Why should a deity exist?
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10-01-2017, 03:19 PM
RE: Why should a deity exist?
(10-01-2017 03:07 PM)Impulse Wrote:  
(10-01-2017 02:33 PM)Cypher44 Wrote:  "Why do I suffer"
It's God, man he's testing you

Why would an omniscient (which you said in
another thread) god need to test anything when he/she/it already knows everything? Consider


I think with humans, with an incredibly complex and difficult question. Most people just take the easiest answer they can find.. Without stopping to consider any contradictions like the one you pointed out. -C

Oh no. He's here - God
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10-01-2017, 03:23 PM
RE: Why should a deity exist?
You do give an explanation on why many people believe in God, but that doesn't necessarly mean that belief in God is necessary or even desirable in the first place. In the same vein, people kill each other because they are angry, affraid and competing against one another. That's an explanation of why they are doing it. It doesn't make killing each other desirable or even necessary. I don't think that belief in God is useful or necessary. Your agument seems to rest on a fallacous appeal to nature.

Freedom is servitude to justice and intellectual honesty.
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10-01-2017, 03:41 PM
RE: Why should a deity exist?
(10-01-2017 02:33 PM)Cypher44 Wrote:  So.. after my last posts, and the users on this site making it clear, I'm just repeating stuff. I got a good question from a couple of users on this site.

Why does there need to be an deity??
Good question.
The answer :

He may not exist at all but His apparent existence is a sort of comfort for believers
on points such as suffering, the idea of reward for it, the deity also provides a convenient and easy explanation for those hard to explain things i.e.

"Why do I suffer"
It's God, man he's testing you

Like the above, its human nature to try and find answers even if there aren't any.

So in short, there needs to be a deity because His existence helps the vast majority of people just cope with day to day life (I guess) and some people can't accept that the world may JUST HAVE EXISTED, they need a cause and for them, that cause is God..

Be nice in the comments Wink

For the people who choose to believe in G-d (for whatever reason), go right ahead. No one is stopping you. -But for some reason, the fact that some people don't believe in G-d drives the fundies absolutely bananas and they feel this crazy compulsion to change the other person's opinion, as if changing that opinion will change anything at all.

How about we all just strive to contribute positively to society and worry about our own damn thoughts and not the thoughts of others.
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10-01-2017, 03:43 PM
RE: Why should a deity exist?
The Flying Spaghetti Monster isn't amused................

...

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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10-01-2017, 05:07 PM (This post was last modified: 10-01-2017 05:10 PM by RocketSurgeon76.)
RE: Why should a deity exist?
(10-01-2017 03:41 PM)Aliza Wrote:  
(10-01-2017 02:33 PM)Cypher44 Wrote:  So.. after my last posts, and the users on this site making it clear, I'm just repeating stuff. I got a good question from a couple of users on this site.

Why does there need to be an deity??
Good question.
The answer :

He may not exist at all but His apparent existence is a sort of comfort for believers
on points such as suffering, the idea of reward for it, the deity also provides a convenient and easy explanation for those hard to explain things i.e.

"Why do I suffer"
It's God, man he's testing you

Like the above, its human nature to try and find answers even if there aren't any.

So in short, there needs to be a deity because His existence helps the vast majority of people just cope with day to day life (I guess) and some people can't accept that the world may JUST HAVE EXISTED, they need a cause and for them, that cause is God..

Be nice in the comments Wink

For the people who choose to believe in G-d (for whatever reason), go right ahead. No one is stopping you. -But for some reason, the fact that some people don't believe in G-d drives the fundies absolutely bananas and they feel this crazy compulsion to change the other person's opinion, as if changing that opinion will change anything at all.

How about we all just strive to contribute positively to society and worry about our own damn thoughts and not the thoughts of others.

Aliza, it's funny how you phrased it. My educational background focused on viral genetics. In virology, there's something called "virulence", which essentially means how powerfully the virus acts to propagate itself in the host (cause disease) and spread into new hosts. The DNA (or RNA) code of the virus determines how virulent it is, of course. Sometimes, a virus of one type which is relatively harmless and of low virulence will acquire a mutation or pick up a fragment from another source, and suddenly a low virulence virus becomes a plague.

That's really how I see Christianity, vis-a-vis Judaism. I see religion as a Dawkins-style meme (not internet meme), a program that our brains acquire and operate, just as is true for English or "how to make bread", et cetera. Their program is a mutated form of Judaism which warped several of the old "genes" (scriptural passages) into new meanings, and incorporated external genes from "pagan" religions and philosophies, to morph into a new and more powerful meme, in terms of virulence.

Your version of G-d doesn't contain the code that says "propagate at all costs", and is therefore relatively unobtrusive and inoffensive... a low-virulence meme. Only in the face of Christianity or other "we must be the One True Faith™ religion" programs do your people really run into problems, by simple dint of being resistant to the "propagate at all costs" virulent meme. Atheists run into the same problem and get a similar push-back.

I suspect that's why you feel relatively at home here, and why we all like you so much. Smile

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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10-01-2017, 08:18 PM
RE: Why should a deity exist?
(10-01-2017 05:07 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  
(10-01-2017 03:41 PM)Aliza Wrote:  For the people who choose to believe in G-d (for whatever reason), go right ahead. No one is stopping you. -But for some reason, the fact that some people don't believe in G-d drives the fundies absolutely bananas and they feel this crazy compulsion to change the other person's opinion, as if changing that opinion will change anything at all.

How about we all just strive to contribute positively to society and worry about our own damn thoughts and not the thoughts of others.

Aliza, it's funny how you phrased it. My educational background focused on viral genetics. In virology, there's something called "virulence", which essentially means how powerfully the virus acts to propagate itself in the host (cause disease) and spread into new hosts. The DNA (or RNA) code of the virus determines how virulent it is, of course. Sometimes, a virus of one type which is relatively harmless and of low virulence will acquire a mutation or pick up a fragment from another source, and suddenly a low virulence virus becomes a plague.

That's really how I see Christianity, vis-a-vis Judaism. I see religion as a Dawkins-style meme (not internet meme), a program that our brains acquire and operate, just as is true for English or "how to make bread", et cetera. Their program is a mutated form of Judaism which warped several of the old "genes" (scriptural passages) into new meanings, and incorporated external genes from "pagan" religions and philosophies, to morph into a new and more powerful meme, in terms of virulence.

Your version of G-d doesn't contain the code that says "propagate at all costs", and is therefore relatively unobtrusive and inoffensive... a low-virulence meme. Only in the face of Christianity or other "we must be the One True Faith™ religion" programs do your people really run into problems, by simple dint of being resistant to the "propagate at all costs" virulent meme. Atheists run into the same problem and get a similar push-back.

I suspect that's why you feel relatively at home here, and why we all like you so much. Smile

Well said! I've also noted that I have more in common with the atheist community than not. We have many shared goals and those goals that we don't share generally don't conflict with one another.
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10-01-2017, 08:18 PM
RE: Why should a deity exist?
(10-01-2017 02:33 PM)Cypher44 Wrote:  its human nature to try and find answers even if there aren't any.
It is a regrettable human tendency, but far from necessary.

The proper thing to do is to learn to sit with uncertainty. When you don't know the answer to a thing, you don't make something up; you admit that you don't know. You withhold belief in random things until there is something worthy to afford belief to. Something substantiated. Something logical.

I'll take hard truths over comforting lies any day.

Besides, religious faith is a lousy answer to human suffering and need.
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10-01-2017, 09:11 PM
RE: Why should a deity exist?
(10-01-2017 02:33 PM)Cypher44 Wrote:  He may not exist at all but His apparent existence is a sort of comfort for believers
on points such as suffering, the idea of reward for it, the deity also provides a convenient and easy explanation for those hard to explain things i.e.

Because the marriage of the predator and the gullible breeds victims.

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10-01-2017, 09:30 PM
Why should a deity exist?
(10-01-2017 02:33 PM)Cypher44 Wrote:  So.. after my last posts, and the users on this site making it clear, I'm just repeating stuff. I got a good question from a couple of users on this site.

Why does there need to be an deity??
Good question.
The answer :

He may not exist at all but His apparent existence is a sort of comfort for believers
It was a source of agony for me when I was a believer.

Every time the fucker let me down I was either mad or confused as to why.

Also, the thought of hell was hell in itself. What bullshit.

Quote:on points such as suffering, the idea of reward for it, the deity also provides a convenient and easy explanation for those hard to explain things i.e.
What an absurd way of looking at life.
Quote:"Why do I suffer"
It's God, man he's testing you
Because he is a dick. After all he knows what you will do in reaction to his test. He just enjoys seeing you suffer.
Quote:Like the above, its human nature to try and find answers even if there aren't any.
Why not accept that there isn't an answer to everything. Shit just happens. Accept it and move on.

Quote:So in short, there needs to be a deity because His existence helps the vast majority of people just cope with day to day life
Only because they are brainwashed to think so.

Quote:(I guess)
Doubt. You just took the first step to sanity.
Quote:and some people can't accept that the world may JUST HAVE EXISTED, they need a cause and for them, that cause is God..
Further brainwashing.
Quote:Be nice in the comments Wink
I was.
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10-01-2017, 09:51 PM
RE: Why should a deity exist?
(10-01-2017 02:33 PM)Cypher44 Wrote:  So in short, there needs to be a deity because His existence helps the vast majority of people just cope with day to day life (I guess) and some people can't accept that the world may JUST HAVE EXISTED, they need a cause and for them, that cause is God..

I'd argue it doesn't need to be a deity. Sometimes a 6' invisible rabbit named Harvey can work even better. Other times all I need is my blankie and thumb. ... and this lamp ...

(10-01-2017 02:33 PM)Cypher44 Wrote:  Be nice in the comments Wink

Blink .... wait let me clean my glasses ...... bwawahahahaahaha

#sigh
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