World wide war on drugs.
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20-12-2011, 11:53 AM
RE: World wide war on drugs.
(20-12-2011 11:50 AM)Chas Wrote:  I don't see how you reach that conclusion. Mass produced drugs, shipped and sold legally, not requiring armies of thugs or payoffs to governments should be significantly cheaper.
And everything you buy on the street is already dangerous.

And if you are buying a legal drug you don't have to worry about it being cut with rat poison or something like that, plus you don't have to worry about an unusually strong batch coming along and killing you.

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21-12-2011, 02:25 AM
RE: World wide war on drugs.
(20-12-2011 11:50 AM)Chas Wrote:  I don't see how you reach that conclusion. Mass produced drugs, shipped and sold legally, not requiring armies of thugs or payoffs to governments should be significantly cheaper.
And everything you buy on the street is already dangerous.
what conclusion? If it would go like with cigarettes who are everything but cheap, and I know for a fact that you get them cheap and bad on the black market, the same thing could happen with all other drugs you would legalize.
You get the good stuff government regulated but on the black market you get the bad stuff cheap.
Also it depends on the dealer how good or bad the stuff is. They all have a reputation. And people know where to go for the good and for the bad stuff.

"Freedom is the freedom to say that 2+2=4" - George Orwell (in 1984)
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21-12-2011, 02:29 AM
RE: World wide war on drugs.
(20-12-2011 11:50 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(20-12-2011 11:05 AM)Leela Wrote:  I have a pro and a contra argument here:

pro:
State could do it like with alcohol and cigarettes. Put taxes on it so the state actually earn on it. Plus have regulations and rules and age restrictions. That would make the use safer for the user. That would kick the overpriced black market out of business (not the black market as a whole).
I see no problem with doing it with all drugs even the hard ones. Let's say cocaine. It can be deadly but it is illegal - alcohol can be deadly but is legal. Both are VERY addicting and people are dieing from both a lot. I see no difference, at least no big difference.

contra:
It would increase the black market for the drugs that are mixed badly. That are streched but cheap, and lots of people might start using the unregulated stuff only because it is cheaper.

I don't see how you reach that conclusion. Mass produced drugs, shipped and sold legally, not requiring armies of thugs or payoffs to governments should be significantly cheaper.
And everything you buy on the street is already dangerous.

I'd like to see the evidence for how weed is dangerous.

In fact, I'd like to see the evidence for how it's worse than alcohol and tobacco.

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21-12-2011, 07:01 AM (This post was last modified: 21-12-2011 07:05 AM by Filox.)
RE: World wide war on drugs.
Erxomai, you will not find ANY evidence supporting dangerous weed, at least not long term damage. All it does is just short term, your body returns to normal after a while when you stop using weed. But I can give you tons of evidence how it is a cure/help/relieve for all sorts of illness, primary the brain damage and how it HELPS REGENERATE brain cells, not kill them, as we are told most of our life. But, since I hate repeating myself, I will now go and dig the old threads from the forum, where we have discussed this over and over and give you all links here. Here goes...

http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...ible-plant

http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...s-Ketamine

http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...othy-Leary

http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...-of-smoker

http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...Ape-Theory

Ahhh, and I managed to find the same thread as this one: http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...ther-drugs

There is The Official Cannabis thread as well: http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...bis-Thread

After you read ALL of this, you will get a better perspective into this subject and you can make better judgment on your own. Smile

Enjoy.

P.S.
Hey new admin, here is some work for you, if you want, you can put some of these threads together, so I don't have to kill myself every time somebody new comes to the forum and starts the same subject again and again...

Smile

Oh yeah, I'm all for legalizing. The main reason is TOURISM!! Imagine a country like Croatia, beautiful beaches, clear sea and LEGAL weed. And the state gets taxes for every joint smoked. Millions and millions of dollars every year and no drug dealers, no black market, plus you get controlled substance on the market, making it much safer. Not all drugs, but weed and mushrooms, definitely. And hookers as well, there really is no point in banning someone to do what they want with their body, that is just retarded.

Oh how I dream about the good tourism and tons of money... Sex, drugs and rock and roll!

Smile

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21-12-2011, 08:40 AM
RE: World wide war on drugs.
(21-12-2011 02:29 AM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(20-12-2011 11:50 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(20-12-2011 11:05 AM)Leela Wrote:  I have a pro and a contra argument here:

pro:
State could do it like with alcohol and cigarettes. Put taxes on it so the state actually earn on it. Plus have regulations and rules and age restrictions. That would make the use safer for the user. That would kick the overpriced black market out of business (not the black market as a whole).
I see no problem with doing it with all drugs even the hard ones. Let's say cocaine. It can be deadly but it is illegal - alcohol can be deadly but is legal. Both are VERY addicting and people are dieing from both a lot. I see no difference, at least no big difference.

contra:
It would increase the black market for the drugs that are mixed badly. That are streched but cheap, and lots of people might start using the unregulated stuff only because it is cheaper.

I don't see how you reach that conclusion. Mass produced drugs, shipped and sold legally, not requiring armies of thugs or payoffs to governments should be significantly cheaper.
And everything you buy on the street is already dangerous.

I'd like to see the evidence for how weed is dangerous.

In fact, I'd like to see the evidence for how it's worse than alcohol and tobacco.

Weed is not dangerous. Weed laced with PCP is very dangerous.

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21-12-2011, 09:10 AM
RE: World wide war on drugs.
how could the weed discussion start with a quote of my post? I never said weed is dangerous in the first place:

I said this about dangerous:
Quote:I see no problem with doing it with all drugs even the hard ones. Let's say cocaine. It can be deadly but it is illegal - alcohol can be deadly but is legal. Both are VERY addicting and people are dieing from both a lot. I see no difference, at least no big difference.

And I said this about weed:
Quote:When you are addicted it changes you. Inside and outside. You think about your next fix a lot, you get panicy when you don't get your fix, you spend a shitload of cash only on the addiction, when you finally realize that you need to stop you go through a very tough time that many people can't deal with (well / alone)...
And that counts for cigarettes and alcohol as much as for weed, mushrooms, and extacy.

Both are drugs that is for sure but completely different context Wink

Though I must say that even weed, if you take enough for long enough you do get stupid and slow so it is dangerous in the long run after all...

"Freedom is the freedom to say that 2+2=4" - George Orwell (in 1984)
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21-12-2011, 10:28 AM
RE: World wide war on drugs.
Quote:Though I must say that even weed, if you take enough for long enough you do get stupid and slow so it is dangerous in the long run after all...

Problem with this argument is two-fold. First, there is little to no evidence that this is true. Second, is that in the context of legalization, you can't use this as an argument against it since precident has already been set by alcohol and cigarettes that health risk is acceptable. Plus both have WAY worse effects on health than cannabis.

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21-12-2011, 10:44 AM
RE: World wide war on drugs.
(21-12-2011 08:40 AM)Chas Wrote:  Weed is not dangerous. Weed laced with PCP is very dangerous.

Not to pick on you Chas, but this is a very frustrating urban myth. Weed laced with anything is extremely rare, and if it IS laced with something, the seller will WANT you to know since it can fetch a higher price. You are not going to get weed that is secretly laced with any other drug.

The risk of buying street weed is that it can contain other nasties, like mold/mildew, pesticides, risidual chemical fertilizers, or a host of other impurities. Legalization would put standards in place (like those that are showing up for medical cannabis) to prevent those impurities from being present. Plus it doesn't matter how much tax the gov't puts on weed (ok that could be an exaggeration Wink) it would still be the same, or cheaper than illegal weed. Right now the price is as high as it is because demand is higher than supply, and because there's several people involved that expect to be compensated for not only their product/service, but also for the risk they take in an illegal endeavor. Eliminate that, and weed will be cheap enough legally, that there will be very little interest in growing it illegally, since the profits won't be high enough. Especially after a balance between supply and demand is made.

Fact is, here in Canada, street price ranges from $200-$350 per ounce. Some top potency strains (usually referred to as "connoseur weed" to those who can even access it) go for even more. And in the states, the prices are even higher (not sure about other countries). BUT, it costs about $30 per ounce to grow. And that is using organic (read - expensive) nutrients, proper HID lights, and strictly organic pest and disease controls (which are actually cheaper, but require a great deal more knowledge, time, and attention to use successfully). So a fair price for the end user should be around $100-$150 per ounce. That is just far too low for the drug cartels to even consider being involved with.

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21-12-2011, 11:22 AM
RE: World wide war on drugs.
(21-12-2011 10:28 AM)Stark Raving Wrote:  
Quote:Though I must say that even weed, if you take enough for long enough you do get stupid and slow so it is dangerous in the long run after all...

Problem with this argument is two-fold. First, there is little to no evidence that this is true. Second, is that in the context of legalization, you can't use this as an argument against it since precident has already been set by alcohol and cigarettes that health risk is acceptable. Plus both have WAY worse effects on health than cannabis.

I did not say that as an argument against legalization. Did you see my pro argument, I have that there.
It was just an addition on the topic of addiction Smile My original post had that addition and now I added this sentence.
Sorry if that got confusing

"Freedom is the freedom to say that 2+2=4" - George Orwell (in 1984)
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21-12-2011, 11:29 AM
RE: World wide war on drugs.
(21-12-2011 07:01 AM)Filox Wrote:  Erxomai, you will not find ANY evidence supporting dangerous weed, at least not long term damage. All it does is just short term, your body returns to normal after a while when you stop using weed. But I can give you tons of evidence how it is a cure/help/relieve for all sorts of illness, primary the brain damage and how it HELPS REGENERATE brain cells, not kill them, as we are told most of our life. But, since I hate repeating myself, I will now go and dig the old threads from the forum, where we have discussed this over and over and give you all links here. Here goes...

http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...ible-plant

http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...s-Ketamine

http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...othy-Leary

http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...-of-smoker

http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...Ape-Theory

Ahhh, and I managed to find the same thread as this one: http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...ther-drugs

There is The Official Cannabis thread as well: http://thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thre...bis-Thread

After you read ALL of this, you will get a better perspective into this subject and you can make better judgment on your own. Smile

Enjoy.

P.S.
Hey new admin, here is some work for you, if you want, you can put some of these threads together, so I don't have to kill myself every time somebody new comes to the forum and starts the same subject again and again...

Smile

Oh yeah, I'm all for legalizing. The main reason is TOURISM!! Imagine a country like Croatia, beautiful beaches, clear sea and LEGAL weed. And the state gets taxes for every joint smoked. Millions and millions of dollars every year and no drug dealers, no black market, plus you get controlled substance on the market, making it much safer. Not all drugs, but weed and mushrooms, definitely. And hookers as well, there really is no point in banning someone to do what they want with their body, that is just retarded.

Oh how I dream about the good tourism and tons of money... Sex, drugs and rock and roll!

Smile

My bags are almost packed. Do you need a roommate, Filox? Big Grin

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
~Izel
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