also unnecessary; this isn't a contest about who has the must knowledge about the industry, but if you insist, I am also an animation major, but that has no bearing on opinion or personal taste or this conversation. I mentioned a particular style of animation (or style of drawing) because it was just that. The thick-line, limited animation style (or technique if you want to get nit-picky about terminology) used in Powerpuff Girls became very popular during that time and was prevalent among the cartoons which aired on Cartoon Network in the late 90s. But Adventure Time also has its own style, whether you want to use that word or not. It's very loose, and the characters don't seem to have any bones. Does that mean you can't like it? No, but it doesn't meant that I have to be impressed by it, either.

I should also mention that I understand that animation and storytelling are not co-dependent. A show can be poorly animated (or poorly drawn) and still be a good show with quality writing. I personally don't feel that Bob's Burgers accomplishes either good drawing or good writing, but once again, that is my personal opinion that doesn't need to be shot down or insulted just because you don't agree.

I don't understand why you're getting so worked up this. It's not that important.

For the love of shit, you apparently don't understand how the word 'like' was used in that fucking sentence... Facepalm

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28-05-2014, 02:32 AM
RE: Why do cartoons suck?
Please stop turning this into a personal attack. It's not needed.
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28-05-2014, 02:40 AM
RE: Why do cartoons suck?
(28-05-2014 02:32 AM)Ducky Wrote:  Please stop turning this into a personal attack. It's not needed.

I didn't. Your imagination and reading comprehension turned it into one...

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28-05-2014, 02:45 AM
Why do cartoons suck?
(28-05-2014 02:40 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(28-05-2014 02:32 AM)Ducky Wrote:  Please stop turning this into a personal attack. It's not needed.

I didn't. Your imagination and reading comprehension turned it into one...

Thanks for proving my point. Have a good night.
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28-05-2014, 03:21 AM (This post was last modified: 28-05-2014 03:39 AM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: Why do cartoons suck?
(28-05-2014 02:45 AM)Ducky Wrote:  
(28-05-2014 02:40 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  I didn't. Your imagination and reading comprehension turned it into one...

Thanks for proving my point. Have a good night.

I spoke up because it originally sounded like you were equating style and animation, and the crop of examples that you picked as your favorite were some of the best animated work of their time; regardless of the style. I enjoyed all of those cartoons as well, and I'd go so far as to include Disney's Gargoyles on that list too. So while the visual styles have changed, from a technical standpoint the Disney and Spielberg projects represented a high watermark for their time; they were not representative of the state of the genre as a whole. Technology has helped improve things from a technical standpoint for the whole genre, even if you are personally not a fan of particular aesthetic styles. That was my one and only point.

Did I say that you were wrong for liking those cartoons, or not liking others? No.

Did I claim that you didn't know what you were talking about? No, I said it sounded like you may have been conflating substance with style.

When I personally attack someone, I am real fucking obvious about it. But thanks for jumping to conclusions all the same.

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28-05-2014, 09:27 AM
RE: Why do cartoons suck?
You should make a poll concerning preferred decade...

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