Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
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24-12-2014, 04:35 PM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(23-12-2014 12:35 PM)Autumnflowers Wrote:  So many that i have talked to on other sites speak of how they know a god doesn't exist
I don't agree or disagree as i honestly don't know. But isn't wrong to say you "Know" a god exists just like it's wrong to say you "Don't know a god exists?" Because in reality we can say we know but we haven't yet to die and figure it out sure more evidence supports this to be not possible, however we can't say for sure can we?
On your half, would you ever say for sure if a god did or didn't exist?
I feel as if i wouldn't because i feel like i couldn't ever know for sure.
Please give a "Why or why not do you think or don't think it's possible to claim if a god fully exists or not"

In my humble and unknowing opinion, I will always concede the possibility exists for there to be a "god", or "creative force".. there is also a possibility that Uranus is hollow and full of little purple midgets that hump unicorns. Anything is "possible."

However, I strongly assert that the abrahamic myth based christian god is false because it is based on this little fictional book called the bible, and that bible can be easily discredited, as well as the miracles within. Thus I posit that the god of Christianity is false, and does not exist. Just like if I wrote a book about the purple unicorn creator of worlds, and it was found 2,000 years from now, and the cult of purple unicorn followers swear that the purple unicorn is the god of gods...it could be discredited because it could be traced back to my stark raving delusions as the creator and fabricator of said religion.

analysis and logical examination of how the world works around us, and the observable space would suggest that a god didn't make it, for it is not a perfect design by any stretch of the imagination. However, I cannot sit here and say, No god/creative force exists anywhere...it is just reeeeeeealy unlikely.

So in summary, Xtian god and jesus exist? no, easily discredited based on dismantlement of the bible and historicity of jesus which fabricated it. Existence of a creative force? sure, anything is possible....even my little purple midgets in Uranus...just not probable.

"Belief is so often the death of reason" - Qyburn, Game of Thrones

"The Christian community continues to exist because the conclusions of the critical study of the Bible are largely withheld from them." -Hans Conzelmann (1915-1989)
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24-12-2014, 04:53 PM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(24-12-2014 04:35 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  sure, anything is possible...

Philosophically- and in my opinion- "anything is possible" is much like a positive claim which carries the burden of proof.

What do you think?

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24-12-2014, 05:08 PM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(24-12-2014 04:53 PM)Free Wrote:  
(24-12-2014 04:35 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  sure, anything is possible...

Philosophically- and in my opinion- "anything is possible" is much like a positive claim which carries the burden of proof.

What do you think?

I concur, but I can not positively 100% say that nowhere in the universe does some type of creative force exist, so I will be nice and say..."anything is possible, albeit improbable." However, I do feel strongly that the christian "god" theory is nonsense since the fabrication, and dissemination of said theory can be traced back to its inception.

"Belief is so often the death of reason" - Qyburn, Game of Thrones

"The Christian community continues to exist because the conclusions of the critical study of the Bible are largely withheld from them." -Hans Conzelmann (1915-1989)
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24-12-2014, 05:21 PM (This post was last modified: 24-12-2014 07:08 PM by Full Circle.)
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(24-12-2014 04:53 PM)Free Wrote:  
(24-12-2014 04:35 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  sure, anything is possible...

Philosophically- and in my opinion- "anything is possible" is much like a positive claim which carries the burden of proof.

What do you think?

I see your point.

I don't think anything is possible. Since one of those things I don't think is possible is a supernatural being that can create something from nothing I think this makes me a Gnostic atheist.Consider but since I can't prove a negative where does this leave me?

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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24-12-2014, 05:25 PM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(24-12-2014 05:08 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  
(24-12-2014 04:53 PM)Free Wrote:  Philosophically- and in my opinion- "anything is possible" is much like a positive claim which carries the burden of proof.

What do you think?

I concur, but I can not positively 100% say that nowhere in the universe does some type of creative force exist, so I will be nice and say..."anything is possible, albeit improbable." However, I do feel strongly that the christian "god" theory is nonsense since the fabrication, and dissemination of said theory can be traced back to its inception.

Since we humans- who exist in the universe- have demonstrated ourselves as being a creative force, then that is evidence that a creative force exists in the universe, which in my opinion tilts the scales to "probable," when placed in conjunction of what we currently know about the universe.

But the words "anything is possible" do not appear to be logical, for it seems inclusive of everything. If everything is possible, we have either a paradox or a contradiction when we ask the question of, "Is that which is impossible, possible?"

I agree wholeheartedly that the Christian god is nonsense.

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24-12-2014, 05:38 PM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(24-12-2014 05:21 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  
(24-12-2014 04:53 PM)Free Wrote:  Philosophically- and in my opinion- "anything is possible" is much like a positive claim which carries the burden of proof.

What do you think?

I see your point.

I don't think anything is possible. Since one if those things I don't think is possible is a supernatural being that can create something from nothing I think this makes me a Gnostic atheist.Consider but since I can't prove a negative where does this leave me?

It can be a bit of a mind bender, really. Is that which is impossible, possible? Is there anything impossible? In whole numbers, is it possible that 1 + 1 will ever equal 3?

My feeling is we need to draw the line somewhere.

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24-12-2014, 05:54 PM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(24-12-2014 05:21 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  Since one if those things I don't think is possible is a supernatural being that can create something from nothing I think this makes me a Gnostic atheist.Consider but since I can't prove a negative where does this leave me?

Um, science says everything in all of observable reality came from nothing, or something very close to nothing.

You could prove your belief if you should show that human reason in it's current form could detect a god if there was one.

As example, if you can demonstrate credible qualifications for finding shoes, and then explore your bedroom and find no shoes, you have proven there are no shoes in the bedroom.

If you can't first prove you are qualified to find shoes, the fact that you haven't found a shoe means nothing.

So the first step is to prove that your preferred method, your chosen authority, human reason, is currently qualified to find gods.

What arena are you making your claim about? Everywhere. You seem to be saying there is no god anywhere.

Ok, so what does the word "everywhere" refer to? What is it's location, dimensions etc? Nobody has a clue.

So, what you're trying to do is prove that you have the ability to know what doesn't exist, in an arena you can't define. That's the very common state of human reason which you must prove could find gods if they exist.

Good luck!
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24-12-2014, 06:04 PM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(24-12-2014 05:54 PM)Baba Bozo Wrote:  
(24-12-2014 05:21 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  Since one if those things I don't think is possible is a supernatural being that can create something from nothing I think this makes me a Gnostic atheist.Consider but since I can't prove a negative where does this leave me?

Um, science says everything in all of observable reality came from nothing, or something very close to nothing.

You could prove your belief if you should show that human reason in it's current form could detect a god if there was one.

As example, if you can demonstrate credible qualifications for finding shoes, and then explore your bedroom and find no shoes, you have proven there are no shoes in the bedroom.

If you can't first prove you are qualified to find shoes, the fact that you haven't found a shoe means nothing.

So the first step is to prove that your preferred method, your chosen authority, human reason, is currently qualified to find gods.

What arena are you making your claim about? Everywhere. You seem to be saying there is no god anywhere.

Ok, so what does the word "everywhere" refer to? What is it's location, dimensions etc? Nobody has a clue.

So, what you're trying to do is prove that you have the ability to know what doesn't exist, in an arena you can't define. That's the very common state of human reason which you must prove could find gods if they exist.

Good luck!

Pay attention to what I wrote and don't add your own suppositions to it.

I'm not claiming anything and I'm not trying to prove anything, I even specifically said so.

You're creating a strawman that doesn't exist from something I didn't say to contradict a claim I didn't make. Facepalm

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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24-12-2014, 06:06 PM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
Free, I always appreciate your responses.

Can you give me evidence of a god that would still leave doubt?

Check out my now-defunct atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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Atheism promotes critical thinking; theism promotes hypocritical thinking. -- Me
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24-12-2014, 06:21 PM
RE: Would you claim a god doesn't exist for sure?
(24-12-2014 06:04 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  Pay attention to what I wrote and don't add your own suppositions to it.

What you actually said was....

Quote:Since one if those things I don't think is possible is a supernatural being that can create something from nothing
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