[split] Favourite picture for a laugh at genocide
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
17-08-2014, 08:15 AM
RE: Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...
I swear I've posted about this before....

OH YEAH. HERE WE GO

(23-05-2014 12:02 AM)Colourcraze Wrote:  Can we just stop and talk about what genocide means for a minute?

Article II of the Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide (CPPCG) gives a legal definition of what it means to commit genocide.

genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
• (a) Killing members of the group;
• (b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
• © Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
• (d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
• (e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.



CPPCG

Atheism is the only way to truly be free from sin.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Colourcraze's post
17-08-2014, 08:24 AM
RE: Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...
(17-08-2014 08:15 AM)Colourcraze Wrote:  I swear I've posted about this before....

OH YEAH. HERE WE GO

(23-05-2014 12:02 AM)Colourcraze Wrote:  Can we just stop and talk about what genocide means for a minute?

Article II of the Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide (CPPCG) gives a legal definition of what it means to commit genocide.

genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
• (a) Killing members of the group;
• (b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
• © Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
• (d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
• (e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.



CPPCG

But don't interpret that to mean any killing, only the killing with the intent to destroy that group.
The phrase 'whole or in part' is meant to cover the systematic destruction of, say, members of X in a particular country or region.

If interpreted too broadly, then committing those acts against even one person is 'genocide'. Not a very useful interpretation.

The Turks attempted to wipe out Armenians in Turkey constitutes genocide.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Chas's post
17-08-2014, 08:28 AM
RE: Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...
Yes. So wiping out 2,000,000 Muslims at Mecca would be genocide. Done and done.

Atheism is the only way to truly be free from sin.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Colourcraze's post
17-08-2014, 08:33 AM
RE: Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...
I think you're playing a bit of a tight semantics game there old man. What word would you substitute, that captures the essence of what the picture says, better than genocide?

Mass murder? I guess... Genocide carries the connotation of attempting to wipe out culture as well though, which I think fits pretty well what the picture conveys.

...

So Turks attempting to wipe out Armenians in Armenia is *not* genocide Huh

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
17-08-2014, 08:52 AM
RE: Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...
(17-08-2014 08:33 AM)morondog Wrote:  I think you're playing a bit of a tight semantics game there old man. What word would you substitute, that captures the essence of what the picture says, better than genocide?

Mass murder? I guess... Genocide carries the connotation of attempting to wipe out culture as well though, which I think fits pretty well what the picture conveys.
Yes, mass murder. Also, you are inferring intent from the original post. It might be a political motivation - but you didn't ask.

And the semantics are critical when one is using a legal definition. Note that the definition is intent-based.

Quote:...

So Turks attempting to wipe out Armenians in Armenia is *not* genocide Huh

I said Turkish, not Ottoman. It was the Ottoman Empire that I believe you are referring to

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
17-08-2014, 09:08 AM
RE: Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...
(17-08-2014 08:52 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(17-08-2014 08:33 AM)morondog Wrote:  I think you're playing a bit of a tight semantics game there old man. What word would you substitute, that captures the essence of what the picture says, better than genocide?

Mass murder? I guess... Genocide carries the connotation of attempting to wipe out culture as well though, which I think fits pretty well what the picture conveys.
Yes, mass murder. Also, you are inferring intent from the original post. It might be a political motivation - but you didn't ask.

And the semantics are critical when one is using a legal definition. Note that the definition is intent-based.
I think the picture conveys the idea that the author of the same (not RP - IIRC I've seen it before) considers Muslims as being... lesser - of course, not explicitly stated. But thus I think the term genocide can be applied.

Quote:
Quote:...

So Turks attempting to wipe out Armenians in Armenia is *not* genocide Huh

I said Turkish, not Ottoman. It was the Ottoman Empire that I believe you are referring to
Let's say *hypothetically* that the Turks decided to finish the Ottoman empire's business and try to knock the Armenians for six in late August 2014. Can we not term that "genocide" even though it occurred in Armenia and not Turkey?

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
17-08-2014, 09:20 AM
RE: Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...
Thread title:

Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...

Can we get back to funnies, please?

Or to put it another way... Take it outside, please, ladies and gentlemen.

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
17-08-2014, 09:24 AM
RE: Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...
(17-08-2014 09:20 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Thread title:

Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...

Can we get back to funnies, please?

Or to put it another way... Take it outside, please, ladies and gentlemen.

I would be delighted if a mod (you?) could split all the random genocide stuff off?

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like morondog's post
17-08-2014, 09:25 AM
RE: Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...
(17-08-2014 09:08 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(17-08-2014 08:52 AM)Chas Wrote:  Yes, mass murder. Also, you are inferring intent from the original post. It might be a political motivation - but you didn't ask.

And the semantics are critical when one is using a legal definition. Note that the definition is intent-based.
I think the picture conveys the idea that the author of the same (not RP - IIRC I've seen it before) considers Muslims as being... lesser - of course, not explicitly stated. But thus I think the term genocide can be applied.

Given his other posts, it's probably a safe assumption. But it is an assumption.

Quote:
Quote:I said Turkish, not Ottoman. It was the Ottoman Empire that I believe you are referring to
Let's say *hypothetically* that the Turks decided to finish the Ottoman empire's business and try to knock the Armenians for six in late August 2014. Can we not term that "genocide" even though it occurred in Armenia and not Turkey?

I think you misunderstood my point. Trying to wipe out all Armenians is clearly genocide, as is trying to rid Turkey of Armenians.

My example was to clarify the phrase "in whole or in part" in the legal definition.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Chas's post
17-08-2014, 09:26 AM
RE: Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...
(17-08-2014 09:24 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(17-08-2014 09:20 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Thread title:

Favourite pictures for a laugh at religion...

Can we get back to funnies, please?

Or to put it another way... Take it outside, please, ladies and gentlemen.

I would be delighted if a mod (you?) could split all the random genocide stuff off?

I second that. Thumbsup

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Chas's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: