Yet another example of Republican Christofascism.
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05-07-2017, 12:01 PM
RE: Yet another example of Republican Christofascism.
(05-07-2017 11:50 AM)adey67 Wrote:  
(05-07-2017 10:52 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  you have historians and so do i thaddeus russell a renegade history of the United States.

Sounds like dear Thaddeus is a renegade himself perhaps also with an agenda also. David Irving is an historian does that mean the holocaust never happened? My grandfather who was a liberator of Bergen Belsen would disagree with this singular historian.

Everyone has an agenda.
Thaddeus Russel's agenda is to make America more black. The difference between Thaddeus Russel and the majority of historians is he does not believe in the great man fallacy. Historic figures are nothing at all like the mythologies which are built up around them. The good guys are always pure as the driven snow, and the bad guys are purest evil. What happens in reality is that individuals become Iconic coming to embody whole movements of people. Renegade History is literally a bottom up examination of history. I believe the subtitle is something like "How prostitutes, pirates, and slaves shaped America" or something like that. Really great book.
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05-07-2017, 12:05 PM
RE: Yet another example of Republican Christofascism.
(05-07-2017 11:55 AM)adey67 Wrote:  
(05-07-2017 11:51 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  I am only being obtuse or dishonest if the south did not have a right to divorce the north.
It didn't.

So what your saying is it's like the mafia. Once your in your in and there is no leaving unless you want to die?
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05-07-2017, 12:05 PM
RE: Yet another example of Republican Christofascism.
(05-07-2017 11:50 AM)adey67 Wrote:  Sounds like dear Thaddeus is a renegade himself perhaps also with an agenda also.

Seems that his book has troubling bibliography.

Reviews on GoodReads also make me skeptical.

Quote:David Irving is an historian does that mean the holocaust never happened?

Irving isn't a historian, just a guy who wrote books about history.

Quote:My grandfather who was a liberator of Bergen Belsen would disagree with this singular historian.

Irving was destroyed during a trial that his lawsuit started. Some serious historian even wrote a book about it - Lying About Hitler. It's worth reading.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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05-07-2017, 12:17 PM
RE: Yet another example of Republican Christofascism.
(05-07-2017 11:51 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  
(05-07-2017 11:47 AM)Grasshopper Wrote:  There is such a thing as a chain of causes. If A (a dispute over slavery) causes B (the secession of the southern states) and B causes C (the Civil War), then A is also a cause of C. C would not have happened if A hadn't happened. You are either being obtuse or dishonest to pretend otherwise.
I am only being obtuse or dishonest if the south did not have a right to divorce the north.

I don't see how that's relevant. There was a civil war, it had causes, and slavery was one of the primary causes, if not the primary cause. All of this remains true regardless of who was right or wrong in the dispute.
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05-07-2017, 12:20 PM
RE: Yet another example of Republican Christofascism.
(05-07-2017 12:05 PM)BlkFnx Wrote:  
(05-07-2017 11:55 AM)adey67 Wrote:  It didn't.

So what your saying is it's like the mafia. Once your in your in and there is no leaving unless you want to die?

This is what I mean about disingenuous the mafia is not a country with history its a bunch of thugs, they could have asked for a referendum like we did with Europe, but they would have lost so they left the union with little choice. False comparison.
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05-07-2017, 12:26 PM
RE: Yet another example of Republican Christofascism.
(05-07-2017 12:01 PM)BlkFnx Wrote:  
(05-07-2017 11:50 AM)adey67 Wrote:  Sounds like dear Thaddeus is a renegade himself perhaps also with an agenda also. David Irving is an historian does that mean the holocaust never happened? My grandfather who was a liberator of Bergen Belsen would disagree with this singular historian.

Everyone has an agenda.
Thaddeus Russel's agenda is to make America more black. The difference between Thaddeus Russel and the majority of historians is he does not believe in the great man fallacy. Historic figures are nothing at all like the mythologies which are built up around them. The good guys are always pure as the driven snow, and the bad guys are purest evil. What happens in reality is that individuals become Iconic coming to embody whole movements of people. Renegade History is literally a bottom up examination of history. I believe the subtitle is something like "How prostitutes, pirates, and slaves shaped America" or something like that. Really great book.

I'll give it a go Thanks, sounds interesting.
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05-07-2017, 12:29 PM
RE: Yet another example of Republican Christofascism.
(05-07-2017 12:20 PM)adey67 Wrote:  
(05-07-2017 12:05 PM)BlkFnx Wrote:  So what your saying is it's like the mafia. Once your in your in and there is no leaving unless you want to die?

This is what I mean about disingenuous the mafia is not a country with history its a bunch of thugs, they could have asked for a referendum like we did with Europe, but they would have lost so they left the union with little choice. False comparison.
They could have but they didn't have to. This is a position I actually hold. Secession/divorce(they are the same thing) is a fundamental right. I don't mean an American right.

Funny thing if you look at how the government defines organized crime it fits every criteria.
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05-07-2017, 12:36 PM
RE: Yet another example of Republican Christofascism.
(05-07-2017 12:05 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  
(05-07-2017 11:50 AM)adey67 Wrote:  Sounds like dear Thaddeus is a renegade himself perhaps also with an agenda also.

Seems that his book has troubling bibliography.

Reviews on GoodReads also make me skeptical.

Quote:David Irving is an historian does that mean the holocaust never happened?

Irving isn't a historian, just a guy who wrote books about history.

Quote:My grandfather who was a liberator of Bergen Belsen would disagree with this singular historian.

Irving was destroyed during a trial that his lawsuit started. Some serious historian even wrote a book about it - Lying About Hitler. It's worth reading.

Sounds interesting, I was kinda being devils advocate I know Irving is not a reputable historian which was kind of my point but I think it went over a certain persons head lol. Wink
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05-07-2017, 01:05 PM
RE: Yet another example of Republican Christofascism.
(05-07-2017 12:29 PM)BlkFnx Wrote:  
(05-07-2017 12:20 PM)adey67 Wrote:  This is what I mean about disingenuous the mafia is not a country with history its a bunch of thugs, they could have asked for a referendum like we did with Europe, but they would have lost so they left the union with little choice. False comparison.
They could have but they didn't have to. This is a position I actually hold. Secession/divorce(they are the same thing) is a fundamental right. I don't mean an American right.

Funny thing if you look at how the government defines organized crime it fits every criteria.

So I have the right to secede from the UK and turn my tiny flat into an independent country ? Cos that seems to be what you're saying, seriously why don't you just admit you don't wanna be part of the USA and you believe the south should be an independent nation, it would make life sooo much easier.
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05-07-2017, 01:09 PM
RE: Yet another example of Republican Christofascism.
(05-07-2017 12:36 PM)adey67 Wrote:  
(05-07-2017 12:05 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  Seems that his book has troubling bibliography.

Reviews on GoodReads also make me skeptical.


Irving isn't a historian, just a guy who wrote books about history.


Irving was destroyed during a trial that his lawsuit started. Some serious historian even wrote a book about it - Lying About Hitler. It's worth reading.

Sounds interesting, I was kinda being devils advocate I know Irving is not a reputable historian which was kind of my point but I think it went over a certain persons head lol. Wink

Okay so I just opened up my kindle app to double check this and I have to say the thing about it not being well sourced is BS. Sourcing starts on page 345 and runs to page 384. Considering the fact that this book is not intended to for scholars 40 pages of footnotes is quite a few.
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