Yay for American gun laws
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03-05-2014, 08:24 PM
RE: Yay for American gun laws
(03-05-2014 05:58 PM)Sam Wrote:  The point I was trying to make was, that a gun makes the act of murder easier and involves less conscious thought than by other means. Since firing a gun is as simple as lifting a finger... Or less with modern "hair triggers".

But also, that a firearm, be it a pistol or a rifle is capable of inflicting severe wounds from a distance... Something which melee weapons are not capable of.

Ultimately it boils down to the fact that a gun is designed for one purpose and one purpose only, which is to send a projectile at high speed into a target, to cause severe or fatal wounding.

I think the debate isn't so much about whether or not firearms should be legal, but how they should be controlled and what kinds should be allowed. I can entirely understand and appreciate the reasons why someone would want a pistol, rifle or shotgun for either self defense, hobby or hunting purposes.

But, is it really necessary to allow assault rifles, silencers and hollow-point ammunition? I can't think of any scenario that justifies the use of any of those.

Before you can have a credible opinion, you need to have the facts.
  • Guns are not sold with 'hair-triggers' - that is something one would have done by a gunsmith.
  • Assault rifles are not common, they are expensive, and one needs to have a Class III Federal Firearms License which is expensive and not easy to get.
  • Silencers don't 'silence'. They are sound suppressors.
  • A silencer can only be purchased with direct approval from the ATF. Fill out form F-5320-4 and wait. For months. And months.
  • Hunting ammunition is usually hollow-point or soft point ammunition.
  • The police use hollow-point ammunition.

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03-05-2014, 10:02 PM
RE: Yay for American gun laws
(03-05-2014 05:03 PM)Dom Wrote:  
(03-05-2014 04:25 PM)DLJ Wrote:  When you say 'pioneer days', you're talking about the insurgence into the native's territory, right?

Who said Murikans don't do irony?

Big Grin

They do, but I'm not Murican, i just pitched a tent here.

That explains a whole lot.

The physical Law of Non-irony is still valid. Phew! No black holes this time.

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03-05-2014, 10:11 PM
RE: Yay for American gun laws
I'm against gum laws.

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03-05-2014, 10:14 PM
RE: Yay for American gun laws
(03-05-2014 10:11 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  I'm against gum laws.


Hmmm, I'll have to chew on that a while. Consider

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03-05-2014, 11:17 PM
RE: Yay for American gun laws
(03-05-2014 10:14 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(03-05-2014 10:11 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  I'm against gum laws.


Hmmm, I'll have to chew on that a while. Consider



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04-05-2014, 04:19 AM
RE: Yay for American gun laws
(03-05-2014 09:36 AM)Dom Wrote:  It is absolutely not normal here to trespass on private property. You ring the bell in front if you want something, that's it. Trespassing is not normal behavior. People have been shot for that since the early days of this country.

You can't compare different cultures on that level, there are very different approaches to such things.

Not that I am defending what that guy did, I am not, but you do have a view of things that does not apply here.

Thanks for stating this.
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04-05-2014, 05:10 AM
RE: Yay for American gun laws
(03-05-2014 08:24 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(03-05-2014 05:58 PM)Sam Wrote:  The point I was trying to make was, that a gun makes the act of murder easier and involves less conscious thought than by other means. Since firing a gun is as simple as lifting a finger... Or less with modern "hair triggers".

But also, that a firearm, be it a pistol or a rifle is capable of inflicting severe wounds from a distance... Something which melee weapons are not capable of.

Ultimately it boils down to the fact that a gun is designed for one purpose and one purpose only, which is to send a projectile at high speed into a target, to cause severe or fatal wounding.

I think the debate isn't so much about whether or not firearms should be legal, but how they should be controlled and what kinds should be allowed. I can entirely understand and appreciate the reasons why someone would want a pistol, rifle or shotgun for either self defense, hobby or hunting purposes.

But, is it really necessary to allow assault rifles, silencers and hollow-point ammunition? I can't think of any scenario that justifies the use of any of those.

Before you can have a credible opinion, you need to have the facts.
  • Guns are not sold with 'hair-triggers' - that is something one would have done by a gunsmith.
  • Assault rifles are not common, they are expensive, and one needs to have a Class III Federal Firearms License which is expensive and not easy to get.
  • Silencers don't 'silence'. They are sound suppressors.
  • A silencer can only be purchased with direct approval from the ATF. Fill out form F-5320-4 and wait. For months. And months.
  • Hunting ammunition is usually hollow-point or soft point ammunition.
  • The police use hollow-point ammunition.

And none of that makes a blind bit of difference to someone who's decided to go on the rampage...

They just complicate things... Wounds are more severe, the gunman gives less warning, with an assault rifle he can gun many people down from long range.

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04-05-2014, 10:49 PM
RE: Yay for American gun laws
No one owns assault rifles. No one who's likely to go on a rampage at any rate. They cost >$20,000, require extensive background checks, and months waiting for approval. And since new ones can't be registered there is a finite supply in the US.

There are probably more illegal assault rifles owned by Mexican cartel members in the US (ultimately stolen from the Mexican military) than there are in the hands of US citizens.

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2 K(s) + 2 H2O(l) → 2 KOH(aq) + H2 (g) + 196 kJ/mol
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04-05-2014, 10:52 PM
RE: Yay for American gun laws
(01-05-2014 07:34 PM)Hughsie Wrote:  I was thinking that myself, surely shooting someone without any kind of warning is a little bit beyond the reasonable force the law seemingly implies.

I hope he gets charged with murder tbh, it would seem insane to me that a guy who has admitted trying to lure people onto his property to shoot (and doing so) would be found not guilty.

I'm with you Hughsie. This is insane.

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04-05-2014, 11:00 PM
RE: Yay for American gun laws
(04-05-2014 10:49 PM)Phaedrus Wrote:  No one owns assault rifles. No one who's likely to go on a rampage at any rate. They cost >$20,000, require extensive background checks, and months waiting for approval.

http://www.cmmginc.com/product_p/55a21a6.htm
[Image: 55A21A6-2T.jpg?1391068562]

Suggested Retail Price $1,099.95

They are not cheap though @ 1K, for actual criminals who just get the grey market ones. I guess there is a fear that one will be used eventually for a suicide rampage, add a dozen 30 round clips at $15 bucks each
[Image: MAG571-BLK-2T.jpg?1391009084]

Picture 2 disenfranchised suicidal teenagers, 2 Assault rifles each, 1000 rounds of ammo, block off the entrances to a stadium or mall, ShockingShockingShocking

A pre-emptive banning sounds fair, especially as criminals don't do that sort of thing, its the teenager with access to daddies gun cabinet.

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