Why is it ok to hate fat people?
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24-04-2012, 01:04 PM (This post was last modified: 24-04-2012 01:09 PM by germanyt.)
RE: Why is it ok to hate fat people?
(24-04-2012 12:03 PM)Anjele Wrote:  I get that stereotypes can be hurtful...as I said, they are often a shortcut to describing someone...not necessarily right, and not always negative although often so.

I am a short, relatively thin white woman and would be considered middle-class. My usual work is as a bookkeeper. I have been a Girl Scout leader, Boy Scout troop secretary/treasurer, baseball team mom and part-time score keeper. Pretty mundane stuff. I don't dress flashy (usually jean and tshirts) and the only jewelry I wear is a wedding ring. I take college classes, I like to read, I sew. I don't garner much attention, until summer.

See, I have tattoos, several of them. One goes from my right knee to my ankle. It's an impressive piece of work. Most of my ink is on my legs so they are covered until summer when I wear skirts or shorts. Oh boy! The looks I get! I can almost see the gears grinding. And here is my own personal stereotype...old ladies look like I walked in ready to slit their throats. I see actual looks of pure horror. This has gone on since the first one I had done around my ankle. I don't get much reaction from other groups except for people that have ink or want ink and they want to admire or ask questions about mine. Funny thing is that I have grown so used to it that I often don't notice unless someone points it out to me.

Don't judge me cause I have ink. You don't know shit about me.

I don't use stereotypes to judge people. I just know what people mean when they use them...it's a shortcut to what they are trying to say.
I have a couple tattoos as well. One is from my left knee to ankle. I really don't bother with what people think of it. If they want to perceive me as something I'm not based on a tattoo I just let them. Those people mean nothing to me.


(24-04-2012 12:59 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(24-04-2012 12:02 PM)germanyt Wrote:  Basically this. If you are overweight and don't want to be picked on for eating 8 slices of meat lovers pizza then don't eat 8 slices of meat lovers pizza. Or lose the weight and no one will question your choice of diet. And if you can't help eating the 8 slices and can tolerate the ridicule then don't complain about being obese and don't complain about sterotypes.


And I'm not saying that I never stereotype, but I do recognize when I do it, why I'm doing it.

And KC, I only picked up on stereotyping because it's been used here a handful of times to justify why it's ok to mock people who are different.
GT, I wish it were that basic.
I'm 6', 240 pounds. According to "the charts" I'm 70 pounds over what I "should be", and therefore, I'm obese by definition. Do I feel obsese? No. I exercise...hardcore? Sometimes, but more often than not, No. Nor do I eat 8 pieces of meatlover's pizza. I don't eat donuts. IF I go to fast food, I don't eat fries or a dozen burgers. I Can I try harder to lose weight? Yes. Just like I can try harder to not be depressed and anxious. Just like I can try harder to overcome my insomnia.
I wish it were that basic.
I wouldn't get too hung up on what a scale or chart says. Ronnie Coleman is 5'9" and probably 275 lbs here. But would be considered morbidly obese by many body mass tests.

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24-04-2012, 01:09 PM
RE: Why is it ok to hate fat people?
(24-04-2012 01:04 PM)germanyt Wrote:  
(24-04-2012 12:03 PM)Anjele Wrote:  I get that stereotypes can be hurtful...as I said, they are often a shortcut to describing someone...not necessarily right, and not always negative although often so.

I am a short, relatively thin white woman and would be considered middle-class. My usual work is as a bookkeeper. I have been a Girl Scout leader, Boy Scout troop secretary/treasurer, baseball team mom and part-time score keeper. Pretty mundane stuff. I don't dress flashy (usually jean and tshirts) and the only jewelry I wear is a wedding ring. I take college classes, I like to read, I sew. I don't garner much attention, until summer.

See, I have tattoos, several of them. One goes from my right knee to my ankle. It's an impressive piece of work. Most of my ink is on my legs so they are covered until summer when I wear skirts or shorts. Oh boy! The looks I get! I can almost see the gears grinding. And here is my own personal stereotype...old ladies look like I walked in ready to slit their throats. I see actual looks of pure horror. This has gone on since the first one I had done around my ankle. I don't get much reaction from other groups except for people that have ink or want ink and they want to admire or ask questions about mine. Funny thing is that I have grown so used to it that I often don't notice unless someone points it out to me.

Don't judge me cause I have ink. You don't know shit about me.

I don't use stereotypes to judge people. I just know what people mean when they use them...it's a shortcut to what they are trying to say.
I have a couple tattoos as well. One is from my left knee to ankle. I really don't bother with what people think of it. If they want to perceive me as something I'm not based on a tattoo I just let them. Those people mean nothing to me.
Uh-oh...seems we have more in common than originally thought..... Big Grin Heart Tongue

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24-04-2012, 01:28 PM
RE: Why is it ok to hate fat people?
Went out to work in the barn, came back, and had three pages to read. Wow.

One thing stood out more than any other. I swear I'm gonna be bald after this thread dies!

The statement was made a couple of times, in a few different ways. But basically it goes, "stereotyping is wrong, but it's a fact of life and there's nothing you can do about it."

Holy shit. If ANYTHING is flat out wrong in this thread, it's that! And if I need to explain why that line of thinking is completely fucked up than it's a lost cause anyways, so I won't bother.

You want overweight people to start taking responsibility for their weight? Fair enough. But practice what you preach. Start taking ownership of the part YOU play in making them feel like shit.

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24-04-2012, 01:30 PM
RE: Why is it ok to hate fat people?
(24-04-2012 01:28 PM)Stark Raving Wrote:  Went out to work in the barn, came back, and had three pages to read. Wow.

One thing stood out more than any other. I swear I'm gonna be bald after this thread dies!

The statement was made a couple of times, in a few different ways. But basically it goes, "stereotyping is wrong, but it's a fact of life and there's nothing you can do about it."

Holy shit. If ANYTHING is flat out wrong in this thread, it's that! And if I need to explain why that line of thinking is completely fucked up than it's a lost cause anyways, so I won't bother.

You want overweight people to start taking responsibility for their weight? Fair enough. But practice what you preach. Start taking ownership of the part YOU play in making them feel like shit.


Amen, Brother.
Now the only thing I'm beating myself up about is that I spent too much time arguing with people who don't get it instead of going home and smoking some herb.

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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24-04-2012, 01:36 PM
RE: Why is it ok to hate fat people?
(24-04-2012 01:28 PM)Stark Raving Wrote:  You want overweight people to start taking responsibility for their weight? Fair enough. But practice what you preach. Start taking ownership of the part YOU play in making them feel like shit.
In the old days ridiculing and shaming someone was a good tool to make them change. Tongue

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24-04-2012, 01:39 PM
RE: Why is it ok to hate fat people?
(24-04-2012 01:28 PM)Stark Raving Wrote:  Went out to work in the barn, came back, and had three pages to read. Wow.

One thing stood out more than any other. I swear I'm gonna be bald after this thread dies!

The statement was made a couple of times, in a few different ways. But basically it goes, "stereotyping is wrong, but it's a fact of life and there's nothing you can do about it."

Holy shit. If ANYTHING is flat out wrong in this thread, it's that! And if I need to explain why that line of thinking is completely fucked up than it's a lost cause anyways, so I won't bother.

You want overweight people to start taking responsibility for their weight? Fair enough. But practice what you preach. Start taking ownership of the part YOU play in making them feel like shit.
I pretty much addressed all this in my last post.

There is something that I want to address, though, Stark:

"The statement was made a couple of times, in a few different ways. But
basically it goes, "stereotyping is wrong, but it's a fact of life and
there's nothing you can do about it."

Holy shit. If ANYTHING is
flat out wrong in this thread, it's that! And if I need to explain why
that line of thinking is completely fucked up than it's a lost cause
anyways, so I won't bother."

Try applying that logic to anything else.

Crime, for example. Crime is negative. Crime is going to happen. And, there isn't anything you can do to stop it.

Now, you can take stances against it. Heck, there are even people who actively fight it. If you don't want to be affected by crime you are going to take precautions to avoid areas with crime.

If you're walking through the 3rd Ward of New Orleans at 2 AM with $500 and get murdered, then yes, you were a victim, but you really didn't do much to prevent that from happening.

Stereotypes exists just like crime exists. We have to deal with it. It's preposterous to think that it's going to disappear simply because it's wrong.

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24-04-2012, 01:43 PM
RE: Why is it ok to hate fat people?
Close.

In the old days ridiculing and shaming someone was a tool to make them change.
I know you were using humor, and I apologies for taking this so seriously. I suppose an explanation is in order.


I've bandaged the wrists of a person who cut them, because she could no longer cope with the ridicule she endured from a false stereotype.
Unfortunately, she did a good job. I still miss her, and hearing people I care for and respect (KC, and GT, you both fall into that category) justify stereotyping brings back a whole lotta pain.

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24-04-2012, 01:52 PM
RE: Why is it ok to hate fat people?
(24-04-2012 01:43 PM)Stark Raving Wrote:  Close.

In the old days ridiculing and shaming someone was a tool to make them change.
I know you were using humor, and I apologies for taking this so seriously. I suppose an explanation is in order.


I've bandaged the wrists of a person who cut them, because she could no longer cope with the ridicule she endured from a false stereotype.
Unfortunately, she did a good job. I still miss her, and hearing people I care for and respect (KC, and GT, you both fall into that category) justify stereotyping brings back a whole lotta pain.
I think you know me well enough to know that I would never say or do anything out of malice. I can accidentally offend, but I can safely say I would never do that intentionally.

Stereotyping does have negative effects, and yes, it can be detrimental. This was never the point I was trying to argue. The only thing I addressed was the factual nature of stereotyping - ie, generally it's true, and people shouldn't fulfill stereotypes.

I'm sorry about your loss. I can't imagine.

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24-04-2012, 02:09 PM
RE: Why is it ok to hate fat people?
(24-04-2012 01:52 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(24-04-2012 01:43 PM)Stark Raving Wrote:  Close.

In the old days ridiculing and shaming someone was a tool to make them change.
I know you were using humor, and I apologies for taking this so seriously. I suppose an explanation is in order.


I've bandaged the wrists of a person who cut them, because she could no longer cope with the ridicule she endured from a false stereotype.
Unfortunately, she did a good job. I still miss her, and hearing people I care for and respect (KC, and GT, you both fall into that category) justify stereotyping brings back a whole lotta pain.
I think you know me well enough to know that I would never say or do anything out of malice. I can accidentally offend, but I can safely say I would never do that intentionally.

Stereotyping does have negative effects, and yes, it can be detrimental. This was never the point I was trying to argue. The only thing I addressed was the factual nature of stereotyping - ie, generally it's true, and people shouldn't fulfill stereotypes.

I'm sorry about your loss. I can't imagine.
And the only reason I argue with you so passionately is that I DO know you would never intentionally hurt someone. If you were someone I didn't respect and value, I wouldn't have bothered going so deeply into it. A friend is someone you can argue with, even fight with, and walk away still respecting. What really cut me was when you made the comment about fat people stuffing their faces. That's just not you man. There was malice there, and I'll call you on it every day of the week, because I know it's beneath you.

As for all the rest of it, here's where I stand, stated as clearly as I can:

Stereotypes suck. They hurt people, they obscure facts, they hinder progress, and they all exist because WE allow them to.

I refuse to accept that we cannot change this. I'm gonna dig my heels in like a Christian (see what I did just there?) and stand firm. Just one person, standing up just one time and saying, "hey, that's a stereotype. It ain't a joke, and you shouldn't do it" is how we change it.

Not possible? The solution is too simple? I call bullshit.

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24-04-2012, 02:19 PM
RE: Why is it ok to hate fat people?
(24-04-2012 11:58 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  You seem to have the misconception that I'm defending stereotyping. Stereotyping, in general, is wrong. Everything you said is right about it demeaning others.

But, I'm a realist. Stereotypes exist. Nothing we can do about it. A stereotyped individual can further their case by not fulfilling a stereotype. Fulfilling a stereotype and saying, "You don't know me, so you shouldn't stereotype" is not helping.

It's a two way street. For stereotyping to disappear, people need to consciously make the decision to not stereotype and the person being stereotyped needs to do everything they can to not fulfill their stereotype.

On a personal note: Do I stereotype? Unfortunately, I do on occasions. I'm not perfect, and I try to not do it; however, sometimes it happen unconsciously. It's just something that I had to train myself to not do.
Stereotypes are so stereotypically incorrect and offensive.

All generalizations are false, including this one.

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