reasoned suicide?
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17-08-2013, 07:21 PM
RE: reasoned suicide?
(17-08-2013 06:40 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  
(17-08-2013 06:13 PM)Elesjei Wrote:  What bothers me about Martin Manley is that he never explained why he chose to die. He claimed it was not related to money, depression, or poor health, but then why kill himself? If he was able to do things he enjoyed and be around people he loved, why suddenly stop his life? I understand his desire to control his own life, but the choice was so arbitrary. He died without reason beyond controlling his time of death. Ultimately it's his choice, but choices should have rational thinking behind them, not numbers pulled from a hat.

From what I gathered, he was a pretty smart dude, loved the sciences. Seems he was rather fond of his mind and mentioned a couple of times that he had noticed it starting to decline. I think he just saw the writing on the wall and saw that, for him it was better to make an out while he was still ahead.

There are two dated sections - one dated 2 years before he exited, and I think in that one he explained that his mind started slipping and that is why he started thinking about suicide.

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18-08-2013, 08:38 AM
RE: reasoned suicide?
I tried to read it all but I guess I missed that. It seems premature, but at least he had a reason for the date then.

If something can be destroyed by the truth, it might be worth destroying.

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18-08-2013, 10:18 AM
RE: reasoned suicide?
(17-08-2013 02:42 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  I don't like the publicity of it all. I don't like the fact that he wanted to shout it to the world. I don't like the fact that people who haven't carefully thought about it will be inspired by it.

Oh, and I don't believe that he was 100% mentally healthy. His need to "advertise" his life, to be important, the great (needless) effort he put in creating all this for nothing... Just read a bit and you will clearly see a person who is craving for attention, for someone to know about his life, and at times, he even sounds OCD-ish.

I dunno. I think it's natural for a person to want to be remembered after they are gone, to leave their mark. We all crave immortality to some degree, whether its through our children, or through writing or art (as this man chose to do) or through some other form of social change.

I'd like to say more but I cant
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18-08-2013, 11:01 AM
RE: reasoned suicide?
(18-08-2013 10:18 AM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  
(17-08-2013 02:42 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  I don't like the publicity of it all. I don't like the fact that he wanted to shout it to the world. I don't like the fact that people who haven't carefully thought about it will be inspired by it.

Oh, and I don't believe that he was 100% mentally healthy. His need to "advertise" his life, to be important, the great (needless) effort he put in creating all this for nothing... Just read a bit and you will clearly see a person who is craving for attention, for someone to know about his life, and at times, he even sounds OCD-ish.

I dunno. I think it's natural for a person to want to be remembered after they are gone, to leave their mark. We all crave immortality to some degree, whether its through our children, or through writing or art (as this man chose to do) or through some other form of social change.

I'd like to say more but I cant

I showed the website to my wife, who initially came up with the same idea that he seemed to really want attention.

Well, yeah. Don't we all? I'm not advocating his method, but methinks he did a pretty good fucking job of getting it. Although, it follows that attention couldn't be his primary motivation seeing that he wouldn't be around to enjoy it.

Oh wait, he kinda sorta was a christian, so never mind.....

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

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19-08-2013, 12:25 AM
RE: reasoned suicide?
I thought it quite amusing that he couldn't reason away his sin of committing suicide! All he could do was tape a cross to his hand.
He did have mental health issues.
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19-08-2013, 07:12 AM
RE: reasoned suicide?
(19-08-2013 12:25 AM)aurora Wrote:  I thought it quite amusing that he couldn't reason away his sin of committing suicide! All he could do was tape a cross to his hand.
He did have mental health issues.

I am quite sure he built a mental construct that justified his exit to god. People with god delusions are generally quite inventive in attributing things to their gods that allow them to act as they wish. Hence all the different religions...

Beyond the god delusion, I see no more mental issues than any of us have. He worked as a writer until he exited, made a decent living, published books - so he was more functional than most people.

I don't know why people keep wanting to think that anyone committing suicide has to be mentally impaired - it's an unfair stigma, and if he hadn't done this and you'd read the story of his life, you'd never think he was any more crazy than you or I.

Suicide is not all that common among the mentally ill.

The largest portion of suicide is seniors, and most of those above 80 years old.
Then comes teens with gender issues or bullying issues.
Then comes people who lost loved ones to divorce or death.

Very rarely does suicide have anything to do with insanity or mental issues.

Choosing to exit when you face prolonged suffering or dementia is a very rational thing to do, and since this is the most common motivator for suicide, suicide in general is not an irrational thing.

The really sad thing is when young people do it because they don't seem to fit into society, or adults do it because they have an emotional setback.

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19-08-2013, 08:21 AM
RE: reasoned suicide?
(19-08-2013 07:12 AM)Dom Wrote:  - it's an unfair stigma

"Mental health issues" is an unfair stigma...

In relation to the wording of the title, I am not I, but a tapestry of we. I'm pretty compassionate for a psychopath, which is why I'm still here. Tongue

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19-08-2013, 09:22 AM
RE: reasoned suicide?
It is interesting that humanity in general would assume that a person wanting to commit suicide would either have mental problems or that if they are facing prolonged phyical suffering they should still be pretty much forced to live out their lives as long as possible.

But if we were talking about a pet or animal that was suffering, or of an extreme old age, somehow putting them to "sleep" is considered the humane thing to do.

Why the difference?

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19-08-2013, 09:34 AM
RE: reasoned suicide?
(19-08-2013 09:22 AM)unsapien Wrote:  It is interesting that humanity in general would assume that a person wanting to commit suicide would either have mental problems or that if they are facing prolonged phyical suffering they should still be pretty much forced to live out their lives as long as possible.

But if we were talking about a pet or animal that was suffering, or of an extreme old age, somehow putting them to "sleep" is considered the humane thing to do.

Why the difference?

Because we special... duh. Big Grin

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19-08-2013, 09:41 AM
RE: reasoned suicide?
(19-08-2013 09:22 AM)unsapien Wrote:  It is interesting that humanity in general would assume that a person wanting to commit suicide would either have mental problems or that if they are facing prolonged phyical suffering they should still be pretty much forced to live out their lives as long as possible.

But if we were talking about a pet or animal that was suffering, or of an extreme old age, somehow putting them to "sleep" is considered the humane thing to do.

Why the difference?

There are some arguments that I've heard.
  • There is the 'slippery slope' argument - where does it end? What are the limits?
  • The religious argument that we can't play God, but we can make the choice for animals since God gave us dominion over the animals.
  • Or, we can't interfere with God's plan - the suffering is part of that plan.

Of course, I don't agree with any of those, but I believe that our societal views are at least indirectly affected by those.

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