You atheists enjoy citing anti-religious quotes from the founding fathers...
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12-05-2013, 08:12 AM
RE: You atheists enjoy citing anti-religious quotes from the founding fathers...
(12-05-2013 12:31 AM)Spectral-Rothbardian Wrote:  As if to appeal to their authority (and reason) on the issue of religion in politics.

Well, how about this quote from an elderly founding father...

"Nothing is more certainly written in the book of fate than that these people are to be free. Nor is it less certain that the two races, equally free, cannot live in the same government. Nature, habit, opinion has drawn indelible lines of distinction between them. It is still in our power to direct the process of emancipation and deportation peaceably and in such slow degree as that the evil will wear off insensibly, and their place be pari passu filled up by free white laborers."

- Thomas Jefferson, Feb. 8, 1821


Oh, but it's only your precious "separation of church and state" that is all that matters when it comes to the insight of founding fathers, right?

Because quoting founding fathers is about dissecting the original intent and context of things like the constitution and the germination of liberal democracy, being as they originally wrote the first and were among the first to attempt to implement the second. And I don't think many of us here deny that their collective original intent (with some individual exceptions) and context regarding race was one of slavery, brutalization, rape, exploitation, and general evil, albeit with some occasional miserable hand-wringing on how awful it is that their society requires them to do such things. In terms of applicability to present law and social structure, that intent has not been so much forgotten as replaced by things like the 13th and 14th amendments and the Equal Rights Act, with regard to law, and quotations from Lincoln and King with regard to intent, and the other authors of this newer paradigm are more relevant to today's politics and society, than the authors of the paradigm that is no longer in force. Quoting Jefferson on THAT subject is a bit like quoting Genghis Khan on the subject of international law: A quaint and somewhat appalling glimpse into a by and large bygone and well-rid mentality. However, things like separation of state HAVE been in place since Jefferson's time (in principle, at least, even if often observed only in the breach), and so insights on those particular subjects by their authors remain relevant.

Now that content is addressed, what the hell is this doing in the Atheism and Theism forum? Shouldn't it be in, I dunno, History, or Politics, or maybe Pseudoscience?

"If I ignore the alternatives, the only option is God; I ignore them; therefore God." -- The Syllogism of Fail
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12-05-2013, 09:06 AM
RE: You atheists enjoy citing anti-religious quotes from the founding fathers...
Don't feed the trolls.
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12-05-2013, 05:52 PM
RE: You atheists enjoy citing anti-religious quotes from the founding fathers...
(12-05-2013 12:31 AM)Spectral-Rothbardian Wrote:  As if to appeal to their authority (and reason) on the issue of religion in politics.

Well, how about this quote from an elderly founding father...

"Nothing is more certainly written in the book of fate than that these people are to be free. Nor is it less certain that the two races, equally free, cannot live in the same government. Nature, habit, opinion has drawn indelible lines of distinction between them. It is still in our power to direct the process of emancipation and deportation peaceably and in such slow degree as that the evil will wear off insensibly, and their place be pari passu filled up by free white laborers."

- Thomas Jefferson, Feb. 8, 1821


Oh, but it's only your precious "separation of church and state" that is all that matters when it comes to the insight of founding fathers, right?



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12-05-2013, 06:11 PM
RE: You atheists enjoy citing anti-religious quotes from the founding fathers...
(12-05-2013 09:06 AM)Ghost Wrote:  Don't feed the trolls.

Already gone Ghost.


... For now, anyway.

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12-05-2013, 06:49 PM
RE: You atheists enjoy citing anti-religious quotes from the founding fathers...
(12-05-2013 12:31 AM)Spectral-Rothbardian Wrote:  As if to appeal to their authority (and reason) on the issue of religion in politics.

Well, how about this quote from an elderly founding father...

"Nothing is more certainly written in the book of fate than that these people are to be free. Nor is it less certain that the two races, equally free, cannot live in the same government. Nature, habit, opinion has drawn indelible lines of distinction between them. It is still in our power to direct the process of emancipation and deportation peaceably and in such slow degree as that the evil will wear off insensibly, and their place be pari passu filled up by free white laborers."

- Thomas Jefferson, Feb. 8, 1821


Oh, but it's only your precious "separation of church and state" that is all that matters when it comes to the insight of founding fathers, right?

Could you stop persecuting us, please Undecided

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12-05-2013, 06:51 PM
RE: You atheists enjoy citing anti-religious quotes from the founding fathers...
How'd I miss this? How did this guy/girl get gone so fast? Dafuq?

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12-05-2013, 10:25 PM
RE: You atheists enjoy citing anti-religious quotes from the founding fathers...
(12-05-2013 04:14 AM)Free Thought Wrote:  ... then again, people do say i would fit in well in the world of politics~

You're a sociopath?

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12-05-2013, 10:30 PM
RE: You atheists enjoy citing anti-religious quotes from the founding fathers...
(12-05-2013 10:25 PM)bbeljefe Wrote:  
(12-05-2013 04:14 AM)Free Thought Wrote:  ... then again, people do say i would fit in well in the world of politics~

You're a sociopath?

Let's say I do not discount that possibility and leave it at that.

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12-05-2013, 11:04 PM
RE: You atheists enjoy citing anti-religious quotes from the founding fathers...
One of my readings: It’s historically false to say that the Founding Fathers intended to create a Christian republic. I don’t think this idea should be taught in schools. - Edward Countryman, Southern Methodist University history professor Austin (Texas) American-Statesman, 1-11-10

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I care to live only to entice people to look at Nature's loveliness. - John Muir
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13-05-2013, 05:03 AM
RE: You atheists enjoy citing anti-religious quotes from the founding fathers...
Who gives a shit what they said, that was then this is now.
If we let every historical figure dictate the way we run our lives today we might as well still be listening to the Pope.

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