Your judgement day defense strageity?
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06-02-2014, 11:27 AM
RE: Your judgement day defense strageity?
(06-02-2014 09:04 AM)WitchSabrina Wrote:  Never argue nor debate Bible verses..........there's no end to that. Bible verses are open to interpretation. Which was the ultimate reason for the defeat of the Bible from the moment it was written. Talk about getting set-up for failure.

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I feel there's some truth to this.

I only go after fellow believers when it comes to scripture.
I mean, if it might keep them from attending a picket line at Planned Parenthood...

"If you're going my way, I'll go with you."- Jim Croce
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06-02-2014, 11:51 AM
RE: Your judgement day defense strageity?
(06-02-2014 10:33 AM)Drich Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 10:17 AM)natachan Wrote:  But we know it to be unreliable as a historical document. How then can we trust what it says?

why can't you read it?

I have. In Latin and English. The question stands.

I'm also still wondering why I should accept a system that says I'm lesser because I'm a woman.
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06-02-2014, 12:29 PM (This post was last modified: 06-02-2014 02:09 PM by Astreja.)
RE: Your judgement day defense strageity?
(06-02-2014 10:42 AM)Drich Wrote:  eddie Murphy made a 'dunkey' talk how hard would it be for satan to make a serpent speak?

...And how did Eddie do that you ask? It is through the magic of VOICE OVER.

How does voice over work in the real world? Put an object or animal (like a burning bush or snake) in close proximity to a human being and simply speak audiably close enough to the animal or bush so as to make it sound as if the animal or bush is the source of said voice.

I could do this with a couple of cell phones, how is it you think it is impossiable for God or satan?

Funny, My copy of Genesis doesn't mention Satan, or ventriloquism or cell phones. I think that the actual Jewish authors of Genesis really did mean Talking Snake™.

And there you go, interpreting the very thing that you said just needed to be read as is. You've opened a {metaphorical, not literal} can of worms now. (Springy G opens up Her word processor and rewrites the Gospel scene in the Garden of Gethsemane...)

In the New, Improved Testament, instead of being arrested, tortured and crucified, Jesus is rescued by a SWAT team consisting of the Springy Goddess, Raistlin Majere, Thor, Loki, Guan Yin, Tiamat, (approximately) 100 Chinese Tea Dragons, and a litter of Space Cats from the Pleiades. Tiamat bitchslaps Judas, causing him to drop the 30 pieces of silver, and sends the money off with one of the dragons with instructions to compensate the village who lost their herd of pigs and the guy whose fig tree mysteriously withered and died. The rescue party decamps to a brew pub in Anatolia, and Jesus and his girlfriend Maggie live happily ever after.

The. End. Cool
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06-02-2014, 03:18 PM
RE: Your judgement day defense strageity?
This is the scenario I picture if I were to meet god on my death.

Me: "Oh for fucks sake God, why do you have to take everything to the bleedin' extreme? Hide and seek is normally such a simple fucking game!"

God: "Snicker."

Me: "Right, can we play hide the sausage now?"

God: "S'ppose so."

Me: "And don't fucking hide it where you did last time, you dirty bastard."

God: "Snicker."

Me under my breath: "Prick."

In walks Drich.

God: "I told you to fucking knock you moron"
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08-02-2014, 10:56 AM
RE: Your judgement day defense strageity?
(03-02-2014 02:19 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(03-02-2014 01:50 AM)Drich Wrote:  Simple premise. If this whole atheism thing turns out to be wrong, and you die only to wake up standing before the God of the bible, what will you say?

You gave me no proof.

You should have done miricals in my time..

Will you try and turn things on God and put Him on the defensive?

Why do kids get cancer
Why do babies in Africa get aids or starve to death etc..

Or will you say you were a good and moral man?

Or will you be judged and go with what Christ decides?

Or do you have something better?


(This is not my creative work, but it seemed a better response than anything I'd care to write. Full credit in the link at the bottom.)


“But what if you’re wrong?” So goes the common questions posed to atheists by Christians. Putting aside for a moment the obvious retort (what if they are wrong and another religion is right?) I decided to really organize my thoughts a bit. What would I say if I was wrong, the Christians were right, and a moment after dying I found myself before the blinding majesty of Yahweh with Christ at his right hand?

Oh. Oh dear. I see. Well, I guess this is about as close to incontrovertible evidence for your existence as I could have ever demanded. Actually, as a good skeptic I pray you won’t get offended if I entertain the possibility that I’m experiencing a hypoxia-induced hallucination. But, I’ll just go along with this for now.

I’m not going to kneel or anything if you don’t mind. That would kind of be shutting the barn door after the cows have run out, don’t you think? Besides: by your will, I was thrust into life in a very undignified manner and state, so the least you could do would be to let me leave it in better circumstances. And really, that would be the very, very least you could do. You know, now that the initial shock of being dead is starting to wear off, I find myself getting angry. I’m trying to restrain it, but this whole situation is… absurd. According to most accounts, this is the part where you judge me. Who the hell are you to be a moral judge? You’re a sadistic, genocidal sex-obsessed tyrant. All my life, I laughed off those Christians who accused me of “hating God”. Like I told them, it wasn’t that I hated you; I just genuinely didn’t think you existed. But I did hate the idea of you. I didn’t see evidence to believe in any gods, but you in particular seemed like a logical contradiction. I was glad that the Bible was a work of-seeming-fiction because the belief that all of the most terrible things in the world were, at the worst, designed by or, at the best, permitted by an all-powerful conscious being was too horrible to not hate. It’s oddly refreshing to find that all this time I was outraged at something more tangible.

Or is this the part where your grand plan is revealed, your “mysterious ways” made clear? Will you say the magic words and suddenly I’ll understand how a child being raped, murdered, and left in a ditch fits in with you infinite benevolence? Will starvation and disease make sense? Because you know, I don’t think I want them to make sense. If that’s part of your omniscient knowledge, then I don’t want that part. I guess its fitting: humanity’s first act of defiance was to want knowledge to be more like you. Then let my last act of defiance be choosing ignorance so that I can be as unlike you as possible.

This is all perfectly futile. You know me better than anyone. You know my mind. You know how I thought. You know – and had the power over- all the circumstances in my life that meant you very existence seemed impossible to me. After all, you “knit me together in my mother’s womb,” didn’t you? So am I just a casualty of free will, then? You wanted worship from people who could choose to worship you and, to satisfy your ego, decided it was a fair price to create people whom you knew wouldn’t choose you and would face eternal torture for it. You know, even if almost everything had been perfect, a world free from pain and death where everyone would freely choose to spend an eternity with you – except for one person, and yet you made him anyways… then you would still be infinitely more evil than all the worst of humanity combined. You’re going to judge me? On behalf of all that’s good and decent in your creation, I judge you. I may have been a willful child, but you were a terrible father.

I can’t say I’m really inclined to beg for my soul now, given what I said about you knowing me perfectly. Even so, supposing mercy’s still an option (and that last rant didn’t kill my chances), I guess it’s worth a shot. I can’t pretend I have any love for you, but no principle is worth being damned over if it can be helped. What shall I say in my defense?

I tried to be good without you. You told your followers to feed the hungry, clothe the poor, and visit the sick. I did those things, not because you told me to or because I thought I was “storing up treasure in heaven”. I did them for their own sake, for the sake of my neighbors. When I saw suffering, I tried to help instead of saying a quick prayer to you and believing I’d done something. And when I didn’t help and suffering continued, I held myself responsible instead of concluding it was just your divine will.

And I was content with one life- in fact, despite how terrible life could be, I was usually quite grateful to have one. I didn’t demand more. I was content to create my own meaning in the meaningless chaos, to find love in all the pain, to find the beautiful simplicity in the apparent complexity. And I have to say, you may have failed basic ethics but you sure had a deft hand when it came to creating the cosmos – not least because you did it in such a way as to make yourself seem irrelevant. The splendor of the night sky, the incredible diversity of life, everything. Quantum mechanics? That was crazy, I loved it! And relativity? You were on a roll that day, really. I saw nearly all of your creation for what it was: wonderful. I didn’t look at an exquisitely intricate world and call it fallen. I didn’t look at a newborn baby and call it sinful. I didn’t look at my seemingly finite life and call it inadequate.

So you created us because you desired companionship and love? Well then, you needed me. But I didn’t need you. I grew up and took responsibility for my own life. If that really is the greatest crime of all, then there’s nothing more I can say. The deck was stacked against me, but honestly, I can’t truly say I have any regrets. Heaven, hell, oblivion… your move, God.

Though I still think I’m probably hallucinating.


http://www.atheismresource.com/2010/what...ly-happens

ROTFL

Adam had a much shorter version of this speech. I think it was, "Lord, this woman you gave me...."

It didn't work for him.
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10-02-2014, 02:15 AM
RE: Your judgement day defense strageity?
(08-02-2014 10:56 AM)anidominus Wrote:  
(03-02-2014 02:19 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  (This is not my creative work, but it seemed a better response than anything I'd care to write. Full credit in the link at the bottom.)


“But what if you’re wrong?” So goes the common questions posed to atheists by Christians. Putting aside for a moment the obvious retort (what if they are wrong and another religion is right?) I decided to really organize my thoughts a bit. What would I say if I was wrong, the Christians were right, and a moment after dying I found myself before the blinding majesty of Yahweh with Christ at his right hand?

Oh. Oh dear. I see. Well, I guess this is about as close to incontrovertible evidence for your existence as I could have ever demanded. Actually, as a good skeptic I pray you won’t get offended if I entertain the possibility that I’m experiencing a hypoxia-induced hallucination. But, I’ll just go along with this for now.

I’m not going to kneel or anything if you don’t mind. That would kind of be shutting the barn door after the cows have run out, don’t you think? Besides: by your will, I was thrust into life in a very undignified manner and state, so the least you could do would be to let me leave it in better circumstances. And really, that would be the very, very least you could do. You know, now that the initial shock of being dead is starting to wear off, I find myself getting angry. I’m trying to restrain it, but this whole situation is… absurd. According to most accounts, this is the part where you judge me. Who the hell are you to be a moral judge? You’re a sadistic, genocidal sex-obsessed tyrant. All my life, I laughed off those Christians who accused me of “hating God”. Like I told them, it wasn’t that I hated you; I just genuinely didn’t think you existed. But I did hate the idea of you. I didn’t see evidence to believe in any gods, but you in particular seemed like a logical contradiction. I was glad that the Bible was a work of-seeming-fiction because the belief that all of the most terrible things in the world were, at the worst, designed by or, at the best, permitted by an all-powerful conscious being was too horrible to not hate. It’s oddly refreshing to find that all this time I was outraged at something more tangible.

Or is this the part where your grand plan is revealed, your “mysterious ways” made clear? Will you say the magic words and suddenly I’ll understand how a child being raped, murdered, and left in a ditch fits in with you infinite benevolence? Will starvation and disease make sense? Because you know, I don’t think I want them to make sense. If that’s part of your omniscient knowledge, then I don’t want that part. I guess its fitting: humanity’s first act of defiance was to want knowledge to be more like you. Then let my last act of defiance be choosing ignorance so that I can be as unlike you as possible.

This is all perfectly futile. You know me better than anyone. You know my mind. You know how I thought. You know – and had the power over- all the circumstances in my life that meant you very existence seemed impossible to me. After all, you “knit me together in my mother’s womb,” didn’t you? So am I just a casualty of free will, then? You wanted worship from people who could choose to worship you and, to satisfy your ego, decided it was a fair price to create people whom you knew wouldn’t choose you and would face eternal torture for it. You know, even if almost everything had been perfect, a world free from pain and death where everyone would freely choose to spend an eternity with you – except for one person, and yet you made him anyways… then you would still be infinitely more evil than all the worst of humanity combined. You’re going to judge me? On behalf of all that’s good and decent in your creation, I judge you. I may have been a willful child, but you were a terrible father.

I can’t say I’m really inclined to beg for my soul now, given what I said about you knowing me perfectly. Even so, supposing mercy’s still an option (and that last rant didn’t kill my chances), I guess it’s worth a shot. I can’t pretend I have any love for you, but no principle is worth being damned over if it can be helped. What shall I say in my defense?

I tried to be good without you. You told your followers to feed the hungry, clothe the poor, and visit the sick. I did those things, not because you told me to or because I thought I was “storing up treasure in heaven”. I did them for their own sake, for the sake of my neighbors. When I saw suffering, I tried to help instead of saying a quick prayer to you and believing I’d done something. And when I didn’t help and suffering continued, I held myself responsible instead of concluding it was just your divine will.

And I was content with one life- in fact, despite how terrible life could be, I was usually quite grateful to have one. I didn’t demand more. I was content to create my own meaning in the meaningless chaos, to find love in all the pain, to find the beautiful simplicity in the apparent complexity. And I have to say, you may have failed basic ethics but you sure had a deft hand when it came to creating the cosmos – not least because you did it in such a way as to make yourself seem irrelevant. The splendor of the night sky, the incredible diversity of life, everything. Quantum mechanics? That was crazy, I loved it! And relativity? You were on a roll that day, really. I saw nearly all of your creation for what it was: wonderful. I didn’t look at an exquisitely intricate world and call it fallen. I didn’t look at a newborn baby and call it sinful. I didn’t look at my seemingly finite life and call it inadequate.

So you created us because you desired companionship and love? Well then, you needed me. But I didn’t need you. I grew up and took responsibility for my own life. If that really is the greatest crime of all, then there’s nothing more I can say. The deck was stacked against me, but honestly, I can’t truly say I have any regrets. Heaven, hell, oblivion… your move, God.

Though I still think I’m probably hallucinating.


http://www.atheismresource.com/2010/what...ly-happens

ROTFL

Adam had a much shorter version of this speech. I think it was, "Lord, this woman you gave me...."

It didn't work for him.

Of course it didn't.

It never happened.

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10-02-2014, 02:24 AM
RE: Your judgement day defense strageity?
(10-02-2014 02:15 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(08-02-2014 10:56 AM)anidominus Wrote:  ROTFL

Adam had a much shorter version of this speech. I think it was, "Lord, this woman you gave me...."

It didn't work for him.

Of course it didn't.

It never happened.

Can't. Fucking. Stop. Laughing.


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Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


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10-02-2014, 02:52 AM
RE: Your judgement day defense strageity?
(06-02-2014 10:37 AM)Drich Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 10:25 AM)WitchSabrina Wrote:  And HOW many people **read** it to mean something different?


Common!!!
Really?

We are not talking in general we are speaking to one very specific instance. read this and tell me what it means:
" to everyone who is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith. "

To everyone among me I am to try to think soberly, as god measures me another shot of Faith?


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10-02-2014, 03:26 AM (This post was last modified: 10-02-2014 03:32 AM by Kestrel.)
RE: Your judgement day defense strageity?
Still waiting for a rebuttal on this:

Kestrel Wrote:And Romans is addressed to believers. Not "all men". All references to faith are to the believer. "...to everyone who is among you."

...answering your claim, Drich, that faith is available to all.

"If you're going my way, I'll go with you."- Jim Croce
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10-02-2014, 07:24 PM
RE: Your judgement day defense strageity?
(06-02-2014 11:22 AM)Kestrel Wrote:  
Drich Wrote:Thank you for your advise.. Just know I have been doing this for a while.

Well you're doing a spectacular job of not letting your experience show.

And Romans is addressed to believers. Not "all men". All references to faith are to the believer. "...to everyone who is among you."

I'm sure you know this because:

Drich Wrote:there is nothing to argue or interpret. all one need do is read what is on the page.

Drinking Beverage

I still do not see a question here.

The Index: A/S/K Ask Seek Knock as outlined by Luke 11:5-13
Ot Old testament
Nt New testament
H/S Holy Spirit

If you want to ask me a question feel free to Pm me or E/M me. I will not speak of it to anyone.
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