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17-02-2014, 09:09 AM
RE: genesis
(17-02-2014 08:59 AM)goldenmustache Wrote:  
(17-02-2014 08:49 AM)Logisch Wrote:  Evolution and the big bang have nothing to do with each other directly.

agreed but we were talking about genesis and hominids so im just throwin that answer away.

No, you specifically said the universe coming from nothing makes no sense. So the answer of evolution makes no sense. That statement in itself makes no sense because the two of them are separate studies and not directly related. So either you're discussing why evolution makes no sense to you, or you're discussing why the big bang makes no sense to you. But to toss the two of them together is like saying, "I disagree with rocket science, so fishing really makes no sense to me."

Largely, the reason this discussion has failed to make much progress is you haven't really clarified which type of creation you're proposing since none of us really know what you're proposing. Discussing genesis is like a can of worms because everyone has different interpretations... which is yours?

Someone can talk genesis all they want, but it usually comes down to someone having a specific interpretation of how they think stuff was created. Keep in mind there are:

- Young earth creationists
- Old earth creationists
- Evolutionary creationists
- Literal genesis interpretations
- Flat earth creationists and flat earth society (yes, they still exist)
- Many many more

I'm not attempting to be rude, I have no intentions of being so. However, just clarifying that it is difficult to begin discussion when people come in and don't even know what one's stance is. It's sort of like saying, "I'm just going to dismiss things I don't like and not state where I stand, we're just going to keep going in circles and go no where because I don't feel like clarifying." which is far from a productive conversation.

Official ordained minister of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Please pm me with prayer requests to his noodly goodness. Remember, he boiled for your sins and loves you. Carbo Diem! RAmen.
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17-02-2014, 09:10 AM
RE: genesis
(17-02-2014 08:37 AM)goldenmustache Wrote:  
(16-02-2014 04:16 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Adam and Eve for starters. We have genetics that prove we evolved from single celled organisms. At no point was any hominid species under 5000 members let alone 2. Human migration starts from central Africa not the middle east.

Well how bout for starters do you know what progressive creationism is? Do you know that the earth is billions of years old. And A creator that built things separate instead of everything that you assume is connected to each other like a chain. Are you arguing evolution because that doesn't make any sense either.

No I'm not arguing evolution because that argument is over. Evolution is the correct answer it has answered every challenge and been proven to the the correct working model in every situation. As to the age of the earth yes we know it is 4.54 ± 0.05 billion years that is really not in question anymore either. For fucks sake go to the library and read a science book put down the fairy tales and actually learn something. We are living in 2014 in a highly advanced society that relies on science and technology to function and you want to doubt science but only when it is convenient to you preferred lies. Do you walk to work or church because fossil fuels disprove Genesis? No you just argue for ignorance when it threatens your own stupidity. Sit the fuck down shut the fuck up and go read a book that was not written by dessert dwelling sheep fuckers.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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17-02-2014, 09:21 AM
RE: genesis
I have a question for you golden, you said the real question is how the universe came from nothing right?
Well here's my question: How did your God come from nothing?

The Big Bang Theory and Evolution are two totally separate theories by the way. Evolution explains the progression of living organisms, while the Big Bang Theory explains (or attempts to) a single occurrence of the creation of the universe. It's the difference between explaining a city's foundation and how the people grow inside the city.

Just wanted to explain that to you first, back on topic. Logically speaking, our planet, and life on it, is an extremely unlikely event. So unlikely, we can't calculate the odds. So, in order for your God to exist, he'd have to be just as unlikely if not more so. Creationism does not answer any questions, it only creates more questions.
Now, on the other hand, if you actually took the time to learn scientific theory, you'd realize it does, in fact, answer questions. It does not answer all of them, and it is not perfect, but it's the best explanation we have. Just because you don't understand it or don't know it, doesn't make it false; it just makes you ignorant.

Atir aissom atir imon
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17-02-2014, 09:36 AM
RE: genesis
So is "progressive creationism" the latest hipster in group to be in, where you still believe in God, but need a unique way of fitting him into the history of the universe/world as we know it? Your views are still entirely based on nothing but imagination, and contradict scientific theory (although you think it better meshes science and creationism). You have no proof that God created anything over any period of time. You cannot deny macroevolution while giving microevolution some validity. It is an even more wishy washy mindset then just taking the creation story in Genesis to be true as stated. Why do you folks resist listening to the vast scientific community, and cling to stories and made up ideas just to keep this God concept from fading into the barbaric past? Why? No need to as we now know in 2014 how all forms of life came about. Why man, why?

“Truth does not demand belief. Scientists do not join hands every Sunday, singing, yes, gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! I believe in my heart that what goes up, up, up, must come down, down, down. Amen! If they did, we would think they were pretty insecure about it.”
— Dan Barker —
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17-02-2014, 09:46 AM
RE: genesis
(17-02-2014 09:10 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(17-02-2014 08:37 AM)goldenmustache Wrote:  Well how bout for starters do you know what progressive creationism is? Do you know that the earth is billions of years old. And A creator that built things separate instead of everything that you assume is connected to each other like a chain. Are you arguing evolution because that doesn't make any sense either.

No I'm not arguing evolution because that argument is over. Evolution is the correct answer it has answered every challenge and been proven to the the correct working model in every situation. As to the age of the earth yes we know it is 4.54 ± 0.05 billion years that is really not in question anymore either. For fucks sake go to the library and read a science book put down the fairy tales and actually learn something. We are living in 2014 in a highly advanced society that relies on science and technology to function and you want to doubt science but only when it is convenient to you preferred lies. Do you walk to work or church because fossil fuels disprove Genesis? No you just argue for ignorance when it threatens your own stupidity. Sit the fuck down shut the fuck up and go read a book that was not written by dessert dwelling sheep fuckers.

No evolution has a lot of holes in it a lot. It doesn't explain emotions, feeling, love, desires, how the brain was developed and the eyes. and is just a really bad excuse of how humans got here because there is no other game in town.
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17-02-2014, 09:48 AM
RE: genesis
(17-02-2014 09:36 AM)Timber1025 Wrote:  So is "progressive creationism" the latest hipster in group to be in, where you still believe in God, but need a unique way of fitting him into the history of the universe/world as we know it? Your views are still entirely based on nothing but imagination, and contradict scientific theory (although you think it better meshes science and creationism). You have no proof that God created anything over any period of time. You cannot deny macroevolution while giving microevolution some validity. It is an even more wishy washy mindset then just taking the creation story in Genesis to be true as stated. Why do you folks resist listening to the vast scientific community, and cling to stories and made up ideas just to keep this God concept from fading into the barbaric past? Why? No need to as we now know in 2014 how all forms of life came about. Why man, why?

Where are you getting these silly ideas from. Now your just assuming what I believe. I do believe In progressive creationism and microevolution.
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17-02-2014, 09:50 AM
RE: genesis
(17-02-2014 09:21 AM)Im_Ryan Wrote:  I have a question for you golden, you said the real question is how the universe came from nothing right?
Well here's my question: How did your God come from nothing?

The Big Bang Theory and Evolution are two totally separate theories by the way. Evolution explains the progression of living organisms, while the Big Bang Theory explains (or attempts to) a single occurrence of the creation of the universe. It's the difference between explaining a city's foundation and how the people grow inside the city.

Just wanted to explain that to you first, back on topic. Logically speaking, our planet, and life on it, is an extremely unlikely event. So unlikely, we can't calculate the odds. So, in order for your God to exist, he'd have to be just as unlikely if not more so. Creationism does not answer any questions, it only creates more questions.
Now, on the other hand, if you actually took the time to learn scientific theory, you'd realize it does, in fact, answer questions. It does not answer all of them, and it is not perfect, but it's the best explanation we have. Just because you don't understand it or don't know it, doesn't make it false; it just makes you ignorant.

Like I said in another thread God is eternal. He is not of this universe therefore does not apply to its laws.
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17-02-2014, 09:50 AM
RE: genesis
(17-02-2014 09:46 AM)goldenmustache Wrote:  No evolution has a lot of holes in it a lot.

Citation needed.
(your own personal ignorance does not count)

(17-02-2014 09:46 AM)goldenmustache Wrote:  It doesn't explain emotions, feeling, love, desires...

Citation needed.
(your own personal ignorance does not count)

(17-02-2014 09:46 AM)goldenmustache Wrote:  ... how the brain was developed...

Citation needed.
(your own personal ignorance does not count)

(17-02-2014 09:46 AM)goldenmustache Wrote:  ... and the eyes.

Citation needed.
(your own personal ignorance does not count)

(17-02-2014 09:46 AM)goldenmustache Wrote:  [A]nd is just a really bad excuse of how humans got here because there is no other game in town.

That doesn't even make sense.

Even a bad explanation is serviceable where there are no alternatives. But in fact modern biology is a very good explanation (not that there are any alternatives save simply making shit up and ignoring evidence to the contrary).

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17-02-2014, 09:51 AM
RE: genesis
(17-02-2014 09:50 AM)goldenmustache Wrote:  Like I said in another thread God is eternal. He is not of this universe therefore does not apply to its laws.

So how do you know that?

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17-02-2014, 09:52 AM
RE: genesis
(17-02-2014 09:36 AM)Timber1025 Wrote:  Why do you folks resist listening to the vast scientific community, and cling to stories and made up ideas just to keep this God concept from fading into the barbaric past? Why? No need to as we now know in 2014 how all forms of life came about. Why man, why?

Because death is scary and some of these people are insane enough that the threat of hell seems to be the only thing keeping them from becoming serial killers.
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