[split] Conflicted
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16-03-2014, 04:28 PM
RE: [split] Conflicted
(16-03-2014 04:21 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(16-03-2014 04:05 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  My best friend is a lesbian. We've been friends for many years and she only revealed it to me 3-4 years ago.

She told me how hard it was to keep it a secret, pretending that she liked guys, having to answer to questions like "why don't you start dating?" or to things like "I know a guy who would be perfect for you".

When you are different than what your family and friends think or expect you to be, it can be quite stressful keeping it a secret.
I understand what you are saying.
It's the coming out bit that I am a bit vague on.

Does it mean standing atop a hill and proclaiming "I am gay"
Or does it mean being yourself and living your life based on who you are as opposed to pretending to be someone that you are not and living your life to hide who you are?

Personally when I first started dating I didn't make any proclaimations. i didn't tell my parents, and she didn't tell hers. At first they thought we were just friends. I don't have the type of relationship with my parents where I discuss or proclaim personal matters with them. Even as a heterosexual, I had difficulties letting my parents know that I had sexual interests.
Granted letting them know you are gay would probably be more difficult (depending on what your parents position on gays is).

But my position still stands. Why the need to make an announcement to anybody?

You can debate all you want here. Not in the thread in the support section.


Wind's in the east, a mist coming in
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Can't put my finger on what lies in store
but I feel what's to happen has happened before...


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16-03-2014, 04:29 PM
RE: [split] Conflicted
(16-03-2014 04:20 PM)Chas Wrote:  Stevil, that forum has its own rules:

Rules of the section Wrote:This section is a little different to the rest of the forum. Being provocative or insensitive in this section is prohibited. If people are talking about their personal issues and looking for support then they deserve that bit more protection than our other sections provide.

Anyone posting inappropriately will be warned by the Forum Team, should they fail to improve their conduct they will have their ability to post in this section removed at the discretion of the forum administration.

If you feel someone is posting inappropriately please either report their post using the 'report' button at the bottom right hand corner of each post, or PM a member of the Forum Team with your concerns.
I didn't say anything provocative or insensitive.

the OP was about "coming out"
I merely questioned why the need to tell people what his sexuality was?
I didn't tell him he should hide it, I didn't tell him he should come out.
I didn't tell him there was anything wrong with being gay, I didn't tell him that heteros were better or worse than gays.

Please point to the bit that was provocative or looking for a debate.
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16-03-2014, 04:31 PM
RE: [split] Conflicted
(16-03-2014 04:19 PM)NoSkyDaddy Wrote:  
(16-03-2014 03:56 PM)Stevil Wrote:  I haven't addressed any acceptance issues.
My post is as to questioning why there would be a need to publicise one's sexuality.
One could ask a similar question of an atheist. Gay persons have similar reservations about being "out" and for similar reasons. They also have similar desires to live honestly and openly without pretense. Good enough?
My response would be the same for an atheist.
Why the need to tell people you are an atheist?
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16-03-2014, 04:36 PM
RE: [split] Conflicted
(16-03-2014 04:21 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(16-03-2014 04:05 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  My best friend is a lesbian. We've been friends for many years and she only revealed it to me 3-4 years ago.

She told me how hard it was to keep it a secret, pretending that she liked guys, having to answer to questions like "why don't you start dating?" or to things like "I know a guy who would be perfect for you".

When you are different than what your family and friends think or expect you to be, it can be quite stressful keeping it a secret.
I understand what you are saying.
It's the coming out bit that I am a bit vague on.

Does it mean standing atop a hill and proclaiming "I am gay"
Or does it mean being yourself and living your life based on who you are as opposed to pretending to be someone that you are not and living your life to hide who you are?

Personally when I first started dating I didn't make any proclaimations. i didn't tell my parents, and she didn't tell hers. At first they thought we were just friends. I don't have the type of relationship with my parents where I discuss or proclaim personal matters with them. Even as a heterosexual, I had difficulties letting my parents know that I had sexual interests.
Granted letting them know you are gay would probably be more difficult (depending on what your parents position on gays is).

But my position still stands. Why the need to make an announcement to anybody?

Because when you fear you might be discriminated against if you freely act as a homosexual, you need support. So, at some point, you feel the need to let the people close to you know who you are to ask for their support and/or advice.

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16-03-2014, 04:36 PM
RE: [split] Conflicted
(16-03-2014 04:31 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(16-03-2014 04:19 PM)NoSkyDaddy Wrote:  One could ask a similar question of an atheist. Gay persons have similar reservations about being "out" and for similar reasons. They also have similar desires to live honestly and openly without pretense. Good enough?
My response would be the same for an atheist.
Why the need to tell people you are an atheist?

"Coming out" may have different meanings, or at least connotations, for different people.

At its root, it means not pretending, not hiding. It's not really about 'announcing'.



Your post stepped over the line of that forum by challenging the OP. If it's any consolation, it was (in my opinion) just a little over the line.

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16-03-2014, 04:40 PM
RE: [split] Conflicted
(16-03-2014 04:36 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  Because when you fear you might be discriminated against if you freely act as a homosexual, you need support. So, at some point, you feel the need to let the people close to you know who you are to ask for their support and/or advice.
That would have been a much better response to my question than the BS accusations, and "go away" response and splitting debacle approach that Momswithboys took.

Why the drama Moms?
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16-03-2014, 04:43 PM
RE: [split] Conflicted
(16-03-2014 04:36 PM)Chas Wrote:  "Coming out" may have different meanings, or at least connotations, for different people.

At its root, it means not pretending, not hiding. It's not really about 'announcing'.
This also would have been a great response to my question.

(16-03-2014 04:36 PM)Chas Wrote:  Your post stepped over the line of that forum by challenging the OP.
I didn't challenge the OP.
The OP question was "come out" or "not"
my response was
"Why the need to come out?"
It's not a challenge, its a question asking for further clarity (on my part)

(16-03-2014 04:36 PM)Chas Wrote:  If it's any consolation, it was (in my opinion) just a little over the line.
Thanks.
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16-03-2014, 04:47 PM
RE: [split] Conflicted
(16-03-2014 04:31 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(16-03-2014 04:19 PM)NoSkyDaddy Wrote:  One could ask a similar question of an atheist. Gay persons have similar reservations about being "out" and for similar reasons. They also have similar desires to live honestly and openly without pretense. Good enough?
My response would be the same for an atheist.
Why the need to tell people you are an atheist?

Because we live in a culture that praises "freedom" but has lots of cliques that pressure others to conform. Because we live in a culture with plenty of bigots who feel comfortable slandering minorities (racial, sexual or otherwise) particularly if they think those minorities are absent from preset company. Maybe they have friends or family that have negative misconceptions, not knowing that those misconceptions apply to people close to them. Perhaps they want friends/family/co-workers to know, "When you're being a bigot you're talking about ME!".

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16-03-2014, 04:47 PM
RE: [split] Conflicted
(16-03-2014 04:40 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(16-03-2014 04:36 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  Because when you fear you might be discriminated against if you freely act as a homosexual, you need support. So, at some point, you feel the need to let the people close to you know who you are to ask for their support and/or advice.
That would have been a much better response to my question than the BS accusations, and "go away" response and splitting debacle approach that Momswithboys took.

Why the drama Moms?

Because all that was pretty damn clear in the op by earmuffs.

You are the one who wanted to make it about 'i don't need to come out about being straight why should you'. In other areas of the forum it's ok. Just not there. If you can't be supportive then it's best not to comment in that forum.

It's not like I'm the only one who noticed it.


Wind's in the east, a mist coming in
Like something is brewing and about to begin
Can't put my finger on what lies in store
but I feel what's to happen has happened before...


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16-03-2014, 04:54 PM
RE: [split] Conflicted
(16-03-2014 04:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Because all that was pretty damn clear in the op by earmuffs.

You are the one who wanted to make it about 'i don't need to come out about being straight why should you'. In other areas of the forum it's ok. Just not there. If you can't be supportive then it's best not to comment in that forum.

It's not like I'm the only one who noticed it.
That's bullshit!

It was not my intent to debate, or to tell Earmuffs that he is wrong.

I can only relate to my own experiences. I did not have any need to come out. And that leads me to ask the question why should any gays have the need to come out.

The need to come out is very pertinent to the original OP and my personal understanding of the issue.

I found it an interesting topic and wanted to understand it better, given where I come from as a starting place.

In my way I think it is supportive to say "I didn't need to proclaim my sexuality so why should you?"

I don't feel that there is any social requirement for gays to come out.
It's up to each individual regarding what they want to do.

when he said "I guess I'm conflicted though because I think by not coming out I guess I'm letting them win."
Well, I don't think anyone has to come out about anything. No-one has to proclaim or justify themselves or their sexuality to anyone else.
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