important things science cant do.
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13-05-2016, 02:58 PM
RE: important things science cant do.
(13-05-2016 01:59 PM)purpledaisies Wrote:  Yep same things that was going through my mind. And it implies that without god we have no morals. I need to stop and calm down a bit before I reply to my aunt.

Hug
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13-05-2016, 03:02 PM
RE: important things science cant do.
(13-05-2016 02:58 PM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  
(13-05-2016 01:59 PM)purpledaisies Wrote:  Yep same things that was going through my mind. And it implies that without god we have no morals. I need to stop and calm down a bit before I reply to my aunt.

Hug

Thanks. I really think she meant to help but I don't think she understands the Significance Of this article.
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13-05-2016, 04:43 PM (This post was last modified: 13-05-2016 05:00 PM by true scotsman.)
RE: important things science cant do.
(13-05-2016 01:10 PM)purpledaisies Wrote:  http://bahaiteachings.org/important-thin...ce-cant-do
This was sent to me and I want to get some perspective on this before I reply. I have read it bit I want to keep my opinion so it doesn't influence anyone. Thanks

Two things. One, the quote at the beginning of the article states that emotions are central to Human life. Not reason, emotion. This is just false. Emotions are not a primary. They are our automatic response to events based on our values and premises that we hold. They are important, and without them life would not be worth living in my opinion, but they are not central. Thinking, reasoning, is central not only to our lives but in how much we enjoy them. The purpose of life is to live and, I think, to enjoy life, to achieve happiness, success, fulfillment, joy, and to do that one must think and discover the values one should pursue. When one has a clear understanding of his values through reason then his emotions will not be incomprehensible mysteries. Since science is the systematic application of reason to the study of what we observe, emotions are not outside the reach of science.

Second. I only read the first paragraph. When people use "the transcendent" in this context, it means that which defies reason, so of course it is outside the purview of science. But is Morality really outside the purview of reason? No it is not. Morality is a set of principles to guide one's actions and choices and as such it is conceptual in nature. Reason is the faculty which identifies and integrates the material brought in by the senses and it does this by forming concepts and then integrating those concepts into principles and propositions, the truth of which rests on their correspondence to reality. so Morality is very much within the purview of science and there is a whole branch of the science dedicated to this called ethics.

The whole problem is that many people do not have any kind of understanding of concepts and so they find these issues baffling and incomprehensible. They think that concepts exist in some supernatural realm apart from this one which must be handed down by an authority by some mystical means. No wonder they are so confused.

I can't read any more right now, too busy but I can guess what the rest will be like, based on the errors already demonstrated in the first couple paragraphs. given the articles' basis in a false view of concepts, I don't think there will be anything worth learning from it.

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

Don't sacrifice for me, live for yourself! - Me

The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
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14-05-2016, 06:45 PM
RE: important things science cant do.
(13-05-2016 01:43 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  All religions pull the same two tactics. They try to debunk science to create a gap they can fill their god and or religious text with. Then when they can't do that, they try to claim science props up their religion and or god. EVERY religion does this.

Which demonstrates that even the religious believe science has the greater imprimatur than their faith - which of course it does.
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14-05-2016, 07:08 PM
RE: important things science cant do.
I introduced myself as someone who enjoys listening to debate but not participating and I don't want to disrupt people's faith but I do secretly scoff at their stupidity. Or whatever you want to call it. So I'm a snob (the worst kind even because I can't really back it up) but I try to keep it to myself. Maybe I signed up here to vent and didn't realize it. Reading that was like eating a bowl of vomit. Like the first response tearing it apart was great because I realize that but I don't know how to word it like that.
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14-05-2016, 08:35 PM
RE: important things science cant do.
Important thing science can't do: Make your religion any less bullshit simply because you employ the word "science" in describing it.

eg: Christian Science, spiritual science, etc.
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14-05-2016, 08:36 PM
RE: important things science cant do.
(14-05-2016 07:08 PM)ImFred Wrote:  I introduced myself as someone who enjoys listening to debate but not participating and I don't want to disrupt people's faith but I do secretly scoff at their stupidity. Or whatever you want to call it. So I'm a snob (the worst kind even because I can't really back it up) but I try to keep it to myself. Maybe I signed up here to vent and didn't realize it. Reading that was like eating a bowl of vomit. Like the first response tearing it apart was great because I realize that but I don't know how to word it like that.

That's OK. At least you recognize the argument. I don't waste my time with theist reasoning, because of the vacuousness of their arguments. That applies to (most) theists anywhere you go, xtians and muslims being the worst. I leave it to the people who want to make sure that the lurkers see the crap debunked, instead of seeing it fly on an atheist site, and thinking that it must be true, and/or acceptable.
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15-05-2016, 02:53 AM
RE: important things science cant do.
Hope, fear, love, hate, beauty, envy, honor, weakness, striving, suffering, virtue.

Science understands all of these, but some people just don't like the explanations.

Sapere aude
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15-05-2016, 03:43 AM
RE: important things science cant do.
(15-05-2016 02:53 AM)f stop Wrote:  Hope, fear, love, hate, beauty, envy, honor, weakness, striving, suffering, virtue.

Science understands all of these, but some people just don't like the explanations.

true dat, they want "magic" as the explanation
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15-05-2016, 06:22 AM
RE: important things science cant do.
(13-05-2016 01:10 PM)purpledaisies Wrote:  http://bahaiteachings.org/important-thin...ce-cant-do
This was sent to me and I want to get some perspective on this before I reply. I have read it bit I want to keep my opinion so it doesn't influence anyone. Thanks

This guy goes completely off the rails when he starts making a distinction between "material civilization" and "spiritual civilization".

Our morals are derived from our sense of empathy in how we relate to other individuals in the material world, it is firmly rooted in the "material" world, it gives species an evolutionary advantage.

This is one of those things that is so far off the mark that it's not even wrong.

My former friend sent me an email about some guy that figured out that the wavelength of light was somehow related to a number that god liked, therefore god is proven by science.

Instead of taking this apart and explaining this to my dunder-headed former friend that wouldn't have even understood, I simply responded "LOL".

I think that was the best way to go about it. Thumbsup

Some of this stuff just doesn't merit serious consideration.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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