couldn't early human evelution be used to argue againist veganism
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26-09-2014, 06:41 AM
RE: couldn't early human evelution be used to argue againist veganism
How can you tell if someone's a vegan?

Don't worry they'll tell you..:-)
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26-09-2014, 11:23 AM (This post was last modified: 26-09-2014 11:27 AM by grizzlysnake.)
RE: couldn't early human evelution be used to argue againist veganism
It's was more than diet, we did have to organize to hunt our food. Developed communication, language, gestures to sneak up on the larger animals. Watched and learned how other animals stalked their prey, even wore animal skins to disguise ourselves. And all the tools and weapons we developed. We owe a lot to our ancient ancestors for this awesome brain we have, and yes even the animals we hunted and ate. I almost view it disrespectful not to eat meat, but yeah I'm silly like thatTongue

"I don't have to have faith, I have experience." Joseph Campbell
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26-09-2014, 01:51 PM
RE: couldn't early human evelution be used to argue againist veganism
Your body benefits from the nutritional value of meat or vegetable and can also handle both.
It's up to the individual to decide what they will eat.

Just stating the obvious.

If you want to imagine that it is bad to eat meat, then realise that many people have lived healthily for sustained periods on vegetarian diets.
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26-09-2014, 10:01 PM
RE: couldn't early human evelution be used to argue againist veganism
(14-07-2014 06:02 PM)kunoxian drive Wrote:  I know what your thinking but your wrong.. i am not going to be using this next argument for the purposes of arguing against vegetarianism. the thing Is I want to see where these thoughts of mine lead me. what there ultimate conclusions are. what am I talking about. I am, talking about the fact that human evolution has one interesting argument against veterinarians. whether it be illogical is not the point here.

It goes.

human brains are what we use to feel impathy. if I remember right the reason we have such large brains is due to the human diet,... and thus you se the conundrum. human brains evolved due to meat eating. if I remember. I will be fact checking this tomorrow. thus what would happen if we stopped eating meat.... lol. like i said I just want to see where this argument leads.. nothing else.

p.s. I am putting another question on another post...it's another pondering of mine that is interesting.

Don't know why I am responding.

Your conclusion doesn't follow from your premise. If you are trying to argue that we always ate meat, therefore we should always eat meat, this is a fallacious appeal to authority (in the form of an appeal to tradition). If you are trying to argue that your health would suffer without meat, than this is verifiably false. There is no reason to believe our body requires meat, and I have yet to read a study that supports that claim that our healthy necessarily suffers without animal proteins. If you believe one's health does suffer without animal proteins, then the burden of proof is on you to support that claim. Anecdotal evidence is no more compelling here than it is in any other kind of debate.


The impact of early human diet on brain development is an interesting, if largely academic topic. I don't think it applies in anyway to our modern diets. Different circumstances, different times, different consequences. The reasons why I and most people choose to be vegan has nothing to do with evolution. It's a complete non sequitur.

This line of reasoning would not be accepted or repeated on this forum on any other topic. Curiously enough though it comes up time and again, without fail, every time someone brings up veganism. If you want to "prove veganism wrong", you could certainly at least attempt to make observation that isn't so deeply rooted in logical fallacies.
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26-09-2014, 10:05 PM
RE: couldn't early human evelution be used to argue againist veganism
(26-09-2014 06:41 AM)rorythegambler Wrote:  How can you tell if someone's a vegan?

Don't worry they'll tell you..:-)

Wonderful first post. Very original.

Obviously the OP is a vegan in disguise. Pushing the hemp clothing, tofu eating, green peace wipe-your-ass-with-fig-leaves-to-save-toilet paper evil vegan agenda.

But this is the double standard that so plagues this topic. Spend hours formulating intelligent and well reasoned responses, and get called an asshole by people who join the discussion for no other reason than to insult you and dramatically misrepresent your beliefs.

Still don't know why I am responding. Must be in a sour mood.
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27-09-2014, 02:45 AM
RE: couldn't early human evelution be used to argue againist veganism
(14-07-2014 06:02 PM)kunoxian drive Wrote:  human brains are what we use to feel impathy. if I remember right the reason we have such large brains is due to the human diet,... and thus you se the conundrum. human brains evolved due to meat eating. if I remember. I will be fact checking this tomorrow. thus what would happen if we stopped eating meat.... lol. like i said I just want to see where this argument leads.. nothing else.

As I understand it, it's not clear whether meat was the main factor supporting brain growth, or cooking was[1]. In any case our evolutionary history and our nature doesn't require us to act in particular ways. We are able to act in ways not programmed to do so by our past. If we have enough diverse quality vegan food there is no reason why our bodies could not be supported by our bodies. That said, naive veganism that does not consider nutrition (especially combined with raw foods) can lead to nutritional problems.

[1] http://www.scientificamerican.com/articl...er-brains/

Give me your argument in the form of a published paper, and then we can start to talk.
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27-09-2014, 03:22 AM
RE: couldn't early human evelution be used to argue againist veganism
Nothing about modern life emulates the circumstances or lifestyle in which we evolved. If being vegetarian is wrong because our ancestors made beneficial adaptations on a diet that included meat, then so is agriculture, electricity, monogamy, and going to the store to get lean chicken breast and then remaining sedentary as you eat it, as opposed to stealing the leftovers from a hyena kill and using an obsidian axe to break open the bones for the fat rich marrow.

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23-10-2014, 10:10 AM
RE: couldn't early human evelution be used to argue againist veganism
I personally don't really care for veganism but I have known a vegan and he is a very nice person.Smile
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23-10-2014, 10:29 AM
RE: couldn't early human evelution be used to argue againist veganism
Actually, this is not a philosophical issue. It is scientific.

http://www.livescience.com/24875-meat-human-brain.html

Quote: Vegetarian, vegan and raw diets can be healthy — likely far healthier than the typical American diet. But to continue to call these diets "natural" for humans, in terms of evolution, is a bit of a stretch, according to two recent, independent studies.

Eating meat and cooking food made us human, the studies suggest, enabling the brains of our prehuman ancestors to grow dramatically over a period of a few million years.

Although this isn't the first such assertion from archaeologists and evolutionary biologists, the new studies demonstrate, respectively, that it would have been biologically implausible for humans to evolve such a large brain on a raw, vegan diet and that meat-eating was a crucial element of human evolution at least 1 million years before the dawn of humankind.

Atheism is NOT a Religion. It's A Personal Relationship With Reality!
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23-10-2014, 10:34 AM
RE: couldn't early human evelution be used to argue againist veganism
(27-09-2014 02:45 AM)Hafnof Wrote:  
(14-07-2014 06:02 PM)kunoxian drive Wrote:  human brains are what we use to feel impathy. if I remember right the reason we have such large brains is due to the human diet,... and thus you se the conundrum. human brains evolved due to meat eating. if I remember. I will be fact checking this tomorrow. thus what would happen if we stopped eating meat.... lol. like i said I just want to see where this argument leads.. nothing else.

As I understand it, it's not clear whether meat was the main factor supporting brain growth, or cooking was[1]. In any case our evolutionary history and our nature doesn't require us to act in particular ways. We are able to act in ways not programmed to do so by our past. If we have enough diverse quality vegan food there is no reason why our bodies could not be supported by our bodies. That said, naive veganism that does not consider nutrition (especially combined with raw foods) can lead to nutritional problems.

[1] http://www.scientificamerican.com/articl...er-brains/

Bodies supported by our bodies?
I dont think that's what you meant to say.
Other than that....i agree with what you're saying.

When I want your opinion I'll read your entrails.
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