altruism
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
03-07-2017, 07:38 AM
altruism
(25-06-2017 09:13 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  So i made a comment on a post i made about The Good Book about how i don't trust altruism. I don't want to divert that thread but i think its important to address an objection made. This is an area where i seriously have to criticize atheist. So many atheist i have talked to don't read the origins of various ideas and ask "where did this idea come from and why did this person believe it.". Altruism is a Christian idea,and its a bad Christian idea. To define altruism simply its the belief that the only moral actions are those in which the actor gets no benefit. Not only is this unrealistic it is contrary to human psychology. Even if the only reason someone does something is for a sense of moral superiority.

I only help people for selfish reasons. If its someone i know and care about i help them because i want them to be happy. If it is someone i don't know i help them because one day i might need help. I do not trust altruism, or people who claim to act from selfless reasons.

The origin of altruism was an attempt to provide a secular ethic in the context of comte's belief in the fallen nature of man. So many times we atheist either don't question how theist beliefs shape even atheist scientists ideas.


Altruism is a behavioral concept in biology and humans aren't the only species to behave altruistically. It doesn't matter if you "don't trust it" because you behave altruistically even if you don't realize it.


Cheers
TheBeardedDude

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like TheBeardedDude's post
03-07-2017, 07:45 AM
RE: altruism
(03-07-2017 07:32 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 05:39 AM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Why should I find it disgusting? It was one of Moffat's best episodes.
i will admit I don't know who moffat is. Perhaps there is context ...

You take the time to analyze the sentiment but not the 10 seconds required to google Moffat or the quote? I'll provide the context for others to spite your intellectually lazy ass.





And Moffat has already anticipated and considered your response.




#sigh
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes GirlyMan's post
03-07-2017, 09:34 AM
RE: altruism
(03-07-2017 07:38 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(25-06-2017 09:13 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  So i made a comment on a post i made about The Good Book about how i don't trust altruism. I don't want to divert that thread but i think its important to address an objection made. This is an area where i seriously have to criticize atheist. So many atheist i have talked to don't read the origins of various ideas and ask "where did this idea come from and why did this person believe it.". Altruism is a Christian idea,and its a bad Christian idea. To define altruism simply its the belief that the only moral actions are those in which the actor gets no benefit. Not only is this unrealistic it is contrary to human psychology. Even if the only reason someone does something is for a sense of moral superiority.

I only help people for selfish reasons. If its someone i know and care about i help them because i want them to be happy. If it is someone i don't know i help them because one day i might need help. I do not trust altruism, or people who claim to act from selfless reasons.

The origin of altruism was an attempt to provide a secular ethic in the context of comte's belief in the fallen nature of man. So many times we atheist either don't question how theist beliefs shape even atheist scientists ideas.


Altruism is a behavioral concept in biology and humans aren't the only species to behave altruistically. It doesn't matter if you "don't trust it" because you behave altruistically even if you don't realize it.


Cheers
TheBeardedDude
You know god exists even if you won't admit it.

I don't believe claim that altruism actually exists for the same reason i don't believe god exists.

I don't "trust" in altruism because like those who try to sell me on the concept of god i find the idea bankrupt.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
03-07-2017, 09:41 AM
RE: altruism
(03-07-2017 07:45 AM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 07:32 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  i will admit I don't know who moffat is. Perhaps there is context ...

You take the time to analyze the sentiment but not the 10 seconds required to google Moffat or the quote? I'll provide the context for others to spite your intellectually lazy ass.





And Moffat has already anticipated and considered your response.



Not really sure at this point how the second video is a response to the first. After i finished my post i did google moffat and intend to watch the episode when i have my next day off.

I want to note here how you did not answe the objections i made to the quote. Let me restate the question which the every pro-altruist seems to be avoiding.

If an individual holds that increasing the wellbeing of those around oneself increases their own wellbeing, can that individual be said to be "good".

A second question which follows from the first. If the answer is yes, doesn't this conflict with altruism?
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
03-07-2017, 09:47 AM
altruism
(03-07-2017 09:34 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 07:38 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Altruism is a behavioral concept in biology and humans aren't the only species to behave altruistically. It doesn't matter if you "don't trust it" because you behave altruistically even if you don't realize it.


Cheers
TheBeardedDude
You know god exists even if you won't admit it.

I don't believe claim that altruism actually exists for the same reason i don't believe god exists.

I don't "trust" in altruism because like those who try to sell me on the concept of god i find the idea bankrupt.


Wtf? You a clairvoyant? How do you "know" something I know that I don't know I "know?"


Cheers
TheBeardedDude

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes TheBeardedDude's post
03-07-2017, 09:48 AM
RE: altruism
(03-07-2017 09:41 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  If an individual holds that increasing the wellbeing of those around oneself increases their own wellbeing, can that individual be said to be "good".

If an individual holds that the logical conclusion of altruism is the complete dissolution and annihilation of "self", can it be called selfish?

#sigh
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes GirlyMan's post
03-07-2017, 10:07 AM
RE: altruism
(03-07-2017 09:47 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 09:34 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  You know god exists even if you won't admit it.

I don't believe claim that altruism actually exists for the same reason i don't believe god exists.

I don't "trust" in altruism because like those who try to sell me on the concept of god i find the idea bankrupt.


Wtf? You a clairvoyant? How do you "know" something I know that I don't know I "know?"


Cheers
TheBeardedDude
Go back and read what you wrote. Then read what i wrote. Compare the two statement. You are claiming that i "really" believe in altruism even if i don't know it. So why shouldn't i claim you really believe in god and you just don't know it. You can't have your cake and eat it to. If i am not allowed to make a knowledge claim concerning you, you are not allowed to make a knowledge claim about me.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
03-07-2017, 10:09 AM
altruism
(03-07-2017 10:07 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 09:47 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Wtf? You a clairvoyant? How do you "know" something I know that I don't know I "know?"


Cheers
TheBeardedDude
Go back and read what you wrote. Then read what i wrote. Compare the two statement. You are claiming that i "really" believe in altruism even if i don't know it. So why shouldn't i claim you really believe in god and you just don't know it. You can't have your cake and eat it to. If i am not allowed to make a knowledge claim concerning you, you are not allowed to make a knowledge claim about me.


Go back and read what I wrote. I didn't say you believe in it regardless, I said you engage in it regardless (unless you're a psychopath). Don't play semantics games with me, dick


Cheers
TheBeardedDude

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes TheBeardedDude's post
03-07-2017, 10:13 AM
RE: altruism
(03-07-2017 09:48 AM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(03-07-2017 09:41 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  If an individual holds that increasing the wellbeing of those around oneself increases their own wellbeing, can that individual be said to be "good".



If an individual holds that the logical conclusion of altruism is the complete dissolution and annihilation of "self", can it be called selfish?
I am going to answer your question, but first let me point out you still have not answered mine.

The answer is no. By definition they would in fact be selfless, or "without self".

Now please answer my question.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
03-07-2017, 10:55 AM
RE: altruism
(03-07-2017 10:13 AM)BlkFnx Wrote:  Now please answer my question.

You want to give me some time to consider it carefully or do you want me to just fart something out of my ass like you just did?

#sigh
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like GirlyMan's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: