[split] First time drug experience
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
05-03-2014, 11:21 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(05-03-2014 11:17 AM)Stark Raving Wrote:  I'm gonna be real straight here......if you have no interest whatsoever in changing your opinion, why did you involve yourself in the conversation at all? To join a conversation, but think that sharing your opinion while simultaneously refusing to sway that opinion based on facts, is the epitome of closed-mindedness.

People state their opinion all the time regarding things without any intention on changing their mind, rather trying to understand the opposition. I join conversations regarding gay marriage without ever changing my mind that it is a human right's issue, but try to understand where the other side is coming from when they tell me they do not believe it to be a human rights issue.

This is what I did here. To understand why you would advocate for drug use. not to change my mind about it.

A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day - Bill Watterson
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-03-2014, 11:27 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
Why do you care what my opinion is, if yours is inflexible?

Also, your analogy is inaccurate. See Sabs explanation of "taking it to debate level" and "representing your opinions as facts" above. She's done better at explaining, and done so in a tone more appropriate than mine.

So many cats, so few good recipes.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Stark Raving's post
05-03-2014, 11:45 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(05-03-2014 11:18 AM)WitchSabrina Wrote:  
(05-03-2014 10:51 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  I read all of Chippy's words. He made valid points, and I have conceded as such. That still doesn't change my personal opinion regarding habitual recreational drug use. not all choices are based on every measurable amount of information out there, but rather one's personal experiences.

Every habitual drug user (for Chippy's benefit, this includes all drugs, including alcohol) has hurt or disappointed me in some way. My ex boyfriend used to abuse me when he was drunk (3 staples to the back of my head when he was 'convinced' that I had been cheating). My grandfather would get so drunk he would forget to make me any food while watching me and my siblings. My brother in law fed his addiction by stealing my narcotics from me when I needed them to quell the pain after surgery. Friends that I was very close to either died from overdose, or have just fallen off the grid.

So yeah, while my choices to avoid habitual drug users may not be logical, they are my choices. I see no value in gaining more knowledge about other drug users to gain a more representative population sample. There are only so many times I'm gonna play with that kinda fire and get burned before I just decide to fuck it, I'm not playing with that anymore. I have no desire to change my mind regarding it. The risk of associating myself with drug addicts (alcoholics included) far outweighs any benefits I might derive from it. To me, nothing good can come from snorting cocaine, shooting heroin, cooking meth, or living your life in a constant altered haze. So I choose not to to do, nor surround myself with people who do. Whats the point? We have nothing in common anyway.

What I don't understand, is why my personal opinion based on my personal experiences with drug users, needs to be logical, or a representative population sample? Or why, because of my personal choices, qualifies me as hysterical, a cunt, engaging in a reefer crusade, or stupid.

I never once stated that no one else could do drugs, or stated that I would engage in some kind of 'crusade' to stop them from using. If someone gets intoxicated around me, I simply excuse myself from the room, and if it happens more than once, I will spend less and less time around that person. Again, no where am I stopping this person from doing whatever the hell they want.

The only time I said drugs can cause a problem, is when that selfish hard drug user suffers from the delusion that their drug use affects no one but them.

If someone got their panties in a twist over my generalization of habitual recreational drug users, they are free to do as I did. i.e., Think I'm a loser (for my opinion) and disassociate themselves.


So yes, witchy, Chippy was kind enough to give me a free lesson on pharmacology, drug use, and statistics. You are smart not to argue with him on these things, as we all know, he will be hell bent on proving he is the smartest guy in the room....as he asserted himself to be the resident expert on enemas and douchbags.

I never refuted them all. I have no interest in changing my opinion on the matter because, again, the cost benefit analysis of befriending a bunch of drug addicts, strikes me as a losing investment.



Hon - I would never disallow that you are free to your own personal bias, opinions and observations you've made in your own life. Thumbsup You'll get nothing BUT free rein to run like the wind with what you have seen and what YOU (personally) believe. Done. K?
I think the problem in this thread is that in many of your statements (similar to the grammar one you and I just experienced together) You come across as though you are comparing facts against facts, statistics, etc as if to prove your personal view is THE correct one. You come across as you are making statements of Fact.

When actually - if these things you've shared are only your personal opinions - you could have just said so on page one and there'd been no debate. You took your personal opinion to debate level and spoke as if you were calling out facts. Then your *facts* (as you made them appear via delivery) were called out to question.

See - for me --- I have things I'm completely emotional about. Rape is one of those hot topics for me. I cannot possibly ever BE non-emotional about it. So..... I tend to cater to my emotions and just see my stance for what it is.........emotional and personal. In so doing there's NO NEED ever to try and make appear my own personal opinion as fact based. I couldn't care less if my viewpoint on rape is personal and emotional. In fact, I'm pretty sure it should be! You have every right to your own personal reasoning and background which has colored your opinions. That's just being human. No problem. But opinions and personal views are not facts and they rarely stand up to actual facts. I've discovered that highly emotional hot buttons simply Rarely stand up to offered facts; regardless of how severe & sincere we feel about them.

If we just shrug and say to those who oppose our personal opinions - "meh, it's just my personal viewpoint" it takes the sting out of the whole matter. AND if someone challenges your own personal view you can say "fucckit - I have my reasons" lol which you choose to share or not share.

I can tell that at some point your existence has been kicked in the heart by drug-use. I'd have to be made of stone to NOT read that in your postings. I feel for you. And I allow ALL the personal venom you wish to spew against drug use - habitual or otherwise. Knock yourself out. Spew all you wish.
But emotional opinions are that.............. emotional and opinion.

HeartHeartHeart

Right. Absolutely. Which is why in the THIRD commend I made on this subject, I prefaced everything I said based on my personal experience and my personal opinion that drug addicts were losers.

Quote:Good for you. I personally don't agree with altering your brain chemistry as a way to "enjoy life"...nor do I think its a good idea to experiment this way. But its your life. Why are you getting defensive? I don't agree that people should own pit bulls unless you can establish dog training credentials because they are a difficult and unique breed but thats just my experience with them that forms my opinion.

It was only then that somehow my personal opinion was morphed into fact. Facts according to me. Its a fact that every drug addict I have ever known is a loser. Its a fact that drugs were the primary contributor to tip that first domino for those people I have known. Or for a few people that I was involved with but did not know (i.e., bath salts girl). It's a fact that some drug use, even on off hours, puts a risk to my business, and therefore I minimize that risk because there are 49 other people who work for me that depend on that income.
These are my facts. My reality. We all know that statistics prove nothing because there are always a different sample that can yield different results, so all those stats chippy gave are no different from my particular stats. i.e., according to this, Denmark took the lead for the most binge drinking. Does this negate the fact that alcohol is a problem for the US because Denmark has a larger problem? Nope. https://www.mdt.mt.gov/safety/docs/taskf..._feb01.pdf

Just like the fact that alcohol is a greater problem negate the fact that other drug use, such as meth, isn't a problem because there is a bigger problem elsewhere?

Either way, the conversation lasted as long as it did, not because people took issue with my experience, but rather, took issue with the opinion I formed because of my experience. It wasn't a "population sample", therefore; it wasn't a valid objection to habitual drug users. When I said, "potheads are losers," everyone just simply left out the beginning of the paragraph where I stated, "in my opinion..."

A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day - Bill Watterson
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-03-2014, 11:50 AM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(05-03-2014 11:27 AM)Stark Raving Wrote:  Why do you care what my opinion is, if yours is inflexible?

Also, your analogy is inaccurate. See Sabs explanation of "taking it to debate level" and "representing your opinions as facts" above. She's done better at explaining, and done so in a tone more appropriate than mine.

So the only way I can care about what someone else thinks is if I am open to changing my opinion in the matter?

But you are completely right, as is witchy. My personal experience has made habitual drug use a hotter button for me than for most people. Maybe I need a joint to chill out? Laugh out load

Either way, I lost the plot, and concede that I am wrong on this matter.

A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day - Bill Watterson
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-03-2014, 04:57 PM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(05-03-2014 11:45 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  These are my facts. My reality. We all know that statistics prove nothing because there are always a different sample that can yield different results, so all those stats chippy gave are no different from my particular stats.

Your don't understand basic inferential statistics. A population representative sample will always yield the same results because it is--by definition--representative of the population.

Quote: i.e., according to this, Denmark took the lead for the most binge drinking.

So what?

Quote: Does this negate the fact that alcohol is a problem for the US because Denmark has a larger problem? Nope. https://www.mdt.mt.gov/safety/docs/taskf..._feb01.pdf

No it doesn't and it doesn't in any way contradict anything that I have posted.

It is like I'm arguing with a dumb teenager.
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-03-2014, 07:33 PM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(05-03-2014 04:57 PM)Chippy Wrote:  
(05-03-2014 11:45 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  These are my facts. My reality. We all know that statistics prove nothing because there are always a different sample that can yield different results, so all those stats chippy gave are no different from my particular stats.

Your don't understand basic inferential statistics. A population representative sample will always yield the same results because it is--by definition--representative of the population.

Quote: i.e., according to this, Denmark took the lead for the most binge drinking.

So what?

Quote: Does this negate the fact that alcohol is a problem for the US because Denmark has a larger problem? Nope. https://www.mdt.mt.gov/safety/docs/taskf..._feb01.pdf

No it doesn't and it doesn't in any way contradict anything that I have posted.

It is like I'm arguing with a dumb teenager.

Why must you mischaracterizations everything I say? Seriously.

A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day - Bill Watterson
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-03-2014, 07:38 PM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
I think we can sum up this thread...

[Image: immovable_zps83ed3674.jpg]

I'm not anti-social. I'm pro-solitude. Sleepy
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like Anjele's post
05-03-2014, 08:07 PM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(05-03-2014 07:33 PM)Cathym112 Wrote:  Why must you mischaracterizations everything I say? Seriously.

I'm not mischaracterising anything that you posted, you are the only one that is distorting what others have posted.

Just stop trying to act intelligent and informed about this topic. You clearly don't know what you are talking about and are just talking shit. You don't even understand the concept of a population representative sample despite your claim to the contrary.

You are an idiot and you refuse to learn anything because you are convinced of your own intelligence and knowledge. You've got a degree from some podunk university. I've only done first-year economics and I'm familiar with Friedman's famous paper on methodology in economics. You claim to have a master's degree in economics and you are clueless about Friedman's advocacy of fictionalism in economics. This is indicative of your knowledge about a subject you are supposed to have an advanced degree in so you have absolutely no hope on any other substantive matter.

And no this isn't about your opinion, it is about facts and you presented no facts which corroborated your hypocritical position.

Do you really believe that I know nothing about the subjects that I post about and that I'm just Googling it and this idea emboldens you to try and argue with me? Is that what you tell yourself to feel better about your ignorance? You too have access to Google so why does every argument you have with me end in you making a complete idiot of yourself? The graph and table that I posted from Nutt et al (2007) are from the body of the paper and only the abstract is freely available so clearly I have the paper in its entirety. Public policy in relation to drugs is a topic I have been following for several years.

WS posted to try and save your from yourself. You are so fucking stupid that you don't realise that your bumpkin ass has been handed to you (yet again). You are a stupid fucking rube and that is obvious to everyone; that you repeatedly try and argue with me about subjects you know nothing about is indicative of the magnitude of your stupidity. Do yourself a favour and just STFU and in the future don't enter a debate on a topic you know nothing about.
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-03-2014, 08:16 PM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(05-03-2014 08:07 PM)Chippy Wrote:  
(05-03-2014 07:33 PM)Cathym112 Wrote:  Why must you mischaracterizations everything I say? Seriously.

I'm not mischaracterising anything that you posted, you are the only one that is distorting what others have posted.

Just stop trying to act intelligent and informed about this topic. You clearly don't know what you are talking about and are just talking shit. You don't even understand the concept of a population representative sample despite your claim to the contrary.

You are an idiot and you refuse to learn anything because you are convinced of your own intelligence and knowledge. You've got a degree from some podunk university. I've only done first-year economics and I'm familiar with Friedman's famous paper on methodology in economics. You claim to have a master's degree in economics and you are clueless about Friedman's advocacy of fictionalism in economics. This is indicative of your knowledge about a subject you are supposed to have an advanced degree in so you have absolutely no hope on any other substantive matter.

And no this isn't about your opinion, it is about facts and you presented no facts which corroborated your hypocritical position.

Do you really believe that I know nothing about the subjects that I post about and that I'm just Googling it and this idea emboldens you to try and argue with me? Is that what you tell yourself to feel better about your ignorance? You too have access to Google so why does every argument you have with me end in you making a complete idiot of yourself? The graph and table that I posted from Nutt et al (2007) are from the body of the paper and only the abstract is freely available so clearly I have the paper in its entirety. Public policy in relation to drugs is a topic I have been following for several years.

WS posted to try and save your from yourself. You are so fucking stupid that you don't realise that your bumpkin ass has been handed to you (yet again). You are a stupid fucking rube and that is obvious to everyone; that you repeatedly try and argue with me about subjects you know nothing about is indicative of the magnitude of your stupidity. Do yourself a favour and just STFU and in the future don't enter a debate on a topic you know nothing about.

/offtopic
why do most sites only give the abstract and are the full versions so damn expensice just to have access to it? Oh and how do you have access to the papers?

I don't really like going outside.
It's too damn "peopley" out there....
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-03-2014, 08:25 PM
RE: [split] First time drug experience
(05-03-2014 08:16 PM)Lightvader Wrote:  /offtopic
why do most sites only give the abstract and are the full versions so damn expensice just to have access to it?

Because the papers are published mainly by commercial publishers and they want to make a profit.

Quote:Oh and how do you have access to the papers?

Various reasons:
--I have some subscriptions
--I use the reference libraries of the university I graduated from (as an alumnus I also have limited borrowing privileges)
--Sometimes I correspond with the authors and they send me an electronic copy of their paper
--Sometimes the paper can be found online at the authors personal homepage
--Sometimes the paper has been (illegally) uploaded
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: