Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
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25-12-2014, 07:11 AM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
Quote:If you had not been exposed to theology, would there be any reason at all to think that there is something more after we die?

Einstein said that energy is neither created or destroyed, it only changes form.

When we ask "is there life after death for me?" we should first try to define "me". This is the classic "who am I?" question.

If we define ourselves as our body, we actually die every seven years or so, because supposedly that's how long it takes for every cell to be replaced.

If we define ourselves as a human form, that form changes all the time too, because I assure you, my 30 year old body is long dead and gone, bye bye, no more.

Should we define ourselves as the data in our minds, the memories, opinions, thoughts etc? Don't just snap back an answer, dig in to it, go over it again and again, look at it from as many angles as you can. It'll take years, maybe decades.

We all believe in observation here. So observe the moment to moment details of your daily life. If you actually do this in a sincere and serious way, and don't just slam down on the reply button with an instant answer, you'll discover that you're seeking death all throughout the day every day.

Imho, it's like this. Imagine you throw a ball up in the air. At every single moment there are two forces operating on the ball, the force of your throw and gravity. Even while the ball is going up, gravity is there in every moment.

That's our life. There is the life force, the will to live, the force of our birth still pushing our ball up. And at the very same time in every moment there is the death force, patiently waiting for the life force to run it's course.

Life and death are not dualistic opposites. They are two sides of the same coin. Don't take my word for it, and don't just agree or disagree. Do your own patient observations. Do your own homework. Don't expect to finish it any time soon.

This too wordy post will now die. :-)
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25-12-2014, 07:25 AM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(25-12-2014 07:11 AM)Baba Bozo Wrote:  If you had not been exposed to theology, BIOLOGY, would there be any reason at all to think that there is something more after we die?

Fixed. No.

(25-12-2014 07:11 AM)Baba Bozo Wrote:  If we define ourselves as our body, we actually die every seven years or so, because supposedly that's how long it takes for every cell to be replaced.

If we define ourselves as a human form, that form changes all the time too, because I assure you, my 30 year old body is long dead and gone, bye bye, no more.

Wrong. Take a class on genetics, Bozo.

(25-12-2014 07:11 AM)Baba Bozo Wrote:  Should we define ourselves as the data in our minds, the memories, opinions, thoughts etc? Don't just snap back an answer, dig in to it, go over it again and again, look at it from as many angles as you can. It'll take years, maybe decades.

We all believe in observation here. So observe the moment to moment details of your daily life. If you actually do this in a sincere and serious way, and don't just slam down on the reply button with an instant answer, you'll discover that you're seeking death all throughout the day every day.

Wrong again. YOU don't get to tell people what they think, OR project your delusions onto others.

(25-12-2014 07:11 AM)Baba Bozo Wrote:  This too wordy post will now die. :-)

Praise Jebus. Thumbsup

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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25-12-2014, 07:32 AM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
The problem with the question is that you say "a" god and people hear "the" god. It seems easy enough to exclude every specific god of each religion through the kind of "are there square circles" arguments. They are simply internally inconsistent.
If you expand to any conceivable god, there doesn't seem to be much substance left in the question. You can say that the universe is god. It "knows" everything, is "everywhere", can do "everything". So, god exists. But what's the point?

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25-12-2014, 07:42 AM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(25-12-2014 07:32 AM)800poundGORILLAintheroom Wrote:  It seems easy enough to exclude every specific god of each religion through the kind of "are there square circles" arguments. They are simply internally inconsistent.

Please demonstrate that a god usually described as being all powerful would be required to be internally consistent.

What you're really saying, perhaps without realizing it, is that the laws of human logic are "god". That is, you're proposing that everything in all of reality must comply with the laws of human logic, and therefore a god would also be so bound.

It could be true the laws of human logic are universally binding, but you haven't proven it, you've only asserted it as a matter of faith.

It's probably helpful to remember who we are. We are a single species (recently living in caves) (now with nuclear bombs aimed down our own throat) on one little planet in one of billions of galaxies, and that's just the stuff we know about.

Is it likely that such a wacky young species would be able to conceive of rules that are binding on everything everywhere, especially given that we have no clue what "everywhere" actually refers to?

I say, not too likely. Must be proven. No belief without compelling evidence of such an extraordinary ability.

Atheism is a faith based belief system that competes with the theist faith based belief system. One says yes, the other says no, and neither has a clue.
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25-12-2014, 07:52 AM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
I understand the philosophy behind the idea of making a positive claim saying there isnt a god for sure shifts the burden of proof to me. However, can we all agree there has never been a shred of demonstrable evidence for the existence of the god of the bible? Can we assess the probability of this when taking into account what the bible has gotten right until this point? Lets say hypothetically the bible has only been right on 5% of its truth claims mostly historical events, cant we just say that the god it poses might be the most improbable of the 5% it got correct? AND THEN ULTIMATELY SAY WITHOUT PRESERVATION: a judeo christian god does not exist.
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25-12-2014, 07:58 AM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
I see absolutely no proof any god/deity/super being exists. Will I say that one absolutely doesn't exist? No, because given proof that one does, I'd reevaluate my stance.

I have traveled to many places in the world. People everywhere are just as convinced their disparate versions on god(s) exist and are the real one. Most seem to believe everyone else is deluded for their belief (or lack there of) in anything else.

Having never been indoctrinated into believing there is a god I think it's easier for me the dismiss the concept.

" Generally speaking, the errors in religion are dangerous; those in philosophy only ridiculous."
David Hume
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25-12-2014, 08:29 AM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(25-12-2014 07:42 AM)Baba Bozo Wrote:  Atheism is a faith based belief system that competes with the theist faith based belief system.

You’re just being a dick by attempting to assign a new meaning to the word “faith”.

Don’t be a dick.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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25-12-2014, 08:30 AM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(23-12-2014 12:35 PM)Autumnflowers Wrote:  So many that i have talked to on other sites speak of how they know a god doesn't exist
I don't agree or disagree as i honestly don't know. But isn't wrong to say you "Know" a god exists just like it's wrong to say you "Don't know a god exists?" Because in reality we can say we know but we haven't yet to die and figure it out sure more evidence supports this to be not possible, however we can't say for sure can we?
On your half, would you ever say for sure if a god did or didn't exist?
I feel as if i wouldn't because i feel like i couldn't ever know for sure.
Please give a "Why or why not do you think or don't think it's possible to claim if a god fully exists or not"

There isnt a shred of demonstrable evidence for any god and the god most theists attempt to prove in most debates is unfalsifiable. Saying a god exists shouldnt even be taken seriously because words cannot pop gods into existence. I can say i believe an empty can came alive last night and they told me to refer to it as Master of COSmos. It told me how it created the cosmos in 7 days and im writing it all down. Can you say you know for sure Master of COsmos doesnt exist? I think you can....
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25-12-2014, 08:37 AM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(25-12-2014 08:29 AM)Full Circle Wrote:  You’re just being a dick by attempting to assign a new meaning to the word “faith”.

Ok, I am being a dick, but I'm NOT assigning a new meaning to the word faith.

Theists believe in the qualifications of their holy books to speak about gods without compelling evidence to support that belief.

Atheists believe in the qualifications of human reason to speak about gods without compelling evidence to support that belief.

Same thing. Faith.

I've asked 55,000 times for proof of reason's qualifications to come to meaningful conclusions about gods, and no one will even try. We're apparently supposed to accept those qualifications on faith, just as most members here do.

I agree I'm being a dick. If I were to go on a Christian forum and relentlessly challenge Jesus, that would be dickness too. I plead guilty to dickness.

But if you will pause for a moment, you will realize I'm really complimenting members by relentlessly attacking their belief system.

What I'm really saying is that you really do believe in reason, and that sooner or later you'll get around to actually doing it.
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25-12-2014, 08:46 AM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(25-12-2014 08:37 AM)Baba Bozo Wrote:  
(25-12-2014 08:29 AM)Full Circle Wrote:  You’re just being a dick by attempting to assign a new meaning to the word “faith”.

Ok, I am being a dick, but I'm NOT assigning a new meaning to the word faith.

Theists believe in the qualifications of their holy books to speak about gods without compelling evidence to support that belief.

Atheists believe in the qualifications of human reason to speak about gods without compelling evidence to support that belief.

Same thing. Faith.

Nope. Wrong again.

Compelling evidence to support a negative supposition is inherently a waste of time and an oft trotted out (you are just the latest) argument by theists to make themselves feel good.

If you had any sense of intellectual honesty you would acknowledge what atheism is, the absence of belief that any deities exist, no faith required to have an absence of belief.

Now, stop being a dick and have yourself a Merry Christmas.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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