Why you choose to not believe?
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31-10-2014, 03:50 PM
RE: Why you choose to not believe?
(31-10-2014 03:38 PM)Switz5678 Wrote:  
(31-10-2014 03:27 PM)cjlr Wrote:  The point I was trying to make to you a little earlier was that if you know so little about something as to be unable to make any statistical assessment whatsoever, then it must also be true that you know so little about it that it cannot be in any way meaningful.

What do you mean by "it cannot be in any meaningful way"?

a thousand years ago we knew so little about the x-ray spectrum of light that we couldn't make a statistical assessment whatsoever. We now know that the probability of this is 100 percent

We didn't just know "so little", we knew literally nothing.

Do you see the difference? With that complete lack of knowledge one cannot even propose the idea - because there is nothing to propose.

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31-10-2014, 04:00 PM (This post was last modified: 31-10-2014 04:23 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Why you choose to not believe?
[Image: god.jpg]

(31-10-2014 01:38 PM)Switz5678 Wrote:  If that makes you happy, and its no harm to anyone(including yourself) then fuck yeah my man entertain it

It's not that it makes me happy, it's that I have no choice but to believe it since all evidence points in that direction. Now bow down before The Lord Thy God ... bitch.

#sigh
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31-10-2014, 04:08 PM (This post was last modified: 31-10-2014 04:13 PM by Switz5678.)
RE: Why you choose to not believe?
(31-10-2014 03:41 PM)Chas Wrote:  The point is that we estimate these. All the time.

I know we do. I also know that using these estimates, with so little real tangible information to support them (if any), to make assertion in an argument is dumb.

you stated this

"There is no evidence for any gods, so the probability that any do seems very low"

I focused on you because you came/come off as condescending during this whole discussion. I will give you the benefit of the doubt because you stated 'seems'. There's little doubt in my mind that you're bright as hell, and know your shit. I don't feel like arguing with you about it anymore.. I really don't think we are that far apart in what we're saying.
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31-10-2014, 04:11 PM
RE: Why you choose to not believe?
(31-10-2014 03:50 PM)cjlr Wrote:  We didn't just know "so little", we knew literally nothing.

Do you see the difference? With that complete lack of knowledge one cannot even propose the idea - because there is nothing to propose.

Yeah I see what you mean, and its a good point. I appreciate your thoughts on the matter.
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31-10-2014, 06:05 PM
RE: Why you choose to not believe?
So I can look forward to none of my points or objections being addressed at all then?

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31-10-2014, 06:30 PM
RE: Why you choose to not believe?
(29-10-2014 04:28 PM)Switz5678 Wrote:  I can understand the obvious flaws in all the mainstream religious belief systems. What I can't understand is why the choice to believe in a Godless universe without the chance of afterlife? or even an afterlife without a God entity?
------------------------------------
I guess my basic line of reasoning can be summed up as follows..

-We're unable to discern a method to establish the likelihood of one, or the other.
-I see life/living as preferable to death/nonexisting.
-In the absence of the ability to discern possibility/probability you should choose what makes you most happy.

My end game from this would be that its rational to believe, and not rational to not believe.
---------------------------------------

Anyways, I'm interested in hearing your views

By your reasoning, I should believe that I will win the lottery, and spend my money on it, simply because I would like to be a millionaire. The odds that I will actually win are effectively zero, just like the odds of the existence of a god who refuses to provide any self-supporting evidence are effectively zero.

Pinning one's hopes to some fantasy, with absolutely zero evidence of its truth or actual possibility, is delusional, wasteful, and a sure path to either financial or spiritual bankruptcy.
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31-10-2014, 10:21 PM
RE: Why you choose to not believe?
(31-10-2014 06:05 PM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  So I can look forward to none of my points or objections being addressed at all then?

I will tomorrow perhaps..
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31-10-2014, 10:32 PM (This post was last modified: 31-10-2014 10:55 PM by Switz5678.)
RE: Why you choose to not believe?
(31-10-2014 06:30 PM)MarkMac Wrote:  by your reasoning, I should believe that I will win the lottery, and spend my money on it, simply because I would like to be a millionaire. The odds that I will actually win are effectively zero, just like the odds of the existence of a god who refuses to provide any self-supporting evidence are effectively zero.

Pinning one's hopes to some fantasy, with absolutely zero evidence of its truth or actual possibility, is delusional, wasteful, and a sure path to either financial or spiritual bankruptcy.

Haha! Its hilarious that on one side you say the existence is effectively zero, and then go on to point out pinning hopes without an actual possibility is blah blah blah.

You have no idea if the odds are effectively zero. You dont. I'll repeat. You don't.

If you want to provide how you ascertained the odds based on some reasoning/measure/test that would be applicable to all then please do so. If you find that your "odds" are nothing but some gross estimate derived in your head... Please consider you don't know what the hell You're talking about when it comes to odds.

I can think of a couple of legitimate ways of finding probabilities

-summing all possible out comes and then dividing what your looking for by that sum. completely Accurate
-repeated events through history in which we can form some likelihood factor off of. Can vary wildly from Very accurate to not accurate at all
-Proving it true. Completely Accurate
-Proving it false. Completely Accurate

There are most likely more, but I'm inebriated and tired
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31-10-2014, 10:34 PM (This post was last modified: 31-10-2014 10:42 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Why you choose to not believe?
(31-10-2014 10:21 PM)Switz5678 Wrote:  
(31-10-2014 06:05 PM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  So I can look forward to none of my points or objections being addressed at all then?

I will tomorrow perhaps..

Please don't. You're an incapable idiot.

#sigh
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31-10-2014, 10:49 PM
RE: Why you choose to not believe?
(31-10-2014 12:34 PM)Switz5678 Wrote:  
(31-10-2014 12:13 PM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  I'm not choosing not to believe. What a person believes shouldn't be a choice. It's an involuntary result of the information and knowledge they have.

Yeah, I should have worded this one better. I'm sorry

No need to apologize to me. You can always lie to yourself to try to make yourself feel better. You know, pretend to have "faith" in the existence of an afterlife/god. If every logical part of your brain says that the possibility seems irrational, then I doubt it will give you much peace.
Seems, to me, like it would be better to accept what seems most realistic and learn to be happy with that.

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