femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
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14-08-2014, 03:11 PM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
Just watched those two videos Michael. The last one was especially useful in informing me which games to avoid buying.
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14-08-2014, 08:07 PM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(14-08-2014 03:11 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  Just watched those two videos Michael. The last one was especially useful in informing me which games to avoid buying.

And it all comes out. Feminism is a religion. Your Pope said something is unholy and you avoid it like the plague.

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14-08-2014, 09:48 PM
Re: RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(14-08-2014 08:07 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  
(14-08-2014 03:11 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  Just watched those two videos Michael. The last one was especially useful in informing me which games to avoid buying.

And it all comes out. Feminism is a religion. Your Pope said something is unholy and you avoid it like the plague.

Because Tomb Raider looks bad and just trying to copy Uncharted? Not sure that connects, but keep trying the rationalizing thing.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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15-08-2014, 01:53 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
Of course women have issues in our society, but there is no reason to blame video games. Pen and Teller showed a study (with sources) on their show "Bullshit" and it shows that kids know the difference between video games and reality. They gave this kid a gun and basically he started crying after he shot it once. In other words, he hated it. He only enjoyed it in the game and was actually nervous around the gun.

There are plenty of things to blame for female inequality, but its not video games.

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15-08-2014, 02:44 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(14-08-2014 08:07 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  
(14-08-2014 03:11 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  Just watched those two videos Michael. The last one was especially useful in informing me which games to avoid buying.

And it all comes out. Feminism is a religion. Your Pope said something is unholy and you avoid it like the plague.

Err yes, keep taking the meds.

Honestly. Please do.
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15-08-2014, 03:00 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 01:53 AM)Just Another Atheist Wrote:  There are plenty of things to blame for female inequality, but its not video games.

What you are missing is conditioning. It's not just video games but television, films, any constant portrayal in the media.

The brain is remarkably adept at recognising consistent patterns from the world that you may not consciously be aware of. This occurs by conditioning. A large feature of how the brain works is to have the connection between neurons that frequently fire together strengthen over time. It's called Hebbian learning and classical conditioning (i.e. Pavlov's dogs)

If you were constantly chased by wild dogs on your walk to work then you would begin to expect that to happen to you the moment you saw a dog. It's how we learn about the world. The brain hasn't evolved to subconsciously differentiate between reality and mass media.

So for example, if you always see criminals on TV portrayed as belonging to a particular race, then you will start to associate that race in your head with criminality.

Those videos referred to studies that revealed that how the portrayal of video games can influence player's behaviour in the real world afterwards. Just because you aren't conscious of the effect does not mean to say that it does not happen.
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15-08-2014, 03:26 AM (This post was last modified: 15-08-2014 03:41 AM by One Above All.)
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 03:00 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  What you are missing is conditioning. It's not just video games but television, films, any constant portrayal in the media.
<snip>

You know, I've been playing games since before I was 6. And I'm not talking about games like "Super Mario" or whatever it was called (though I have played and still play child-friendly games such as Pokémon, Digimon, and Harvest Moon, and enjoy[ed] them thoroughly). I mean Metal Gear Solid (1, 2, and 4) and Metal Gear Rising, Dragon Ball, Hitman, Watch Dogs (I'm playing it now, actually), Battlefield, CoD, Metro 2034 and Metro: Last Light, Far Cry (though I didn't like it, so I never even started the second mission or whatever, IIRC), S.T.A.L.K.E.R., Mortal Kombat, Deus Ex: Human Revolution, Black and White 2, Duke Nukem, and so on. Yet I'm a fairly non-violent person. Even in those games, I only engage (or outright kill) those who are a threat to me (or if it's part of the mission).
For example, in Deus Ex, in the rare instances where I was discovered, I hid first before attempting to kill everyone (which would have been far easier). I never once killed anyone unless I ran out of tranquilizers, or something else that's kinda spoiler-y, so I won't mention it. In MGS4, I made several runs without killing anyone, including bosses (aside from the final boss, whose defeat ends with his death, regardless of how you fight him). In Metal Gear Rising, once I unlocked a non-lethal weapon, I stuck to using that one weapon against every living being (aside from bosses) I had to engage. I recall reloading the game several times just to be able to save civilians who were about to be killed (there aren't that many, but I saved all of them, regardless), just because I didn't want them to die. In Black and White 2, which is where you play as a god and can choose between good and evil, I always picked good, even when it bit me in the ass because I ran out of resources. I converted people by impressing them, rather than conquering them, which, as with Deus Ex, would have been far easier. I could've simply built a huge army and swept away everything else with fire.
Now for real-life. I've never gotten into a fight with anyone, except that one guy who broke my glasses one time, several years ago. We're even friends now. I've never "poked dead things with a stick", or whatever kids do. I preferred to spend my time watching (and sometimes helping) ants carry food (or whatever) to their anthill. I've never watched a fight that I didn't try to stop. I've met and helped people who were suicidal (not talking about online, by the way; I'm talking about face-to-face meetings with suicidal people). I've never thought of men or women as sex objects (or any kind of objects) or even as being all that different, psychologically speaking, due to my personal experience in speaking to and dating both genders (though I've only dated one guy so far). I've been rejected by a girl whom I liked and went on a date with. She was, and still is, my best female friend. I've been rejected by guys whom I liked. We're still friends.

So no, video games are not to blame. I know the difference between fantasy and reality. So does every other healthy person. I can hardly have dreams that aren't lucid dreams, simply because I know when I'm dreaming. That's how good my grip on reality is. If you want to blame anything, blame stupidity and/or mental illness. Video games are not to blame.

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15-08-2014, 03:42 AM (This post was last modified: 15-08-2014 03:49 AM by Mathilda.)
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 03:26 AM)One Above All Wrote:  So no, video games are not to blame. I know the difference between fantasy and reality. So does every other healthy person. I can hardly have dreams that aren't lucid dreams, simply because I know when I'm dreaming. That's how good my grip on reality is. If you want to blame anything, blame stupidity and/or mental illness. Video games are not to blame.

I am not saying that you don't consciously know the difference between fantasy and reality. I am talking about how your behaviour and perception of the world is influenced without you realising it.

Read any book on psychology and find out about a myriad of studies where subject's behaviour and perception was altered after performing an exercise without them realising it.
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15-08-2014, 03:48 AM
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 03:42 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  Provide evidence.

How about... the part of my post you apparently didn't even bother reading, which was the basis for the conclusion that you apparently did read (or at least glanced at)?
If video games were to blame, people would stop saying "You're just like/worse than Hitler". Instead, they'd say "You're worse than the One Above All".

You have three (intellectually honest) possibilities. Refute, accept, or say you don't have enough knowledge about my situation to make an informed decision. Your call.

The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
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15-08-2014, 03:58 AM (This post was last modified: 15-08-2014 04:02 AM by Mathilda.)
RE: femism vs geek culture and why I think feminist spining wheels
(15-08-2014 03:48 AM)One Above All Wrote:  
(15-08-2014 03:42 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  Provide evidence.

How about... the part of my post you apparently didn't even bother reading, which was the basis for the conclusion that you apparently did read (or at least glanced at)?
If video games were to blame, people would stop saying "You're just like/worse than Hitler". Instead, they'd say "You're worse than the One Above All".

You have three (intellectually honest) possibilities. Refute, accept, or say you don't have enough knowledge about my situation to make an informed decision. Your call.

It's true I only glanced at your post. It just seemed like a large block of text talking about your own experience of playing video games. Your post in no way countered what I was saying about pavlovian conditioning, hebbian learning and how the conscious brain can be influenced by subconscious neural processes.

Instead you just post about your personal experience of being able to differentiate between fantasy and reality, which was never in question, and then come to the conclusion that video games are not to blame for absolutely everyone else.

Maybe you should try addressing my points rather than just provide a strawman argument?

(I also edited out the call for providing evidence because I realised I really needed to make it clear that you had missed my point but I was too late, sorry about that)
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