femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
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15-08-2014, 07:55 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 07:42 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(15-08-2014 07:26 AM)Zippo Wrote:  Video games are a business. As long as the game sells, no one is going to worry about any group complaining that they are not being portrayed to their liking in a game. The only way that can happen is if the group that complains actually influences sales and eventually developers change the games to satisfy the demand.

From post 18, substitute video games for comics

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...#pid623700

(13-08-2014 02:55 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  Only because of the existing demographic. There is nothing inherently masculine in reading comics.

If all comics are aimed at young boys and you write a comic that has a main female character than most women could identify with then it's not going to sell well because most women won't ever consider buying a comic if the ones that already exist aren't aimed at them.

This is why it's useful to point out a gender imbalance. It widens the potential market. It tells women out there that there is a new product for them to consider purchasing and it's OK for people like them to own such an item.

Not really. Nearly half the market are women.

Quote:According to a study conducted by the Entertainment Software Association in 2012, "Forty-seven percent of all game players are women. In fact, women over the age of 18 represent a significantly greater portion of the game-playing population (30 percent) than boys age 17 or younger (18 percent)."[38][39]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_v...emographic
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15-08-2014, 08:01 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 07:44 AM)Res Publica Wrote:  We are discussing whether or not video games affect behavior. Many studies have been done on this (mostly in the area of video games and violence) and it is now know that video games do not cause violence.
Sources?

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15-08-2014, 08:02 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 07:49 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  Any society.

No. At least not enough that it's as big a problem as you make it seem. Women here have the same opportunities as men, except the highly religious women who "choose" to stay home or whatever. My teachers have mainly been women, regardless of the area. In fact, AFAIK, teachers in general are usually female. From English to Math to Algebra to Physics to PE. Mainly women. I see more women teaching at my college than men. The men usually do research, and that's if they work there at all; many are something I don't know the English word for, but it's sort of like a part-time teaching job... with female teachers as their bosses. Sometimes the women focus on research as well. They are free to do so. One of my Mechanics teacher retired from teaching to focus entirely on research. The other one is taking a break from teaching to do the same. Doctors? Mainly female. I could go on, but I think I've made my point to those who don't believe that discrimination exists everywhere without actually having studied all ~200 countries in the world.

(15-08-2014 07:49 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  Don't assume that I'm American.

I must've missed the post where I made that assumption. I'm just assuming that you come from a society that discriminates against (at least) women. Given your "Any society" bit, I think that's a fair assumption.

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15-08-2014, 08:03 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 07:48 AM)One Above All Wrote:  
(15-08-2014 07:45 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  You were right to delete that fallacious argument the first time round.

No argument. Just me saying that you're too blind to see that you're wrong.

Which is exactly my point to you. I have said many times that the effect is pernicious and is part of cultural conditioning. You are the one that is arguing about whether there is a direct link between playing video games and specific actions such as rape.

I enjoy video games myself. I can also tell the difference between the virtual world and reality. I also watch TV and watch films, I read the news. I might well have been saying the same things that you are saying when I was much younger.

But I have also listened to grandparents and parents about how their perceptions were changed during the lead up to world war II. I was brought up in a household that read the Daily Mail and I remember being made angry as a child by what I read, only to then find out many years later how I had been duped after moving to different countries and speaking to many different people with a different upbringing to me. It is interesting to see how national values are mirrored by what is portrayed on television.

This whole discussion forum is filled with people who have been duped by religion and their views have changed once they learnt about things for themselves.

In a nutshell, our prejudices are shaped by the limited experiences that we are exposed to. Mass media provide many of those experiences.
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15-08-2014, 08:05 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 07:53 AM)cjlr Wrote:  
(15-08-2014 07:46 AM)One Above All Wrote:  Your society. Don't push that bullshit onto mine.

This may shock you to find out, but did you know that you are part of society?

And this is relevant... Why? Ever seen me discriminate? I guarantee you haven't.
I'm not here to deny that discrimination occurs in some societies. I'm here to assert that the cause is mainly cultural, rather than something as silly as video games. If video games were to blame, even partially, why is it that discrimination has existed for... well, ever, and has been decreasing, in spite of the fact that video games are increasingly pervasive in society?

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15-08-2014, 08:06 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 07:55 AM)Zippo Wrote:  Not really. Nearly half the market are women.

Quote:According to a study conducted by the Entertainment Software Association in 2012, "Forty-seven percent of all game players are women. In fact, women over the age of 18 represent a significantly greater portion of the game-playing population (30 percent) than boys age 17 or younger (18 percent)."[38][39]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_v...emographic

I've used that very same wikipedia link myself on these threads.

So why can't games be designed to appeal to women as well? Female playable characters would be appreciated for a start.
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15-08-2014, 08:09 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 08:06 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  So why can't games be designed to appeal to women as well? Female playable characters would be appreciated for a start.

Tomb Raider (since the very beginning), Mass Effect, many, many RPG's (especially MMO's)...

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15-08-2014, 08:10 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 08:06 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(15-08-2014 07:55 AM)Zippo Wrote:  Not really. Nearly half the market are women.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_v...emographic

I've used that very same wikipedia link myself on these threads.

So why can't games be designed to appeal to women as well? Female playable characters would be appreciated for a start.

I'l admit that I may not notice this entirely because I obviously don't play all games, but it seems to me like plenty of games have female playable characters. My favorite series; The Elder Scrolls lets you choose your character's gender. It seems like most games with exclusively male protagonists are games based around a defined character, where the gender of said character cannot just be switched out on a whim.

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15-08-2014, 08:12 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
I am officially bored with this thread. I may keep reading it, though I probably won't reply much.

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15-08-2014, 08:13 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 08:02 AM)One Above All Wrote:  
(15-08-2014 07:49 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  Any society.

No. At least not enough that it's as big a problem as you make it seem. Women here have the same opportunities as men

And how did your society arrive at such a state?

I would also like to know which country that is because I suspect that it's just your perception rather than fact.

Did feminists give up the moment they had the vote? No. They carried on because there is always more work to do until full social equality is reached.

You are also forgetting that social equality doesn't just need to be fought for, it also needs to be maintained. It's very easy to make a great step backwards within a single generation.
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