circumcision
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01-09-2014, 02:31 PM
RE: circumcision
(01-09-2014 02:08 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
Pros For Infant Circumcision (non-medically necessary)

  1. Small reduction in chance of getting HIV (less than a condom reduces however)

With the significant addendum that the only credible, statistically significant research shows a decrease in risk of HIV transmission for female-to-male transmission during penetrative vaginal sex only.

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01-09-2014, 02:33 PM
RE: circumcision
(01-09-2014 02:31 PM)cjlr Wrote:  
(01-09-2014 02:08 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
Pros For Infant Circumcision (non-medically necessary)

  1. Small reduction in chance of getting HIV (less than a condom reduces however)

With the significant addendum that the only credible, statistically significant research shows a decrease in risk of HIV transmission for female-to-male transmission during penetrative vaginal sex only.

Even then it is lass than the reduction of condom use provides. Plus condom use does not require permanent body modification.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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01-09-2014, 02:36 PM
RE: circumcision
(01-09-2014 01:39 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(01-09-2014 11:46 AM)evenheathen Wrote:  Gotta admit, mine is and i had my boys' done too. Totally cultural and tradition based. I just don't see it as that barbaric, I have no recollection of it being done and I know my boys won't either. The way it's done in modern hospitals is not that horrific.

That being said I agree with every argument against it and have no excuse for my actions. Drinking Beverage

That was why my girlfriend had her sons done. Her husband was and she wanted them to be like Daddy.

In hospitals they do numb the area.

I went to Bris many years ago, gotta say the baby hardly cried at all.

I didn't do it my sons....

The first had a difficult birth so I couldn't see putting myself through that. Lol. Yes...myself, I was completely selfish. The doctor was relieved and said she wasn't very good at them (I would call that an excited utterance), well that kinda sealed it for me.

The second...I just decided to keep him like his older bro.

They didn't cut anything though. They just put a little plastic ring around it and after a couple of days the foreskin falls off. Easy peasy. I don't think either of them even noticed.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

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01-09-2014, 02:52 PM
RE: circumcision
(01-09-2014 02:33 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(01-09-2014 02:31 PM)cjlr Wrote:  With the significant addendum that the only credible, statistically significant research shows a decrease in risk of HIV transmission for female-to-male transmission during penetrative vaginal sex only.

Even then it is lass than the reduction of condom use provides. Plus condom use does not require permanent body modification.

Indeed. Actually there's some evidence that the religious bullshit (and it's mostly religious bullshit driving circumcision in Africa; the rationalisations are post-hoc) ends up increasing transmission, because of the false risk homeostasis. If you tell people "this will make you safer" when it actually doesn't in most cases they'll act more recklessly under that impression...

In 100 out of 100 cases, it's a worse option than a condom for preventing disease transmission.

If ever condom use is not an option, we invariably have that same religious bullshit to thank.

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01-09-2014, 03:14 PM
RE: circumcision
(01-09-2014 02:36 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  
(01-09-2014 01:39 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  That was why my girlfriend had her sons done. Her husband was and she wanted them to be like Daddy.

In hospitals they do numb the area.

I went to Bris many years ago, gotta say the baby hardly cried at all.

I didn't do it my sons....

The first had a difficult birth so I couldn't see putting myself through that. Lol. Yes...myself, I was completely selfish. The doctor was relieved and said she wasn't very good at them (I would call that an excited utterance), well that kinda sealed it for me.

The second...I just decided to keep him like his older bro.

They didn't cut anything though. They just put a little plastic ring around it and after a couple of days the foreskin falls off. Easy peasy. I don't think either of them even noticed.

Excellent! Mutilation made easy. Dodgy

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01-09-2014, 03:44 PM
RE: circumcision
(01-09-2014 02:52 PM)cjlr Wrote:  
(01-09-2014 02:33 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Even then it is lass than the reduction of condom use provides. Plus condom use does not require permanent body modification.

Indeed. Actually there's some evidence that the religious bullshit (and it's mostly religious bullshit driving circumcision in Africa; the rationalisations are post-hoc) ends up increasing transmission, because of the false risk homeostasis. If you tell people "this will make you safer" when it actually doesn't in most cases they'll act more recklessly under that impression...

In 100 out of 100 cases, it's a worse option than a condom for preventing disease transmission.

If ever condom use is not an option, we invariably have that same religious bullshit to thank.

The point of that list was to show the unbalanced scale of Pros and Cons, other than the cancer risk (which tbh is a low risk anyway) the others are not worth the risk of the Cons. I could post some horrifying pictures but even being medical in nature they would violate the rules.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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01-09-2014, 03:52 PM
RE: circumcision
(01-09-2014 03:14 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(01-09-2014 02:36 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  They didn't cut anything though. They just put a little plastic ring around it and after a couple of days the foreskin falls off. Easy peasy. I don't think either of them even noticed.

Excellent! Mutilation made easy. Dodgy

Yup. Drinking Beverage

Still not arguing for the practice, but admitting my blind adherence to a cultural phenomenon that I would choose again despite the arguments against it. I don't know what else to say.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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01-09-2014, 04:05 PM
RE: circumcision
(01-09-2014 03:52 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  
(01-09-2014 03:14 PM)Chas Wrote:  Excellent! Mutilation made easy. Dodgy

Yup. Drinking Beverage

Still not arguing for the practice, but admitting my blind adherence to a cultural phenomenon that I would choose again despite the arguments against it. I don't know what else to say.

Sounds a bit like Logan's Run...

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01-09-2014, 04:17 PM
RE: circumcision
(01-09-2014 04:05 PM)Sam Wrote:  
(01-09-2014 03:52 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  Yup. Drinking Beverage

Still not arguing for the practice, but admitting my blind adherence to a cultural phenomenon that I would choose again despite the arguments against it. I don't know what else to say.

Sounds a bit like Logan's Run...

S'cuse me while I google....

Edit: You're right, that's exactly the same.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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01-09-2014, 04:18 PM
RE: circumcision
(01-09-2014 03:52 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  
(01-09-2014 03:14 PM)Chas Wrote:  Excellent! Mutilation made easy. Dodgy

Yup. Drinking Beverage

Still not arguing for the practice, but admitting my blind adherence to a cultural phenomenon that I would choose again despite the arguments against it. I don't know what else to say.

Blind adherence. Even with knowledge, you would choose it again. That's sad.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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