Would Abiogenesis kill religion?
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27-05-2014, 03:22 PM
Would Abiogenesis kill religion?
(27-05-2014 03:15 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  No. An omnipotent being could create an abiogenesis as a way to perpetuate life. Drinking Beverage

Shoot. Did I just discuss something religious?

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27-05-2014, 03:23 PM
RE: Would Abiogenesis kill religion?
I think that all we are capable of is to show a way it can happen, possibly multiple ways.
I doubt we can prove that a way is the only way; though we might.

Regardless, the delusionals will just say:
  • That it hasn't been proven (probably true) - or -
  • That's just a theory - or -
  • You don't know, you weren't there - or -
  • That's just the way God chose to do it.

It will likely upset many and cause a few to finally give it up.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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27-05-2014, 03:24 PM
RE: Would Abiogenesis kill religion?
What Mathilda said Thumbsup
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27-05-2014, 03:27 PM
Would Abiogenesis kill religion?
I still don't get the adherence to fundimentalism. As a Christian or theist of any sort, you have a way to view the method of God's creation through physics, abiogenesis, evolution -- really any of the sciences -- why would organized religion throw that out?

Shouldn't churches be funding the sciences, and absolutely ecstatic to find out more about creation?

“It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts.”
― Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
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27-05-2014, 03:37 PM
RE: Would Abiogenesis kill religion?
(27-05-2014 03:23 PM)Chas Wrote:  I think that all we are capable of is to show a way it can happen, possibly multiple ways.
I doubt we can prove that a way is the only way; though we might.

Regardless, the delusionals will just say:
  • That it hasn't been proven (probably true) - or -
  • That's just a theory - or -
  • You don't know, you weren't there - or -
  • That's just the way God chose to do it.

It will likely upset many and cause a few to finally give it up.

Proof of abiogenesis would also give atheist debaters another thing to throw at theists giving atheists a little more satisfaction. Debates would be longer......so there's that.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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27-05-2014, 03:57 PM
RE: Would Abiogenesis kill religion?
(27-05-2014 03:27 PM)rampant.a.i. Wrote:  I still don't get the adherence to fundimentalism. As a Christian or theist of any sort, you have a way to view the method of God's creation through physics, abiogenesis, evolution -- really any of the sciences -- why would organized religion throw that out?

Shouldn't churches be funding the sciences, and absolutely ecstatic to find out more about creation?

They usually don't because their foundational texts have nothing to say about science, or ipads, buses, space shuttles, etc.

The problem comes when a doctrinal proposition comes in direct conflict with science or a credible theologian claims that it does, that's when the fundies stop scientific progress that actually blossomed in the mist of the religion.

Take Islam for example, from the 9th through the 11th century, science, astronomy, mathematics, philosophy and some forms of atheism blossomed in ancient Bagdad, while Europe was the center of ignorance and superstition. Then the theologians and the imams began asserting that mathematics and science is forbidden by Allah and all scientific (and social) progress stops.

The same happened in Christian Europe after Francis Bacon until Darwin.

The theologians and pastors now stated that Evolution goes against the main doctrine of Christianity (original sin) because it gets rid of a historical Adam, a historical fall, and even if you somehow make the first 11 chapters of Genesis poetry or an allegory, you still have St Paul looking stupid (particularly in the Epistle to the Romans) saying things like "In Adam all die, and in Christ all shall be made allive". And there you get a fundamentalist/modernist divide. And you get people that are emotionally unwilling to accept the facts about evolutionary theory because it not only disrupts Genesis but also the Gospels and St Paul.

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27-05-2014, 04:01 PM
RE: Would Abiogenesis kill religion?
(27-05-2014 03:15 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  No. An omnipotent being could create an abiogenesis as a way to perpetuate life. Drinking Beverage

Shoot. Did I just discuss something religious?

Thats true. Not the god of the bible, but some god certainly could.
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27-05-2014, 04:05 PM
Re: Would Abiogenesis kill religion?
Nope, as everyone seems to grasp

Fundis would deny scientific findings as they already do and interpretive believers would say God did it

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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27-05-2014, 04:16 PM
RE: Would Abiogenesis kill religion?
(27-05-2014 04:05 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  Nope, as everyone seems to grasp

Fundis would deny scientific findings as they already do and interpretive believers would say God did it

There's no winning over a certain percentage of the population, ever.

If tomorrow life was created by mixing jello, cumin and gunpowder in a lab, and this was repeatable over and over...and that jellowdermin grew legs and a brain and walked to a work station and started ordering from the Home Shopping Network while chatting with us here on ATT forum and then reproduced with other jellowdermins there would still be people saying it didn't happen or that gawditit. BlinkDodgy

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27-05-2014, 05:22 PM
RE: Would Abiogenesis kill religion?
Excuse a few words of plagiarism:

In the beginning ...

Man had three questions:

How does nature work?

How does Man work?

How do I work (or what am I, and what am I for)?

Gods were invoked as the answer to all three, for all the reasons in the psychology textbooks. Later on, as science proved its salt, gods were no longer necessary for the first question. But gods are still kept on retainer for the other two, because the answers to the other two involve personal identity and sense of worth, and science has been slow to address them. They're much harder to answer than how did that mountain wind up over there, and answering them risks discovering self truths that aren't self flattering.

So, while laboratory created life certainly puts cracks in the pottery of sense of self, it's still largely a first question - how does nature work - and gods were discarded a hundred years ago with respect to that question.

Figuring out how to reckon ourselves truthfully without feeling insulted, or terrified, is, unfortunately for a great swath of mankind, still something only a god can handle.
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