[split] Chippy vs the World
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06-11-2013, 10:02 PM (This post was last modified: 07-11-2013 02:51 AM by Chippy.)
RE: [split] Chippy vs the World
(06-11-2013 09:11 PM)Stevil Wrote:  My take on the "debate" is that orthomolecular medicine has been around for decades and is not mainstream medicine.

There is no "debate". There is as much debate about "orthomolecular psychiatry" amongst psychiatrists as there is about evolution amongst biologists.

Quote:That claims of the benefits of mega-vitamin therapy are unverified with regards to a high scientific standard.

No, the claims of "orthomolecular psychiatrists" were invalidated in the 1970s and 1980s.

Quote:However it also seems that claims as to any level of vitamin supplementation are also unverified with regards to a high scientific standard. So although there is a recognised RDA/RDI for the various nutrients, it is unknown how these recommendations came about.

You don't know what you are talking about. Just because you have no clue it doesn't mean that no one knows where the RDA/RDI data came from.

Quote:These RDA/RDI assume a healthy person, with no pre-existing nutrient deficiencies. They do not account for the ability for a human body to absorb the nutrients ingested.

You don't know what you are talking about.

Quote:As has been discussed it is hard for tablets to deliver their payload thus much passes through the system without being absorbed.

You have evidence for this claim?

Quote:It just seems to me that not enough quality research has been carried out in this regard to draw much conclusions.

You haven't read any of the studies so you are in no position to form that conclusion. Also you are second-guessing the RANZCP, RCP and the ACA.

Quote:It seems that there are claims that extreme dosing on vitamins can be dangerous, but those claims don't go into detail on what levels of viamin dosing are dangerous as opposed to what levels are not dangerous.

Read the studies that were were systematically reviewed and meta-analysed if you want the details. Don't just assume that no such data exists.

Quote:Basically, where are the boudaries and how linear are the correlations of negative effects/mortality as dosage increases? Is this related to one off doses or to prolonged doses?

This just shows that you are ignorant.

Quote:Most of the studies that The Clap cites indicate that results are inconclusive, that more quality studies are necessary.

No they don't, you just don't understand what you are reading.

Quote:It seems to me that it is entirely possible that the pharmaceutical companies have powerful people in their back pockets, much as the Firearms manufacturers and distributors in USA have their tenticals into high places. I am not saying this is definitely the case, but it is certainly worth some skepticism.

That is a conspiracy theory and it is based on your ignorance. Most nutritional supplements are manufactured by pharmaceutical companies.

Quote:I feel you are being sucked into The Clap's emotional and conspiracy driven world.

You just provided a conspiracy theory:

It seems to me that it is entirely possible that the pharmaceutical companies have powerful people in their back pockets, much as the Firearms manufacturers and distributors in USA have their tenticals into high places.


Quote:This is why I see his posts as dangerous as he is able to fool people.

How does that fit it into your broader narrative?

Quote:If he really thinks Mark is doing something illegal then he could bring it to attention of the Australian police rather than make slanderous comments over the internet.

Quackery isn't illegal.

Quote:The fact of the matter is that neither The Clap, nor yourself know enough about the medical practices of Mark Fulton, in order to make such claims.

Fulton described his non-evidence based practices, that is sufficient. He also admitted that his advice isn't mainstream.

Quote:The Clap is assuming an extreme worst case, he is assuming Mark is sending patients home with bags and bags of vitamins and giving no mainstream advise or prescriptions.

No I am not. My concern is the complete absence of evidence for the claims Fulton has made.

Quote:My own doctor was interested in some infected cuts that I had and was interested in trying out something new, special honey bandages with high SMF (Special Manuka Factor). I would have been keen to try it if he had some in stock, do you think I ought to have reported him to the police as a Quack?!

Again, quackery is neither illegal nor criminal. Homeopathy is quackery and it isn't illegal in any Anglophone country.

Quote:It's funny that you are telling me to let it go. I haven't really done anything other than wonder what the legal implication are of making public allegations.
Don't you think The Clap ought to let it go (with regards to his personal attacks on Mark)?

You are talking shit.

Quote:If he is serious about his passion with regards to Mark being a "quack", then why doesn't he take it to the Australian police rather than be an internet warrior hiding behind his keyboard.

Because quackery isn't a criminal offence in Australia.

Quote:I think Mark would win in a slander case against The Clap as The Clap has no knowledge of Mark's practice therefore his accusations are unfounded and slanderous.

Printed defamation is termed libel and the defence for libel in Australia is truth. Fulton's advice isn't coming from a base of evidence and it is contrary to a position statement published by RANZCP. I have the Royal Australian and New Zealand College of Psychiatrists on my side, I have all of the RCTs from the 1970s and 1980s, I have the systematic reviews from Cochrane that associate dosing above the RDA with increased mortality and I have the absence of positive evidence for supraphysiological doses of any nutrient in the treatment of MDD or GAD. What does Fulton have? Some anecdotes and blog articles from naturopaths.

Quote:It would certainly be an interesting court case, The Clap would risk jail time

Defamation is a civil offense and you don't get "jail time" for civil offenses.

Quote:and monetary damages and Mark would risk being found out as providing illegal or unethical medical services.

Quackery is not illegal or criminal in Australia.

You don't know what you are talking about. Learn to spell, read some books and shut the fuck up.
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06-11-2013, 10:14 PM (This post was last modified: 06-11-2013 11:14 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: [split] Chippy vs the World
(06-11-2013 08:26 PM)Chippy Wrote:  --Take supraphysiological doses of vitamins and minerals for MDD because I say so and I am a doctor.

Count vouch for the effectiveness of mega-dosing vitaminavegemins for depression except for high dose fish oil. Can vouch for the effectiveness of upper quartile or even supraphysiological serum testosterone levels for depression because I say so and I am a GirlyMan. I ain't got no double-blind placebo-controlled studies to support testosterone for depression. But you know what? I could not give less of a fuck because my decades-long depression is gone. And it promotes muscle which sucks the sugar out of my blood and treats my prediabetes. Multi-purpose supplement right there. You think I'm gonna stop supplementing testosterone 'cause I ain't got no placebo-controlled double-blind studies? Yeah, that'd be just fucking stupid. Tongue

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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06-11-2013, 10:26 PM (This post was last modified: 06-11-2013 10:30 PM by DLJ.)
RE: [split] Chippy vs the World
FYI, I have in my possession, a vitamin-based skin cream that is 100% guaranteed to reverse the signs of aging.

Only $199.99 for 5ml.

PM me if interested.

(postage and packaging not included. This is a no money-back guarantee)

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06-11-2013, 10:28 PM
RE: [split] Chippy vs the World
FYI, I have in my possession, a vitamin-based skin cream that is 100% guaranteed to reverse the signs of aging.

Only $199.99 for 5ml.

PM me if interested.

(postage and packaging not included. This is a no money-back guarantee)

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06-11-2013, 10:33 PM
RE: [split] Chippy vs the World
(06-11-2013 10:26 PM)DLJ Wrote:  FYI, I have in my possession, a vitamin-based skin cream that is 100% guaranteed to reverse the signs of aging.

Only $199.99 for 5ml.

PM me if interested.

(postage and packaging not included. This is a no money-back guarantee)

Yes but are you a doctor? If you are a doctor I can be sure you are correct.
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06-11-2013, 10:38 PM
RE: [split] Chippy vs the World
(06-11-2013 10:26 PM)DLJ Wrote:  FYI, I have in my possession, a vitamin-based skin cream that is 100% guaranteed to reverse the signs of aging.

Only $199.99 for 5ml.

PM me if interested.

(postage and packaging not included. This is a no money-back guarantee)

Does it contain testosterone?

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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06-11-2013, 10:46 PM
RE: [split] Chippy vs the World
(06-11-2013 10:38 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Does it contain testosterone?

It's his jizz.
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06-11-2013, 10:52 PM
RE: [split] Chippy vs the World
(06-11-2013 10:46 PM)Chippy Wrote:  
(06-11-2013 10:38 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Does it contain testosterone?

It's his jizz.

Fuck. ... I hate it when the joke goes over my head. ... God damn you. God damn you all to hell.



As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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06-11-2013, 11:10 PM
RE: [split] Chippy vs the World
(06-11-2013 10:52 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(06-11-2013 10:46 PM)Chippy Wrote:  It's his jizz.

Fuck. ... I hate it when the joke goes over my head. ... God damn you. God damn you all to hell.



If you think that was bad, the answer to your question was "yes".

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06-11-2013, 11:15 PM
RE: [split] Chippy vs the World
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1481227041

Real book. Many joke reviews.
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