Why evil??
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03-11-2014, 08:00 PM
RE: Why evil??
(03-11-2014 07:21 PM)Shamma Wrote:  
(03-11-2014 07:03 PM)pablo Wrote:  It wasn't worth reading once.
Basically Shamma Lamma Ding Dong is trying to get us to admit that evil exists because of original sin, or at the very least, god has something to do with it.
As far as I can tell anyway.

So you are judging me just because you think that I want to convert you?? Laugh out load

It's easier to me to post threads about my religion and I'm not ashamed to that.. I did already Sleepy and I'm not afraid to ask you clearly to convert into my religion

I'm proud of who I am and what I believe and I don't need to hide my intentions in this thread to achieve any goals!!

That's only in your own minds Big Grin

You are always welcome to "not read my threads" Sleepy good bye.

What are your motives, and why do you think coming here and acting superior with your beliefs is the best way to go?
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03-11-2014, 08:04 PM
RE: Why evil??
There are far more "annoying" things in the world than flies...

To keep things in line with current affairs, lets take the Ebola virus as an example. Lets assume you're right and this virus really was put here by God for some good purpose or another.

The symptoms of Ebola start typically, with a mild fever and flu-like symptoms, which quickly progress to severe vomiting and diarrhea. At this stage, the virus is very unpleasant, but is still comparable with other diseases we regularly face, and consider little more than an annoyance.

As it multiplies, the virus begins to attack every organ of the body, causing the patient to be racked with pain, all the while still suffering with severe vomiting, diarrhea and very high fever.

In some cases, the symptoms become extremely unpleasant. The stuff of nightmares, with the patient bleeding from every orifice. All the while, doubled up in pain, with severe vomiting and diarrhea. At this stage, death is pretty much certain. Some patients have reportedly choked on their own blood.

Now, considering the fact that Ebola, in some cases can kill up to 90% of people it infects, its reasonable to conclude that if it has indeed been created by God for a purpose, then that purpose is to kill people... If that's the case, and God simply wishes for their death (some debatable morality there too, to put it mildly), why then does their death need to be so painful, so undignified, and perhaps worst of all, so unimaginably terrifying? Can you personally imagine the horror of dying from such a disease? I bet you don't even want to go there...

Theists who believe this shit, are then perfectly content to announce that God loves everyone, and that we should love him back, for he is just, and he will always protect his children. Don't give me that shit.

If what you are saying is true, then God is nothing less than a sadistic psychopath, who sees us as his playthings. He does not love you, he does not care about you. If he gave even the slightest fuck about anybody on this planet, he'd end human suffering. I wouldn't ask him for eternal life, or paradise on Earth, I'd simply ask him not to create the things which make human existence a living hell. It is not much to ask of someone... If the Bible is to be believed, then this creation business must take a lot of effort, since had to take a whole fucking day off after making everything else.

So please God, you fucking arsehole, please stop making fucking viruses which kill people in unnecessarily painful, gruesome, undignified and frightening ways. Stop throwing asteroids around our back yard. Stop causing earthquakes, tsunamis and volcanic eruptions. If this is all part of your divine plan, then please, get the fuck on with it. If you can create the entire universe in one week, then I'm sure whatever else is left on your "to do list" could be accomplished in ten fucking minutes, if only you'd stop fucking with us.

FUCK YOU!!!

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03-11-2014, 08:29 PM
RE: Why evil??
(03-11-2014 07:02 PM)Shamma Wrote:  True..

but I was talking about "people who harm others cuz they feel bored and like to add some action in their lives " Big Grin THEY NEED TO BE BUSY IN USEFUL THINGS!!

keeping yourself busy is not the solution for evil, sufferings..! I know that Sleepy
So where are you going with your train of thought?

How are you to get bored people (those who don't care about their future, or don't believe they have a prosperous future) to get busy doing useful things?
Are you going to:
create jobs somehow?
provide free schooling or job training?
provide community clubs which put back into society? How are you going to get people to join? How are you going to motivate them?

Calling them Evil isn't really the solution is it?
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03-11-2014, 08:30 PM
RE: Why evil??
(03-11-2014 03:58 PM)Shamma Wrote:  
(02-11-2014 09:50 PM)Logisch Wrote:  Why do you believe that?


A fly is not evil. A fly is a nuisance, but nuisance is not the same as evil. Correlation does not equal causation and I think you're making large leaps in comparing things like this.


You tell me, what if there was no evil?


Various reasons. Emotional issues, sociopathy, psychopathy, chemical imbalances, greed, lust, vengeance.... emotions are pretty wild. There is a lot of interesting and complex things involved with the human psyche. Hell, even with looking at apes and how they interact with each other and how they handle things socially is pretty crazy. We tend to do a lot of the same primitive stuff when it comes to harming people and motives for doing it.

Why do you think there are bad people?


See my above comment.

What do you think causes people to harm others in the world?

Lots of questions there Tongue thats a good way to control the argument.

When I took a communication course.. we were taught to always ask questions back to control the argument in any debate.. put the component in a *defense" position where he will be the one who is answering the questions.

But I'm not willing to win any debate I just want to have fun and discuss things with people who have different way of thinking.. cuz I believe in what Einstein said: "We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them."

I'm also not trying to win a debate. However, I'm genuinely curious where you stand which is why I answered some questions and also asked them back to you. You'll have to forgive my skepticism but most people who come in here to ask questions usually are not interested in opinions, they pretend like they are interested and then drop page after page of regurgitated stuff to try and convert people and it gets old.

However, if you are genuinely interested in discussion, I'm happy to discuss. But, I am also interested in your perspective as well.

Official ordained minister of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Please pm me with prayer requests to his noodly goodness. Remember, he boiled for your sins and loves you. Carbo Diem! RAmen.
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03-11-2014, 08:42 PM
RE: Why evil??
(03-11-2014 03:58 PM)Shamma Wrote:  I think if there was no evil then we will no longer need many beautiful things like mercy.. helping others.. charity.. giving.. sharing.. defending.. we will no longer need justice.. rules.. laws.. governments..

What you are describing is contrast. Why do you think we would no longer need beautiful things if there was an absence of evil?

Let's say all the sudden everyone on earth gets along. We actually put our heads together and conquer disease, famine, murder, things like cancer and can extend our lives by a huge amount.

During that time, there was no murder and no crime. Imagine that for a moment. Do you think you would need murder and crime to enjoy the good things? Or do you think that it would be more beautiful than before if there was a lack of evil?

People could still be compassionate. People can still be happy, there can still be charity and giving. Lack of food, lack of health, lack of government doesn't make things inherently evil. Imagine the entire human race getting along so well that those things were not necessary, and when people started to starve people fed them, and when people needed a place to live they got it, and when people were sick they got help. I can hardly consider that sad or imagine not needing those things even if there was no crime.

(03-11-2014 03:58 PM)Shamma Wrote:  If there are no diseases we will not find the cure .. there will be no medicines and medical improvements.. we will not need doctors.. medical education..!!

Sure, in a perfect world where everyone lived a long time, with no disease or medical treatment due to our health we wouldn't need those things. But don't you think at that point it would be more impressive if then doctors and researchers could work on other more important things? Life longevity, improving quality of life overall, etc. Do you really need the thought of having terrible disease and see other people suffer to appreciate being alive? Are you not capable of appreciating your life for the good things without needing to contrast the terrible things that happen to enjoy it?

If there were no medical education, imagine perhaps instead there was another industry, or the human race focusing on more important things. Would that be bad? I don't think so.

(03-11-2014 03:58 PM)Shamma Wrote:  If there are no theifs we will not appreciate the expensive things we have.. we will not need honesty and trust!! we will not know the word secure and safe!!

Are you kidding me? Do you really need the threat of someone taking your stuff to feel like you value it? I work hard for my stuff, and the things I work hard for I appreciate because of my hard work, not because I'm constantly scared of someone taking it. Thieves are thieves.

(03-11-2014 03:58 PM)Shamma Wrote:  We will not learn to forgive.. since we will not need to forgive!!

Correct, now imagine if no religion existed at all, there would be no word for it because we wouldn't know it. If a lack of belief in a god did not exist, you would not know the word atheist.

(03-11-2014 03:58 PM)Shamma Wrote:  You can't be good if there was no bad! how will you know what good means?! Wink

What you are describing isn't about good or evil, what you are describing is about contrast. You can't have a word to describe something without something to contrast. You can't understand what dark would be if there were no opposite and if you didn't have eyes to sense it. You wouldn't understand what warm is or cold is if you didn't have sensory input in your nerves to sense it. These would be foreign concepts to you.

If disease literally did not exist, it's likely that it would not even have a vocabulary word for it. There would be no contrast. A healthy state of living would just be that. There would be no contrast for it.

However, the lack of a contrast for something doesn't mean that it not being there is inherently bad, it simply means you wouldn't have something to compare it to, or that you would have no way to describe something by a current definition till you did have something to contrast it to.

Imagine if "evil" or "immoral" things did not exist at all. Would you have a contrast to call something "good" or would you simply know it as.... existing? It doesn't mean that your existence would have less meaning, it simply means you would have a lack of contrast to something you can compare it to.

If your body was never thirsty and you had no reason to drink water, you would never know what it's like to be thirsty. Does that mean that you would never be capable of appreciating what it is to be alive if you didn't get to appreciate drinking water? I think that simply means you would just know what it is to exist without worrying about being thirsty.

Same with good vs evil. If there was a lack of evil and all you knew was good, you would simply know what it is to exist without worrying about it, no contrast to it. You would still be happy, you would still express joy, but you'd call them different things perhaps, and perhaps the way it would be defined would be different.

I hope that clarifies.

Official ordained minister of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Please pm me with prayer requests to his noodly goodness. Remember, he boiled for your sins and loves you. Carbo Diem! RAmen.
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03-11-2014, 08:46 PM
RE: Why evil??
(02-11-2014 07:47 PM)Shamma Wrote:  Plz be deep Smile and give enlightened thoughts

Blink

"Belief is so often the death of reason" - Qyburn, Game of Thrones

"The Christian community continues to exist because the conclusions of the critical study of the Bible are largely withheld from them." -Hans Conzelmann (1915-1989)
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03-11-2014, 09:21 PM
RE: Why evil??
(03-11-2014 03:58 PM)Shamma Wrote:  I think if there was no evil then we will no longer need many beautiful things like mercy.. helping others.. charity..
Wouldn't that be great if people weren't in need for mercy, or help or charity?

I would far prefer them not to need my help than for me to be the hero of the day.
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03-11-2014, 09:26 PM
RE: Why evil??
(03-11-2014 03:58 PM)Shamma Wrote:  I think if there was no evil then we will no longer need many beautiful things like mercy.. helping others.. charity..

SO you're trying to say that the reason your evil god lets children be born into abject poverty, and starvation, and has for tens of thousands of years, even when no one was aware of it, was so others, who knew nothing about it, could be "charitable" ?

Alrighty then. Facepalm

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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04-11-2014, 12:28 AM
RE: Why evil??
(03-11-2014 08:46 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  
(02-11-2014 07:47 PM)Shamma Wrote:  Plz be deep Smile and give enlightened thoughts

Blink

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04-11-2014, 07:28 AM
RE: Why evil??
(03-11-2014 06:55 PM)Shamma Wrote:  With what scale you can measure logic? ..

What do you mean when you say "logic"? The way you use the word doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

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