You'll gonna castrate me over this one.
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22-10-2016, 07:09 AM
RE: You'll gonna castrate me over this one.
I can't answer directly for teaching or nursing but...

As a correctional officer in Canada I can make between 80k to 100k depending on how much overtime I put in. My counterparts back in Vermont (some of the guys in my Guard unit are also COs) make less than half that. The increased pay here allows them the leverage to create competition over the job and hire people with degrees in behaviour psychology and police foundations for an otherwise not very desirable profession.

It isn't just about greed, it's a matter of investment. No rational person will invest money in educating themselves for a profession that demands a high level of knowledge when the pay for that profession is unlikely to warrant such an investment. Maybe six figures isn't the answer but somewhere between that and the crappy wage most get there has to be a happy medium. If not that, then perhaps at the very least some kind of college debt repayment program. Even the military offers that.

'Murican Canadian
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22-10-2016, 07:13 AM
RE: You'll gonna castrate me over this one.
(22-10-2016 07:02 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(22-10-2016 06:57 AM)ShadowProject Wrote:  Many of the police officers in my town make 100+. They somehow manage to find the tax dollars and continue to ask for more, more, more and always get it. Our police force is.....they have a lot of problems (bullying, corruption, cover ups). But people blindly worship police here.

The teachers tend to average 55/65k. That actually isn't a lot for this area. The teachers I have encountered are hard-working, dedicated, and love what they do. And education dollars are typically the first on the chopping block when tax cuts come. We seriously undervalue education in this country.

I would rather pay teachers the 100k salary, hands down, no question.

You want to pay teachers 100k - but you have a problem with paying that to a guy who has to carry a gun and make life or death decisions as to when to use it????

....

Odd priorities there....

For our particular police force, yes I do take issue. The roster includes many people with the same last name. Nepotism at its finest. These aren't the best of the best recruits. These are the kids or nephew of Mr. Jones. One officer was arrested for domestic violence and beat his wife so severely, she moved out of the state because she knew she wasn't going to get help from the police. He was suspended but now has a desk job. Another went out on lifelong disability after being hurt on the job but was somehow still able to go waterskiing the summer after. His disability leave was voted on in a town forum and ALL of the police force showed up. Who in their right mind would vote against it when the entire police force is there and can see you raise your hand?? My friend had an issue with teenagers coming from the beach and throwing trash and urinating on her lawn at 2am. She called the police and was explain what was happening and the cop got angry with HER! And things got heated and he got right in her face and told her to SHUT UP!! Come to find out, one of the teenagers was his son. She called the local paper because of her experience and was told our police force was under investigation for many issues. Nice.

Please don't get hyper defensive. I am speaking of MY OWN experience with MY local police force.
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22-10-2016, 07:20 AM
RE: You'll gonna castrate me over this one.
I'm a teacher in a title one school. Have been for over a decade. Students almost 100% free lunch, about 95% black. We're forced to do all kinds of worthless paperwork that helps with nothing. There's an insane obsession with keeping every kid in my class no matter how disruptive and destructive, like the confines of my classroom is some kind of panacea. Between classes the kids scream, howl, make animal noises (like barking like dogs) and mimic sexual sounds like female orgasms, in the hallway. It's unnerving. Half the kids do no work in class and we're not allowed to fail them. The Southern Poverty Law Center and NAACP accuse us of running a "school to prison pipeline" but all they do is push for legislation. They never come around to tutor or volunteer. The conditions in many American schools are horrible for a person's mental health. It's like a kind of abuse. I believe that the same system of oppression that has destroyed the students has also destroyed thousands of teachers. I want improved working conditions more than more pay.
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22-10-2016, 07:21 AM
RE: You'll gonna castrate me over this one.
(22-10-2016 06:15 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(22-10-2016 04:20 AM)Banjo Wrote:  So teachers are to be held responsible for their students intelligence?

IN an ideal world - yes............ (you'd have to factor in potential)

But, as I pointed out - we don't live in an ideal world.

Another issue is you might create an incentive for teachers to avoid the most disadvantaged demographics.

'Murican Canadian
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22-10-2016, 07:26 AM
RE: You'll gonna castrate me over this one.
(22-10-2016 07:20 AM)ImFred Wrote:  I'm a teacher in a title one school. Have been for over a decade. Students almost 100% free lunch, about 95% black. We're forced to do all kinds of worthless paperwork that helps with nothing. There's an insane obsession with keeping every kid in my class no matter how disruptive and destructive, like the confines of my classroom is some kind of panacea. Between classes the kids scream, howl, make animal noises (like barking like dogs) and mimic sexual sounds like female orgasms, in the hallway. It's unnerving. Half the kids do no work in class and we're not allowed to fail them. The Southern Poverty Law Center and NAACP accuse us of running a "school to prison pipeline" but all they do is push for legislation. They never come around to tutor or volunteer. The conditions in many American schools are horrible for a person's mental health. It's like a kind of abuse. I believe that the same system of oppression that has destroyed the students has also destroyed thousands of teachers. I want improved working conditions more than more pay.

I have a friend who teaches in Baltimore and the stories are so upsetting. She does the job of a mom, friend, caretaker, educator, police officer and social worker all in one. And makes very little for it. Some of her kids are good kids who are trying to get educated....and some just are not.
You have my kudos.
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22-10-2016, 07:28 AM
RE: You'll gonna castrate me over this one.
They have a way of scoring teaching called VAM (Value Added Model) and it takes into consideration demographics and disabilities and so on. Honestly, it's very hard to get a good VAM score with advanced students because there's less room for growth and much more room for negative growth.
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22-10-2016, 07:32 AM
RE: You'll gonna castrate me over this one.
Quote:You have my kudos.

Well, I'm quitting. It's become pointless.
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22-10-2016, 07:32 AM
RE: You'll gonna castrate me over this one.
(22-10-2016 07:32 AM)ImFred Wrote:  
Quote:You have my kudos.

Well, I'm quitting. It's become pointless.

and I don't think you are alone in this feeling. Sad
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22-10-2016, 07:38 AM
RE: You'll gonna castrate me over this one.
What I'm doing is nothing compared to your friend in Baltimore. Those schools are on a different level. I don't think anyone should do that for more than a couple years. That will positively destroy a person.
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22-10-2016, 08:22 AM
RE: You'll gonna castrate me over this one.
The average college professor salary is $68,970 a year. College are often privately owned. Yet they still show up to work. Teacher at Harvard make $274k a year. I would imagine that at these high end schools that the professors still show up to work.


The branch that always get's the most is the military.
[Image: discretionary_spending_pie,_2015_enacted.png]

But when they want to "trim the fat" it always comes from the education, or science deviations. Maybe if we paid nurses better for those long thankless hours, we could benefit from those years of experience.

Don't Live each day like it's your last. Live each day like you have 541 days after that one where every choice you make will have lasting implications to you and the world around you. ~ Tim Minchin
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