[split] First time drug experience
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26-02-2014, 08:07 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(26-02-2014 06:53 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  I think it's incredibly stupid to "try" heroin, crack, meth or any other highly addictive illegal substances.

If they were legal there would be no legal risk and you would know what you were using.

Quote:Every person I've ever met that did drugs on a regular basis turned into a gigantic loser. Arrest records are not sexy.

That is because of the criminalisation of drug use and posession, "arrest records" are not an intrinsic property of drugs.

Some of the most successful people in the entertainment industry in the USA and the UK do " drugs on a regular basis".

I know someone that works in finance in London, he makes a killing, owns a flat in London, is responsible for literally hundreds of millions in foreign exchange (and consistently meets his KPIs) and fucks a different woman roughly every 3 weeks. He also injects mephedrone several times a week. He has pretty much tried it all and decided on mephedrone--it is his drug of choice. I've known this person for about 25 years (we went to the same university). Most people would say that he is "winning".

I can give you other examples from my social circle and my siblings' social circle of successful professionals that regularly use drugs.

Quote:There really isn't an argument that excessive use of drugs is good for you or provides benefits.

"Excessive use of drugs" doesn't really mean anything. Drugs obviously provide benefits else nobody would use them. Drugs aren't advertised, they sell themselves because they have actual benefits.

Quote: In fact, there seems only to be negative effects to that individual and those around them.

That isn't a fact and preceding it with "In fact" doesn't change that.

Quote:The amount of bodies I recover from overdoses is evidence enough for ME

Overdoses are in a large part due to the criminilisation of drugs and the consequent inability to determine the actual dose of drug. If drugs such as heroin were decriminalised you would be able to determine your dose by reading the label rather than trusting the word of a dealer.

Quote:Why is my personal opinion regarding drug use and the people I surround myself with such a problem for you? I don't hang out with people who habitually use drugs

It is a problem because you are making unfounded generalisations about people that do use drugs.

Quote:(that were not prescribed by a doctor).

And what specifically is the significance of prescription by a doctor. Opioids and opiates don't alter their properties when they are prescribed by a doctor. Many people are addicted to opioid analgesics and benzodiazepines that are prescribed to them.

Quote:The key word is also habitual. I don't hang out with people who drink too much either because I don't drink all the time myself.

That's fine but ethanol is a drug and many people use it habitually (and it is legal and the dose is clearly stated on the packaging) and you haven't expressed revulsion because alcohol use is normative for the West.

You have a prejudice against drugs that the state has told you are "bad" and you have a corollary prejudice against people that use these "bad" drugs, i.e. they are "bad" people, they are "losers". You've essentially sought out "evidence" that confirms your prejudice and ignored all counter-examples that would upset your cherished prejudice.

Persons own their own bodies. If it is permissible for a woman to abort a fetus because she has sovereignty over her body then it is analogously also permissible for a person to use whatever drugs they want to. Bodily sovereignty is indivisible and were it to be taken seriously would not only protect a woman's right to abortion it would also allow for self-medication, self-deliverance and euthanasia.

The current logic is absurd and perverse: "we don't want you to use drugs because they are harmful and can ruin your life, so to deter you from using them, if we catch you using them we will give you a criminal record, fine you and even imprison you; we are doing that to prevent you from ruining your life".

So the state ruins your life to prevent you from ruining your life. Doesn't the literal absurdity of this regime signal to you that something is wrong? Is this the system you are giving your support to?
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26-02-2014, 08:08 AM (This post was last modified: 26-02-2014 08:18 AM by Taqiyya Mockingbird.)
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(26-02-2014 06:33 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  
(25-02-2014 11:38 PM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  I agree completely. But again I would stress that it's not THEIR contract, but YOUR contract that they were FORCED to sign in order to gain employment and be able to make a living for themselves.


I find your claim that it's "THEIR" contract to be un-FUCKING-believably arrogant. They wouldn't sign it if they didn't HAVE to, to make a living. You are a piece of fucking work.

Are they FORCED to work for me too? You hysterical drama queen!

I didn't say that. But if they want to work there, they have to sign your fucking contract, whatever it fucking says.


Quote:That's the beauty of a free employment market. I am a small business. There are about 100 other employers they can go work for.

That's great! I wouldn't work for an idiot like you.


Quote: This will probably piss you off, but I have also a policy of "smoke-free campus" if you wanna smoke a cigarette, you have to leave the property.

Why the fuck would that piss me off? I can't stand to be around tobacco. Project much?


Quote:I have lots of policies that you might not agree with. There is a no fraternizing policy. Ie, no dating your colleagues. Why? Because by eliminating that, I don't have to worry about the breakup, high drama, and sexual harassment (to a lesser extent). Am I selfish for this too? Or is the employee selfish for putting my business at an unnecessary risk for lawsuits. Or selfish that I now would have to shift employees to a different department (no easy feat in a small business), interrupting productivity, reducing the ultimate effect to te rest of the employees because those 2 employees couldn't keep it in their pants?
I run a business - not a dating pool.

Don't like it? I'm not the only employer in town...

I don't give a fuck about your drama policies. Strawman much? None of this has anything to do with your hysterical reefer-madness bullshit. Or your grandmother the pothead loser.

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


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26-02-2014, 08:12 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(26-02-2014 06:53 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  Every person I've ever met that did drugs on a regular basis turned into a gigantic loser. Arrest records are not sexy.

Like your doper grandmother.

Quote:There really isn't an argument that excessive use of drugs is good for you or provides benefits. In fact, there seems only to be negative effects to that individual and those around them. The amount of bodies I recover from overdoses is evidence enough for ME

Moving the goalposts like a theist troll. D-wereck would be proud!

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


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26-02-2014, 08:18 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(26-02-2014 07:07 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  
(26-02-2014 12:37 AM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  Yes, they are "free" to get into the unemployment lines in the middle of this Great Depression that the Republican Rape of America has left us with, to lose their houses and their belongings and their families, and to live in cardboard boxes. Let them eat fucking cake, say you.

Your arrogance is fucking disgusting.

I'm sorry - whose hysterical? We are in the middle of a "Great Depression"? Exaggerate much?

You are hysterical. And your company bullshit has nothing to do with your irrational reefer madness.

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


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26-02-2014, 08:25 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(26-02-2014 07:28 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  As I said, a female employee was diagnosed with cancer. She was smoking pot for the chemo. I gave her six months paid leave. I didn't have to do that.

That's all well and good -- commendable, even, but it has nothing whatsoever to do with your casting everyone who uses cannabis as if they were ALL stoned out of their minds 24/7.

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


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26-02-2014, 08:31 AM (This post was last modified: 26-02-2014 08:38 AM by Taqiyya Mockingbird.)
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(26-02-2014 07:43 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  Don't be fooled, MD. Taq only supports pot use because he smokes it. If he smoked meth, he would support a person's right to smoke it too.

You are out of your fucking mind. You just make whatever shit up you want and it becomes fucking reality for you, don't you. That's called "pathological lying". And again, here you go with your disingenuous bullshit, moving the goalposts all over the place. You say you say one thing, and then when you get called out on it, you say you say another.


Quote:I don't hear him saying crack, heroin or bath salts are a person's personal right...

That's right. And I don't hear you bleating on about people who use oxycontin legally being losers and dopers.



(26-02-2014 08:02 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  
(26-02-2014 07:59 AM)WitchSabrina Wrote:  I neither support not disagree with Either of you in this debate. I have no dog in this fight........but.....the above statement I do not believe is true. I like you Cath and you know that but Meth? Common.

jesus you guys
this is just out of hand when meth is used in statement like it's standard life, etc

Weeping

Witchy,

It's rhetorical since he is prone to dramatics and accusing me of hysteria while simultaneously exaggerating my disapproval of habitual drug use as a "reefer crusade."

I was pointing out the ridiculous of his claim that I am "prejudice" because I don't hang with chronic drug users.

Strawman much? Move the goalposts much? You didn't come up with this "habitual" shit until long after you were called on your hysterical "potheads" shit.

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


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26-02-2014, 08:35 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(26-02-2014 08:03 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  
(26-02-2014 07:52 AM)morondog Wrote:  I think where people were taking offense was over your perceived hardline attitude that *anyone* who even smokes a J once in a while is an addicted loser, not over your company policies. The company stuff got mixed in with the other stuff and confusion resulted...

I never said that. Not once. I repeatedly stated habitual use. Every day. Stoned all the time.

You only said that after you got called out for casting everyone who uses anything at all as a loser.

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


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26-02-2014, 08:49 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(26-02-2014 08:18 AM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  
(26-02-2014 07:07 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  I'm sorry - whose hysterical? We are in the middle of a "Great Depression"? Exaggerate much?

You are hysterical. And your company bullshit has nothing to do with your irrational reefer madness.

When are you going to stop whining like a big damn baby? We get your "reefer madness" chants, can you ever get passed the anger? It is very childish, and jumping straight to personal attacks with anyone that says something you do not agree with makes you look like a Jackass.

Anywho, why can't somebody have a strong feeling about a behavior or habit? Jeez, I don't like any part of smoking anything, and I would say one would be stupid to do so for several reasons:

1.) weed is illegal in the states I have lived in
2.) smoke of any kind contains hundreds of chemicals that are not meant to be introduced into ones lungs
3.) money
4.) smells
5.) supporting illegal activity associated with sales and transport

So jump on me for now if thats what makes you and your insecurites feel better. Like I said, it is my opinion that I think it is stupid to partake in its use (other than prescribed) for my own reasons. Don't like them, that is OK since they are mine and not yours. Also said it is stupid to not wear seatbelts in cars or helmets on bikes, so if you don't do either of those things, feel free to attack me on that too. Won't be any skin of of my back.

“Truth does not demand belief. Scientists do not join hands every Sunday, singing, yes, gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! I believe in my heart that what goes up, up, up, must come down, down, down. Amen! If they did, we would think they were pretty insecure about it.”
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26-02-2014, 08:52 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
On a side note, even the regular users on here refer to themselves as "potheads", so what is with all the defensiveness around this term? You have a weed habit = pothead.

“Truth does not demand belief. Scientists do not join hands every Sunday, singing, yes, gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! I believe in my heart that what goes up, up, up, must come down, down, down. Amen! If they did, we would think they were pretty insecure about it.”
— Dan Barker —
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26-02-2014, 08:54 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(25-02-2014 09:28 PM)Timber1025 Wrote:  Chas, I do see your point as testing does not evaluate a persons "state of mind" at the time of testing. But I have to ask out of curiosity, how would an accurate determination be made that is void of subjectivity and guesswork, when it comes to a persons chance of being "under the influence"? Current testing is all there is to go on and is explained to employees, so it does unfortunately mean stay away from drugs altogether to work here. Might be a bit unfair, but it does assess risk, which is enough for employers to make a call.

Testing for impairment requires a blood test to detect the actual presence of a drug - not its past presence.

It is not acceptable to deny or terminate employment for actions outside of work that do not affect performance on the job.

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