[split] Assalamo alaikum
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07-08-2015, 07:18 AM
RE: [split] Assalamo alaikum
(07-08-2015 07:14 AM)π¶∆ Wrote:  
(07-08-2015 07:10 AM)Nurse Wrote:  Being an accessory to murder would give you no guilt...great...

He mentioned himself before i brought it up that he is a non muslim living in a muslim majority country. Hell you can go to see his profile and it mentions Malaysia. What a ridiculous argument.

No...there was more to it than that. You posed the statement that you ASSUMED he was a former Muslim, prompting him to deny that. It was post #71.
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07-08-2015, 07:21 AM
RE: [split] Assalamo alaikum
(07-08-2015 07:14 AM)π¶∆ Wrote:  
(07-08-2015 07:10 AM)Nurse Wrote:  Being an accessory to murder would give you no guilt...great...

He mentioned himself before i brought it up that he is a non muslim living in a muslim majority country. Hell you can go to see his profile and it mentions Malaysia. What a ridiculous argument.

No, what is ridiculous is that the support of putting to death another person for lack of a belief in an imaginary sky tyrant would be acceptable under any circumstance at all.

THIS is why I hate religion.

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07-08-2015, 07:22 AM
RE: [split] Assalamo alaikum
(07-08-2015 07:12 AM)π¶∆ Wrote:  
(07-08-2015 07:07 AM)The Polyglot Atheist Wrote:  The other meanings you shared have nothing to do with your point, so you sharing them was pointless.

And no, it doesn't agree, it doesn't matter how hard you try. This is what you shared:


1 – General meaning of "interpretation". Not related to the job.
1.1 – Not related to the job
1.2 – This one is speaking about an actor's interpretation of a role, or a singer's interpretation of a piece, again not related to the job.

It doesn't support what you said. Interpreters translate as much as translators do. The difference is the tool/method. That's it.

You're applying the general meanings of those words to a profession that is quite specific, and it shows that you're an outsider of that field. If you were a translator, you wouldn't be arguing that point.

I mentioned all three meanings as i did not feel it ethical to mention only the one meaning that was relevant to what i said. In fairness, if i was so hellbent on proving my point, i should have posted just one meaning, but i believe in transparency.

meaning 1.0 does refer to what i said. Remember, it was not me who brought up the meaning of interpretation. Dom misunderstood interpretation and interpreter. I am only talking about what interpretation means. Interpreter means what Dom has mentioned. Both are different words with different meanings.

No, you're saying that now. But earlier you were talking about interpreters and translators, specifically saying that interpreters/translators can do both oral and written. That is inexact, and that's what Dom and I were saying all along.

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07-08-2015, 07:23 AM
RE: [split] Assalamo alaikum
(07-08-2015 07:16 AM)BryanS Wrote:  Such an odd thing about Islam, that adherents find they have to lie about their faith to convince people of its virtues. And then when one joins, the threat of violence and death is there to keep them in. These characteristics of Islam appear rather like those of a cult to me.


It is interesting to contrast with Christianity. Often people are pinned into Christianity due to fear of hellfire. How much more fear and how much more would you try to hold on to the threads of a tattered faith if you knew friends and family would be happy to see you dead and may help make it happen?

Give me your argument in the form of a published paper, and then we can start to talk.
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07-08-2015, 08:04 AM
RE: [split] Assalamo alaikum
Come on guy, it'd be helpful if you could straight up answer the question of whether or not punishing apostasy (by death or otherwise) is OK in your opinion.

If it is OK, how can you justify it?
If it's not OK, what's with all the other Muslims whom you speak for? Are they misguided?

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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07-08-2015, 08:06 AM
RE: [split] Assalamo alaikum
(07-08-2015 07:16 AM)BryanS Wrote:  Such an odd thing about Islam, that adherents find they have to lie about their faith to convince people of its virtues.

To be fair, that's not unique. Lying for Jesus, and all that.

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07-08-2015, 08:07 AM
RE: [split] Assalamo alaikum
(07-08-2015 08:06 AM)cjlr Wrote:  
(07-08-2015 07:16 AM)BryanS Wrote:  Such an odd thing about Islam, that adherents find they have to lie about their faith to convince people of its virtues.

To be fair, that's not unique. Lying for Jesus, and all that.

Laugh out load Save their souls and apologise later.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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07-08-2015, 08:13 AM
RE: [split] Assalamo alaikum
(07-08-2015 08:04 AM)morondog Wrote:  If it is OK, how can you justify it?
If it's not OK, what's with all the other Muslims whom you speak for? Are they misguided?

He's given about as much answer he ever will:
(06-08-2015 03:52 PM)π¶∆ Wrote:  I am unsure on the issue so I don't know what to tell you.

So, he's unsure.

Maybe it's good to kill people for disagreeing with you, maybe it's not. He claims to speak for all muslims, yet acknowledges that most muslims think it is okay. But personally he's not sure, you see. Not sure whether killing people for disagreeing with him is a good thing. And let's give him credit for being reticent. I can see where the difficulty lies. It's just so complex an issue: should people who disagree with him be summarily killed? Gosh, what a stumper.

And of course:
(06-08-2015 03:52 PM)π¶∆ Wrote:  As for killing non Muslims who are not apostates, a big no. No believer supports bloodshed, and Allah hates it too.

It is utterly trivial to present examples of muslims who embrace killing in the name of their religion.

But we all know that no true Scotsman would do a thing like that, don't we?

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07-08-2015, 08:33 AM
RE: [split] Assalamo alaikum
(07-08-2015 08:13 AM)cjlr Wrote:  And let's give him credit for being reticent. I can see where the difficulty lies. It's just so complex an issue: should people who disagree with him be summarily killed? Gosh, what a stumper.

Heh. And he was going on earlier about "so much for free speech" after he got chirped Smile I begin to like this guy more and more.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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07-08-2015, 09:23 AM
RE: [split] Assalamo alaikum
(07-08-2015 08:04 AM)morondog Wrote:  Come on guy, it'd be helpful if you could straight up answer the question of whether or not punishing apostasy (by death or otherwise) is OK in your opinion.

If it is OK, how can you justify it?
If it's not OK, what's with all the other Muslims whom you speak for? Are they misguided?

As i mentioned, its a debated matter.
Are those who do it misguided? Absolutely not. There are sayings attributed to Prophet that do mention it.

I just read your username and realized this whole post addressing you will be waste but still i'll finish it regardless.

Let me explain it in simpler terms. In terms of Islamic Law, there are two sources.
1. Quran - Word of Allah ( it is certainly the word of God and no muslim questions it)
2. Hadith - Sayings ATTRIBUTED to the Prophet. (he may or may not have said them, there is a whole field of study behind verifying hadith and their compilation)

Quran has infinitely more authority than the hadith. And if a hadith is found to contradict Quran, it is disregarded immediately as being untrue or fabricated.

Quran says "there is no compulsion in religion", and yet you find hadith proposing killing of apostates when you find no such thing in quran. For certain reasons, those hadith have not been disregarded. And hence the debate.

So those who do not support killing of apostates are justified in doing so.
Those who do support their killing are also justified in doing so. They are not misguided. I hope I answered your query.

(07-08-2015 07:22 AM)The Polyglot Atheist Wrote:  
(07-08-2015 07:12 AM)π¶∆ Wrote:  I mentioned all three meanings as i did not feel it ethical to mention only the one meaning that was relevant to what i said. In fairness, if i was so hellbent on proving my point, i should have posted just one meaning, but i believe in transparency.

meaning 1.0 does refer to what i said. Remember, it was not me who brought up the meaning of interpretation. Dom misunderstood interpretation and interpreter. I am only talking about what interpretation means. Interpreter means what Dom has mentioned. Both are different words with different meanings.

No, you're saying that now. But earlier you were talking about interpreters and translators, specifically saying that interpreters/translators can do both oral and written. That is inexact, and that's what Dom and I were saying all along.

Read the link you posted.... I am talking about translation and interpretation NOT translators and INTERPRETERS...
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