You Are More Likely To Be Shot If There Is A Gun in The Home
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23-07-2017, 12:02 PM
RE: You Are More Likely To Be Shot If There Is A Gun in The Home
Everyone, this way, please, line up against that nice wall over there. Cigarette? Blindfold?




"E se non passa la tristezza con altri occhi la guarderò."
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23-07-2017, 01:00 PM
RE: You Are More Likely To Be Shot If There Is A Gun in The Home
Ok, I've calmed down a bit now, Brian I'm sorry I was rude and bought up the past that was not kind of me but you really did push my buttons there fella, I know this is an issue for you but seriously mate you need to chillax, my original comment was partly serious but mostly comedic you are obviously someone who cares deeply but sadly you are coming across as a person who is humourless and trying to score points, in some respects I admire your stance but I'm conflicted and ultimately have been convinced gun ownership is necessary In the USA. There have been so many posts on guns here recently it is a bit tiresome, please don't forget that this is an international forum and while America predominates its not the be all and end all. You don't need to give up your principles but you do in my opinion need to garner a better sense of humour and an understanding of your opponents I know everyone has a hot button and that's fine mine is holocaust deniers yours is firearms and their control. Believe it or not I'm not actually your enemy here, ultimately its just an internet forum you have made your point I've made mine there really is no need for stress or anguish.
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23-07-2017, 01:22 PM
RE: You Are More Likely To Be Shot If There Is A Gun in The Home
(23-07-2017 07:38 AM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(23-07-2017 05:23 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  The implication is you are more likely to be killed if there is a gun is in the home, but that's not the true statement. You are more likely to be shot.

Why isn't that a true statement? Seems like a true statement. You are also more likely to be killed if if there are knives, bleach, drugs, pesticides, baseball bats, pillows, plastic bags, hair chargers and bathtubs, .... in the home. The question is how much more likely? Isn't it?
Online biker is making the case that those that are killed by guns in the home, they would have died anyway even if there weren't gun, just by a different method.

Let's say a husband comes home from a tiresome day at work, but when he comes home he finds his wife in bed with the neighbor, best friend or something.
Now he doesn't have a gun handy with which to take out his jealous rage, so instead he gets a knife or bleach or poison or something.

I personally would think, if he doesn't have a gun, he resorts to using his fist, someone gets punched, bruises are the result rather than gun death.

Now how, looking at statistics and stuff do we prove whether I am right or if online biker is right?

A statistic would be on whether the wives and girlfriends are more likely to die (by any method) if a gun is in the home. It would then be interesting, if there is a significant difference, to understand the comparative likelihood on methods of death of the wife/girlfriend in homes with guns and in homes without guns.

Anther variance to consider. Perhaps people who have guns at home live in more dangerous neighborhoods. So you would also need to get statistics from the two groups who live in similar neighborhoods.
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23-07-2017, 01:26 PM
RE: You Are More Likely To Be Shot If There Is A Gun in The Home
Yep. Guns short-circuit fights, escalating them quickly to lethal levels. Guns don't defend, they only offer equal or greater violence.
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23-07-2017, 01:27 PM
RE: You Are More Likely To Be Shot If There Is A Gun in The Home
Almost 10 times as many die from obesity related issues than from guns each year in the US.

Just think of how many lives could be saved if people would replace the snack cabinet with a gun cabinet and hit the range instead of the TV? Big Grin

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23-07-2017, 01:41 PM
RE: You Are More Likely To Be Shot If There Is A Gun in The Home
(23-07-2017 01:27 PM)yakherder Wrote:  Almost 10 times as many die from obesity related issues than from guns each year in the US.

Just think of how many lives could be saved if people would replace the snack cabinet with a gun cabinet and hit the range instead of the TV? Big Grin
Still with the false equivalences.
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23-07-2017, 01:44 PM
RE: You Are More Likely To Be Shot If There Is A Gun in The Home
My search crteria. In Google I used
"chances of a wife or girlfreind being killed if a gun is present in the home"

On the first google response page I get the following

https://www.theatlantic.com/national/arc...er/284022/
Quote:Indeed, the study found that women with access to firearms become homicide victims at significantly higher rates than men.

Quote:Women in the United States account for 84 percent of all female firearm victims in the developed world, even though they make up only a third of the developed world’s female population.

Quote:“More than twice as many women are killed with a gun used by their husbands or intimate acquaintances than are murdered by strangers using guns, knives, or any other means.”

Quote: Indeed, gun threats in the home against women by their intimate partners appear to be more common across the United States than self-defense uses of guns by women.

I think this one below is closer to sorting the truthfulness of Onlinebikers hypothesis or mine.
Quote:Another large case-control study compared women who were murdered by their intimate partner with a control group of battered women. Only 16 percent of the women who had been abused, but not murdered, had guns in their homes, whereas 51 percent of the murder victims did.



https://www.thetrace.org/2016/05/gun-own...-debunked/
Quote:Studies show that when a woman owns a firearm, it is far more likely to be used against her than by her.

https://everytownresearch.org/reports/gu...nst-women/
Quote:Domestic violence in America is to a significant degree a problem of gun violence. Over the past 25 years, more intimate partner homicides in the U.S. have been committed with guns than with all other weapons combined

Quote:people with a history of committing domestic violence are five times more likely to subsequently murder an intimate partner when a firearm is in the house


http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and...icide.html
Quote:The most recent study examining the relationship between firearms and homicide rates on a state level, published last April, found a significant positive relationship between gun ownership and overall homicide levels. Using data from 1981–2010 and the best firearm ownership proxy to date, the study found that for every 1 percent increase in gun ownership, there was a 1.1 percent increase in the firearm homicide rate and a 0.7 percent increase in the total homicide rate.

I have to drop my kids off at school now, so haven't read the next to articles that google found.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1447915/
http://nytlive.nytimes.com/womeninthewor...ens-lives/
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23-07-2017, 01:52 PM
RE: You Are More Likely To Be Shot If There Is A Gun in The Home
(23-07-2017 11:18 AM)Brian37 Wrote:  
(23-07-2017 11:01 AM)adey67 Wrote:  Oh Jesus another gun thread ? Rolleyes Laugh out load

Yea because another gun thread is so harmful like the nearly 36,000 per year deaths due to use of a firearm. Here is an idea, if you don't like the issue of any thread, then don't go into that thread. Not just on this topic, but any.

I see you're sticking to your inflated numbers.

Why is that?

You're counting suicides, justified police shootings and justifiable self defense.


But hey, as long as it LOOKS good, huh??

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23-07-2017, 02:00 PM
RE: You Are More Likely To Be Shot If There Is A Gun in The Home
Dismissing gun deaths to lower numbers? Really? Why not dismiss any gun death that doesn't happen because THE GOOD GUY WITH THE GUN got the bad guy? Your number would look good percentage-wise, but very small.
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23-07-2017, 02:09 PM
RE: You Are More Likely To Be Shot If There Is A Gun in The Home
(23-07-2017 05:46 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  Did anyone say anything about self- defense or criminals???

Nope.

Not a bit. That goes in a different thread.

Stick to the subject line.

I'm far less worried about "criminals" than I am about the redneck asshole next door sending a freedom missile through my window while he is practicing his quick draw in front of the mirror.

(I don't buy this "I was cleaning it when it went off" shit. ) There are far too many assholes walking around with guns in this country.

Atheism is NOT a Religion. It's A Personal Relationship With Reality!
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