Worrying About a Trump Victory? Don't.
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27-10-2016, 12:53 PM
RE: Worrying About a Trump Victory? Don't.
(27-10-2016 12:50 PM)Birdguy1979 Wrote:  
(27-10-2016 11:22 AM)adey67 Wrote:  Is smaller federal government a bad thing ? I thought the majority of Americans were in favour of smaller government, or is that just in respect of taxation?

You have to weigh people's wants as far as government in selfish ways. People who speed all the time, want small enough government on the roads to never get a ticket for being an asshole driver. People that scam people or do other illegal things on the internet, want less government in that area so they can keep doing what they do. The rich want less government in their particular interests so they can cheat laws and pay less taxes. Companies that get paid to dispose of dangerous waste want less government, so they can get away with dumping shit in the oceans rather than pay for the cost of proper disposal. I think you get my point.

I do. Same the world over it seems.
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27-10-2016, 03:24 PM
RE: Worrying About a Trump Victory? Don't.
(27-10-2016 10:33 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
This election cycle has been interesting from a number of angles one of which is the interest in third parties. Notably either the Green Party headed by Jill Stein and the Libertarian party headed by Gary Johnson. Stein never really got enough momentum to make herself a factor but Johnson was close to the 15% to get on the Debate stage, something no 3rd party has done since Ross Perot. His popularity peaked in August when most voters, even those picking him in polls said they did not know much about him. This of course led to him being treated like a serious candidate and him fucking all of that up and showing himself to be what his detractors always claim about Libertarian candidates a Failed Republican not ready for prime-time rather than a legitimate 3rd option. From failing to even know what Aleppo is and not being able to name a single foreign leader he admires even softball questions from reporters show this guy to be a know nothing provincial with a bad idea on how to destroy the economy. Given party dissatisfaction with the candidates a legitimate 3rd party could have made big waves unfortunately we got 2 people that I would not trust as local dog catcher let alone PotUS.

Johnson's behavior since August would have cost him my vote in any other year.
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27-10-2016, 03:30 PM
RE: Worrying About a Trump Victory? Don't.
(27-10-2016 11:04 AM)Dom Wrote:  
(27-10-2016 10:54 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  While I support Gary, I also acknowledge he isn't the best candidate possible - still far better than what the Dems and Repubs have offered up. He should've known where Aleppo was (and more details about foreign affairs in general), but I wouldn't say he is a failed Republican not ready for the big time. I would say he is a successful Republican, even according the much of the Democratic people he represented. He isn't a smooth talker like Obama, he isn't particularly witty like Churchhill, he isn't particularly attractive like JFK. He is middle of the road, kind of a boring personality (though not boring person), but he is honest, and his good policies far outweigh some of the bad stances he takes (in my opinion). In this election I'd even settle for Stein, though she is a bit nutty, and is kind of a new age hippie. As for the criticism of Gary not picking a favorite leader, I think you're just wrong. Saying nothing is the smart answer for an honest man. Saying anyone's name and anything bad they ever said or did get's transferred to you through association. Even a "professional" lifetime politician could've only mustered up a vague bullshit answer, or picked someone significantly far back in history so as they've been given a pass for their atrocities.

See, that is exactly why I want Hillary for at least 4 years. She will just be business as usual. And the small parties will have a chance to get their shit together - the public obviously wants change but there just isn't anything workable there this time. The small parties need to really work on becoming publicized in the next 4 years. Most people have no idea what they are all about. I wouldn't mind voting for either one, except at this time it would get a megalomaniac into office, and that is infinitely more scary than any alternative.

Whether your vote might help or hurt Trump really depends on your state's margins. If Clinton is up -- or down -- by, say, ten, your vote won't change anything, and a third-party vote will register as one.more voter disliking both major parties.

That is a very important message to send.
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27-10-2016, 04:36 PM
RE: Worrying About a Trump Victory? Don't.
(27-10-2016 03:30 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  Whether your vote might help or hurt Trump really depends on your state's margins. If Clinton is up -- or down -- by, say, ten, your vote won't change anything, and a third-party vote will register as one more voter disliking both major parties.

Sorry, as a dumb Aussie... Tongue ... can you elaborate on this a bit more for me?

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
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27-10-2016, 05:11 PM
RE: Worrying About a Trump Victory? Don't.
(27-10-2016 04:36 PM)SYZ Wrote:  
(27-10-2016 03:30 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  Whether your vote might help or hurt Trump really depends on your state's margins. If Clinton is up -- or down -- by, say, ten, your vote won't change anything, and a third-party vote will register as one more voter disliking both major parties.

Sorry, as a dumb Aussie... Tongue ... can you elaborate on this a bit more for me?

It's about the winner-takes all approach of the Electoral College. If Clinton/Trump wins 51% in Florida, (s)he takes 100% of the 29 Electoral College votes. It works that way in most states, except Nebraska and Maine(I believe).

It raises the stakes in closely contested states(battle-ground states) like Ohio, Florida etc. In those states, you don't want to waste your vote on a third party candidate but you want to make it count against Trump or Clinton - whoever you hate most. One of them is winning it, so you might as well forget the protest vote and make it meaningful.

In reliably blue or red states, a third party protest vote does not carry the same risk of turning over the election to either of the hated candidates.

We have to remember that what we observe is not nature herself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning ~ Werner Heisenberg
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28-10-2016, 08:47 AM
RE: Worrying About a Trump Victory? Don't.
(27-10-2016 11:04 AM)Dom Wrote:  
(27-10-2016 10:54 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  While I support Gary, I also acknowledge he isn't the best candidate possible - still far better than what the Dems and Repubs have offered up. He should've known where Aleppo was (and more details about foreign affairs in general), but I wouldn't say he is a failed Republican not ready for the big time. I would say he is a successful Republican, even according the much of the Democratic people he represented. He isn't a smooth talker like Obama, he isn't particularly witty like Churchhill, he isn't particularly attractive like JFK. He is middle of the road, kind of a boring personality (though not boring person), but he is honest, and his good policies far outweigh some of the bad stances he takes (in my opinion). In this election I'd even settle for Stein, though she is a bit nutty, and is kind of a new age hippie. As for the criticism of Gary not picking a favorite leader, I think you're just wrong. Saying nothing is the smart answer for an honest man. Saying anyone's name and anything bad they ever said or did get's transferred to you through association. Even a "professional" lifetime politician could've only mustered up a vague bullshit answer, or picked someone significantly far back in history so as they've been given a pass for their atrocities.

See, that is exactly why I want Hillary for at least 4 years. She will just be business as usual. And the small parties will have a chance to get their shit together - the public obviously wants change but there just isn't anything workable there this time. The small parties need to really work on becoming publicized in the next 4 years. Most people have no idea what they are all about. I wouldn't mind voting for either one, except at this time it would get a megalomaniac into office, and that is infinitely more scary than any alternative.

Well, if you feel that way, then it only makes sense to vote 3rd party if you don't live in a swing state (or maybe in a state that splits electoral votes). I'll explain. I live in TN, which is typical of most states. No matter who I vote for, Candidate A will take the electoral votes. So, not matter who I vote for, my vote will be drowned out - unless I vote for a third party. Not only does it raise awareness of that party through polling data, but it also potentially gets the party official "minor party" status in the eyes of the Federal Government if they get at least 5% of the popular vote. That not only gets them Federal Funding; that HUGE because it's often many times more cash than then typically have from fundraising. Getting that status also raises more awareness. There is the potential of a snowball effect. Getting them those resources helps them "get organized" for 4 years from now; or even 2 years from now on down-ballot tickets, which is successfull could also drive interest on the next presidential. Most people who feel like you and I do can only make an impact by voting 3rd party.

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28-10-2016, 08:54 AM
RE: Worrying About a Trump Victory? Don't.
If I were in Utah I would be stumping for McMuffin. he is the only one who has a chanced of denying Trump there.
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28-10-2016, 11:01 AM (This post was last modified: 28-10-2016 02:33 PM by Gloucester.)
RE: Worrying About a Trump Victory? Don't.
Tony Schwarz, who ghosted Trump's book, has been ripping him to pieces on the BBC, which I don't think you will be able to listen to over there. He is on Trump's shit list and intends to emigrate if Trump wins.

Amongst the terms he used: sociopath, malevolent 3 year old, thin skinned, impatient, unstable, not in his right mind,. . . aad implied that he could be vindictive. Ok, not much new but all packaged together.

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/0...-tells-all
http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/...f-the-deal


The Republicans cannot be looking forward to any chance having a Rep POTUS that they might have to fight against to save the nation.

Tomorrow is precious, don't ruin it by fouling up today.
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28-10-2016, 02:21 PM
RE: Worrying About a Trump Victory? Don't.
This just in. Hillary investigation reopened by the FBI.
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28-10-2016, 02:27 PM
RE: Worrying About a Trump Victory? Don't.
(28-10-2016 02:21 PM)Birdguy1979 Wrote:  This just in. Hillary investigation reopened by the FBI.

Yawn.
And no doubt the Benghazi hearings will be redone at least twice.

They must not have anything to actually work on in Washington DC.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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