Why is it that creationist are trying to disprove evolution
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16-11-2011, 04:39 AM
RE: Why is it that creationist are trying to disprove evolution
Another thing to consider is that evolution tells us that we are mere animals. Religion on the other hand tells people that they are very special, they are gods chosen. These are two very conflicting ideas.

Its like trying to tell movie celebrities their opinions aren't more valuable because they show up on the TV. They are deluded with fame.
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24-09-2015, 09:06 PM
RE: Why is it that creationist are trying to disprove evolution
(04-08-2011 09:21 AM)digitali Wrote:  Do they know that if they succeed, it doesn't prove creationism anyway?Smile

I do know this.
why do they try to disprove evolution? good question. I have no idea.

English is not my native language.
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24-09-2015, 09:46 PM
RE: Why is it that creationist are trying to disprove evolution
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10-10-2015, 07:32 PM (This post was last modified: 11-10-2015 09:11 AM by FrozenSea.)
RE: Why is it that creationist are trying to disprove evolution
If you don't mind me piggybacking onto the necroposting, I'd like to add some perspective as to why there's so much pushback against evolution from fundamentalist Christians.

One of the reasons why evolution is seen as such a large problem is it contradicts the effects of original sin. Romans 5:12 says that "Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men[a] because all sinned". Death entered the world because of sin, implying that before Adam and Eve sinned, there was no death.

Ken Ham, from Answers in Genesis, elaborates:

Quote:If a Christian accepts the history of death over millions of years, then when God stated in Genesis 1:31 that everything He had made was “very good,” this would mean that death, suffering, violence, and diseases like cancer (as represented in the fossil record) were also “very good.”

If death existed before the original sin, then death is not a consequence of sin as it says in Romans 6:23: "For the wages of sin is death...".

Without sin and death occurring as it does in Genesis, the entire narrative of Christ's death as propitiation becomes a moot point. The entire purpose of Christianity falls out the bottom since evolution is shown to be most likely correct.
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11-10-2015, 10:10 AM
RE: Why is it that creationist are trying to disprove evolution
(10-10-2015 07:32 PM)FrozenSea Wrote:  One of the reasons why evolution is seen as such a large problem is it contradicts the effects of original sin. Romans 5:12 says that "Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men[a] because all sinned". Death entered the world because of sin, implying that before Adam and Eve sinned, there was no death.
I have never heard this argument of theists.
"Death spread to all men". It doesn't say anything about animals.

Adam and Eve lived in the garden of Eden according to the Bible. It was comfortable world according to the Bible. But what was going on outside of the garden before Adam and Eve appeared on Earth? What was going on while Gods were organizing the Earth during 6 days of creation? The Bible is silent. So, how do they know there was no death of animals(fauna) and plants(flora)?

P.S. Prophets of the Bible do NOT have problem with evolution.Thumbsup

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11-10-2015, 10:56 AM
RE: Why is it that creationist are trying to disprove evolution
(11-10-2015 10:10 AM)Alla Wrote:  
(10-10-2015 07:32 PM)FrozenSea Wrote:  One of the reasons why evolution is seen as such a large problem is it contradicts the effects of original sin. Romans 5:12 says that "Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men[a] because all sinned". Death entered the world because of sin, implying that before Adam and Eve sinned, there was no death.
I have never heard this argument of theists.
"Death spread to all men". It doesn't say anything about animals.

Adam and Eve lived in the garden of Eden according to the Bible. It was comfortable world according to the Bible. But what was going on outside of the garden before Adam and Eve appeared on Earth? What was going on while Gods were organizing the Earth during 6 days of creation? The Bible is silent. So, how do they know there was no death of animals(fauna) and plants(flora)?

P.S. Prophets of the Bible do NOT have problem with evolution.Thumbsup

As a result of sin God's supreme creation, Man, became corrupt and mortal. However, this does not change the fact that Man is God's supreme creation. If the supreme creation is mortal then so to must all lesser creations be mortal, otherwise the lesser would be superior to the greater.

See how it works?
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11-10-2015, 03:01 PM
RE: Why is it that creationist are trying to disprove evolution
(11-10-2015 10:56 AM)jabeady Wrote:  As a result of sin God's supreme creation, Man, became corrupt and mortal. However, this does not change the fact that Man is God's supreme creation.
what do you mean when you say that "Man is God's supreme creation"?
(11-10-2015 10:56 AM)jabeady Wrote:  If the supreme creation is mortal then so to must all lesser creations be mortal, otherwise the lesser would be superior to the greater.
See how it works?
what does it mean "lesser creation" of God?
Chapter 1 of Genesis and chapter 2 of Genesis tell us two different stories.
Genesis chapter 1: 27 God created man in His own image.
Genesis chapter 2: 7 God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life.
Genesis chapter 1: 11-12: God said, let the earth bring forth grass, herb, seed, fruit.
and the EARTH BROUGHT forth grass, herb, seed, fruit
Genesis chapter 2: God CREATED plant of the field BEFORE it was in the earth, and (He CREATED) every herb BEFORE it grew on earth.

So, in Gen 1 God says that He caused earth to bring forth flora. In chapter 2 God says that He already created flora BEFORE it was in the earth.
Genesis is silent about many things. Creation story is not complete in the Bible.
It could be death long before Adam and Eve and MODERN forms of life(flora and fauna) appeared on earth.

All flora and fauna which existed before Adam and Eve appeared could be mortal. But Adam and Eve and modern flora and fauna were immortal. For how long? 10 min? 1 hour? 1 day? 10 days? 1 year?..???
But when Adam fell all modern flora and fauna fell, too.
P.S. The book of Genesis has no problem with evolution.

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11-10-2015, 04:28 PM
RE: Why is it that creationist are trying to disprove evolution
Sorry, Alla, but I don't accept the Bible's authority, I don't accept the authority of the various LDS screeds, and I've seen way too many of your posts to either accept your claims of expertise or to want to put up with your twisting and torturing of those same sources. You have shown yourself to be both dishonest and inept. I choose not to engage, and this will be my one and only acknowledgement that you exist.
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11-10-2015, 06:42 PM
RE: Why is it that creationist are trying to disprove evolution
(11-10-2015 04:28 PM)jabeady Wrote:  Sorry, Alla, but I don't accept the Bible's authority, I don't accept the authority of the various LDS screeds, and I've seen way too many of your posts to either accept your claims of expertise or to want to put up with your twisting and torturing of those same sources. You have shown yourself to be both dishonest and inept. I choose not to engage, and this will be my one and only acknowledgement that you exist.
I choose to respect your opinion and choice. Smile

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11-10-2015, 07:19 PM
RE: Why is it that creationist are trying to disprove evolution
(10-10-2015 07:32 PM)FrozenSea Wrote:  If you don't mind me piggybacking onto the necroposting, I'd like to add some perspective as to why there's so much pushback against evolution from fundamentalist Christians.

One of the reasons why evolution is seen as such a large problem is it contradicts the effects of original sin. Romans 5:12 says that "Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men[a] because all sinned". Death entered the world because of sin, implying that before Adam and Eve sinned, there was no death.

Ken Ham, from Answers in Genesis, elaborates:

Quote:If a Christian accepts the history of death over millions of years, then when God stated in Genesis 1:31 that everything He had made was “very good,” this would mean that death, suffering, violence, and diseases like cancer (as represented in the fossil record) were also “very good.”

If death existed before the original sin, then death is not a consequence of sin as it says in Romans 6:23: "For the wages of sin is death...".

Without sin and death occurring as it does in Genesis, the entire narrative of Christ's death as propitiation becomes a moot point. The entire purpose of Christianity falls out the bottom since evolution is shown to be most likely correct.

The first reason why many in the general public doubt the theory of evolution is due to belief in a supernatural causal effect. If for example, one subscribes to one of the anthropocentric Abrahamic faiths, say for example Christianity, and then points to the Bible as argument from authority to explain the real world around us, and from whence we came, this prevents the believer from accepting empirical evidence of a scientific nature to explain life. Since religious belief requires faith, and faith is the belief in something without evidence, faith is a failed methodology in which to comprehend the inner workings of the world around us.

If a belief is based on insufficient evidence; than any further conclusion drawn from the belief will at best be of questionable value. This cannot point one to the path of truth. As a tool, as an epistemology, as a method of reasoning, as a process for knowing the world, faith cannot adjudicate between competing claims. The ONLY way to figure out which claims about the world are likely true, and which are likely false, is through reason and evidence. There is no other way….yet.

“Science is the antithesis of faith. Science is a process that contains multiple and redundant checks, balances, and safeguards against human bias and error. Science has a built in corrective mechanism..hypothesis testing...that weeds out false claims. Claims that come about as a result of a scientific process are held as tentatively true by scientists..unlike claims of faith that are held as eternally true with zero evidence. Related to this, claims that come about as a result of a scientific process are falsifiable, that is, there is a way to show the claims are false. This is not the case with faith claims. For example, there's no way to falsify the claim that the Norse god Loki was able to assume other forms.

Scientists try to prove claims false (falsification), unlike faith leaders who unequivocally state their faith claims are true. If a scientist can demonstrate that a popular scientific claim is false, he or she can become famous, get tenure, publish books, earn more money and become respected by her or his peers. If a preacher states that the claims of his faith tradition are false, he's excommunicated, defrocked or otherwise forced to abandon his position”(Boghossian 2013)...the stifling of growth and enlightenment basically.

Science is a method for advancing our understanding. It is process we can use to bring us closer to the truth, and to weed out false claims. Science thus is the best way we've currently found to explain and understand how the universe works. This doesn’t set well with those who clutch supernatural, extraordinary, and unprovable theological faith claims, and that is a problem as it not only impacts their ability to understand and accept basic scientific principles, but it actually creates a barrier to moving on to better methods of epistemology. The reason creationism is not taught in public school is because it lacks any evidence. There is a good reason evolution is taught in public school, it is because it has evidence.

A second reason why many in the general public doubt the theory of evolution is due to lack of education and understanding of scientific methods. The problem comes with the word theory, those unfamiliar with scientific terms think that theory is something, “not quite right”, a speculation, a guess, and very likely wrong.

“According to the Oxford English dictionary, a scientific theory is “a statement of what are held to be the general laws, principles, or causes of something known or observed.” (Coyne 2009) in science, a theory is much more than just a speculation about how things are: it is a well thought out group of propositions meant to explain facts about the real world.”

I believe it is due to lack of understanding of the plethora of empirical and scientific evidence proving evolution that prevents some from accepting it.

References:

Boghossian, Peter. A manual for creating atheists. Durham, NC. Pitchstone Publishing. 2013. Print.

Coyne, J. (2009) Why evolution is true. London: Penguin Books Ltd.

"Belief is so often the death of reason" - Qyburn, Game of Thrones

"The Christian community continues to exist because the conclusions of the critical study of the Bible are largely withheld from them." -Hans Conzelmann (1915-1989)
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