femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
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13-08-2014, 12:03 AM
Re: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
Even if you write or make a comic, chances are that you only sell a handful of them, including your friends and family. I think there are feminists who create their own content, but they aren't popular to be noticable except for tumblr.
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13-08-2014, 12:10 AM
Re: RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(12-08-2014 09:17 PM)kunoxian drive Wrote:  like I said I am not against criticism but it's less effective then success. let them have their try of what they think fair representation is. we will see of that is truly going to sell and would be more constructive.

Because they have a criticism they think is relevant, doesn't mean they are equipped to make a good overall game.

There's not some infinite amount of talent, money, or time for a bunch of critics to create a media product to represent they're proclaimed flaws. Our reality doesn't work well that way. It would oversaturate the market. That's why criticism has unmeasurable value in judging product on various grounds.

But to think criticism isn't effecting the minds of game creators and players I think isn't true. It's rare for any criticism to make media wide changes. Honestly just lady night by coincidence I saw a video related to this. I was on Michael Shermers YouTube page and saw a recommendation to Feminist Frequency which is that Anita womans page, and she's a person that caused a lot of backlash. Aside from her actual criticism videos, there's a video up there of her getting an award. The presenter was the writer of The Last Of Us, and he mentions he was inspired by her criticism to consciously consider how his charterers take life. That game was quite well praised. It's only one stated example, but I think it's a legitimate benefit. It's going to make impacts even though the gaming field won't alter in mass movements.

I think many that approve and disapprove of criticism want video games to be considered a real art form. At least I do and know many that do. If it's going to be legitimately art, it needs to be open to analysis the same way as literature, film, music, and visual art.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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13-08-2014, 12:20 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
1. Anita is a special case.. she kicked over 4chan with spam and that is why she is famous and that is why she is being taken so seriously.
2. yes you are right that not everything will win but at least it's more adamorable than being an arm chair quarter back....
3. all forms of media have their critiques but unless you are famous then you will not be heard. well that or are part of a majority consensus of a community.

1. Striding and swaggering rootlessness without end. The precious flow of life.
2. one should fear sweet a blood stained flower.
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13-08-2014, 01:25 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
Lets not mention Anita on here.. she is crazy and has no idea what she is talking about.

Her logic is this:

You have the ability to kill women in videos games

Therefore the video game supports people killing women.


Its the same as,

You have the ability to jump of building and kill yourself in video games.

Therefore the video game supports suicide via falling from heights.

“Take the risk of thinking for yourself, much more happiness, truth, beauty, and wisdom will come to you that way.

-Christopher Hitchens
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13-08-2014, 02:39 AM (This post was last modified: 13-08-2014 02:49 AM by Mathilda.)
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(12-08-2014 08:03 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  What they really want is to push their agenda into places where it doesn't belong. Video games now have to feature strong female (ideally transexual) characters who promote feminist ideology.

Negs

Yeah let's get back to the good old times when there were no female characters in video games. In fact, pretty much like most video games right now on thinking about it. And the number of video games where the main character is female are still rare.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_v...emographic

Quote:According to a study conducted by the Entertainment Software Association in 2012, "Forty-seven percent of all game players are women. In fact, women over the age of 18 represent a significantly greater portion of the game-playing population (30 percent) than boys age 17 or younger (18 percent)."[38][39]

You really do talk pish. Give me a good reason why there shouldn't be more female characters (including main characters) in video games.
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13-08-2014, 02:41 AM
Re: RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(13-08-2014 01:25 AM)Just Another Atheist Wrote:  Lets not mention Anita on here.. she is crazy and has no idea what she is talking about.

Her logic is this:

You have the ability to kill women in videos games

Therefore the video game supports people killing women.


Its the same as,

You have the ability to jump of building and kill yourself in video games.

Therefore the video game supports suicide via falling from heights.

That's a point, but a validly poor one. One of her videos pinpoints the case of females as objects which exists, but that point you can kill women in sandbox games for money or toss around dead bodies applies to both men and women.

But that's not the logic pattern. It's that games encourage it by rewarding the behavior. Hardly ever will you find a game that rewards suicide. It's probably in some but it's not a trend. I can think of one game that does, the cat lady, but that's more plot oriented than a side action. Other than that maybe rpgs with a suicide attack a member might be capable of doing exist, but even that isn't in many rpgs.

Misrepresenting points doesn't have much benefit. Games do judge who to enact violence against, because most sandbox games intentionally deny the player from acting violently to children. That make that programmed choice. It doesn't hamper the games in sales or fan joy.

But when she or others nitpick violence against npc women when it's equal to male npc violence in a game, they're being backwards. That's positively showing equal status amongst gender.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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13-08-2014, 02:48 AM (This post was last modified: 13-08-2014 03:07 AM by Mathilda.)
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(12-08-2014 09:09 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  The cynic in me wants to say that unless the inner circle of successful screenwriters decide to include my female/minority leads, then it is unlikely that more female/minority leads are going to be cast; even if you sister writes a great screenplay (assuming one of the producers doesn't cast a white guy anyways [see hunger games]).


Exactly. I have read that there is this idea in Hollywood that women are happy to watch films with a male lead, but men aren't so happy to watch films with a female lead. Although incorrect, it does mean that it's perceived to be a safer commercial bet to always have women in secondary roles.

Just look at Res Publica's brain dead post and how because he has grown used to an imbalance in gender representation in video games expects that to be the norm. We have made the progress that we have because people have drawn attention to such problems.

I for one won't buy a video game any more unless it has a decent female character to play. I am voting with my purse. I now buy graphic novels and comics because some decent ones that have main female characters are being created.

Unlike Res Publica, I don't sit back and expect the world to be tailored towards me and complain when it isn't.
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13-08-2014, 02:55 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(13-08-2014 12:03 AM)oniyn Wrote:  Even if you write or make a comic, chances are that you only sell a handful of them, including your friends and family. I think there are feminists who create their own content, but they aren't popular to be noticable except for tumblr.

Only because of the existing demographic. There is nothing inherently masculine in reading comics.

If all comics are aimed at young boys and you write a comic that has a main female character than most women could identify with then it's not going to sell well because most women won't ever consider buying a comic if the ones that already exist aren't aimed at them.

This is why it's useful to point out a gender imbalance. It widens the potential market. It tells women out there that there is a new product for them to consider purchasing and it's OK for people like them to own such an item.

People often base their actions based on the perception of whether people like them would do such a thing. It takes time for behaviour to change.

Unfortunately people use this to argue that there shouldn't be any change in the first place. Normally people who are quite happy with the status quo where everything is already targetted at them.
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13-08-2014, 02:57 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
It doesn't encourage it. He uses Hitman as an example. In the game, if you kill innocent civilians (in her case, it was three striipers) you get scolded for it and actually have points removed.

In Watch Dogs, she shows a clip of you being in a sex trafficking scandal by showing you the half naked ladies. What she DOESN'T tell you is that in that mission, your job is to free them all.

Assassins Creed: You get scolded for killing any innocent civilian.

In GTA, the cops come after you if you get caught.

She is so dishonest and as a video game lover myself, what she says is just wrong.


Imagine if men acted like her and said "men are objects in all games and movies be cause they are faceless villains that you kill off without any consequence". This is obviously true. In no game do you see all the enemies as women, its always men. Why is it not a problem? Because we know the difference between reality and a video game.

“Take the risk of thinking for yourself, much more happiness, truth, beauty, and wisdom will come to you that way.

-Christopher Hitchens
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13-08-2014, 03:02 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(13-08-2014 02:41 AM)ClydeLee Wrote:  
(13-08-2014 01:25 AM)Just Another Atheist Wrote:  Lets not mention Anita on here.. she is crazy and has no idea what she is talking about.

Her logic is this:

You have the ability to kill women in videos games

Therefore the video game supports people killing women.


Its the same as,

You have the ability to jump of building and kill yourself in video games.

Therefore the video game supports suicide via falling from heights.

That's a point, but a validly poor one. One of her videos pinpoints the case of females as objects which exists, but that point you can kill women in sandbox games for money or toss around dead bodies applies to both men and women.

But that's not the logic pattern. It's that games encourage it by rewarding the behavior. Hardly ever will you find a game that rewards suicide. It's probably in some but it's not a trend. I can think of one game that does, the cat lady, but that's more plot oriented than a side action. Other than that maybe rpgs with a suicide attack a member might be capable of doing exist, but even that isn't in many rpgs.

Misrepresenting points doesn't have much benefit. Games do judge who to enact violence against, because most sandbox games intentionally deny the player from acting violently to children. That make that programmed choice. It doesn't hamper the games in sales or fan joy.

But when she or others nitpick violence against npc women when it's equal to male npc violence in a game, they're being backwards. That's positively showing equal status amongst gender.

there is a game where you kill yourself. it was an adult swim game called ??? minutes to die. not sure n the title though

1. Striding and swaggering rootlessness without end. The precious flow of life.
2. one should fear sweet a blood stained flower.
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