[split] Gun Control (Orlando Mass Shooting)
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21-06-2016, 12:30 PM
RE: [split] Gun Control (Orlando Mass Shooting)
(21-06-2016 12:10 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(21-06-2016 11:28 AM)Brian37 Wrote:  You said I need help, now I am merely confused? Walking it back now aren't we?

Still does not change our gun death epidemic. Still does not change that the GOP/NRA obstruct every measure after lying saying they want to keep guns out of the wrong hands.

You sound like a theist arguing a holy book. You're interpreting it wrong.

You can go fuck yourself too. Nobody wants to ban all guns. Nobody wants a fascist state. We are simply tired of the bullshit lies and obstruction of one lobby and one industry.

You're just being a fucking crybaby because I am not fooled by your shell game.

I'm anti gun and I think going off like this does more harm than good.

Every state in the country has different gun laws, then on top of that the fed has some too. Chas' state is on the strict side.

We do have a problem in this country. But it's not really with guns as much as it is with crime, poverty, drugs, poor education and lousy mental health care.

Guns are the red herring. We can get rid of all the guns and we still have to deal with all these problems. if we actually stood up and did something about all these things, then the whole gun argument becomes more moot.

No, guns are not a red herring. A Quran is only an object too. It has no magic ability by itself with no human help, to jump off a table or shelf and murder someone all by itself. Funny how the west rightfully says "Your interpretation of that object does cause real harm".

The object is the problem. The Quran is the problem and a gun is a problem. Of course you cant get rid of all Muslims or all guns. But you can point out to humans that blind worship of anything and lack of pragmatism in how you view those objects is a problem.

Unless we face we make too many guns and unless we face they are too easy to get, we will not reduce gun deaths.

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21-06-2016, 12:36 PM
RE: [split] Gun Control (Orlando Mass Shooting)
(21-06-2016 12:13 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  
(21-06-2016 09:39 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  Brian, you need to learn how to discuss rather than harangue.

No I don't.

Yes, you do. Shouting at people does not change minds.

(21-06-2016 12:13 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  We've compromised to fucking much and been polite too much and been a doormat too much to one lobby and one industry.

Wait, you got appointed spokesmen for all gun-control advocates? You certainly don't represent me, I didn't get a vote, and I certainly would not have approved had I known of this.

Protip: you will never get anywhere politically without compromise, and gun-control is a political issue. Simple-minded shouting does nothing but inflame everyone involved.

Why in the world would anyone want to listen to someone yelling and cussing at them?

(21-06-2016 12:13 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  If they cannot accept that gun safety advocates are not out to get them for merely saying the status quo is unacceptable. And if they still insist on demonizing anyone who criticizes the the decades of do nothing, I really don't see how being polite helps at this point.

I fail to see how being rude helps anything. You make your points weak when you have to insult your interlocutor, you look uneducated when every fifth word is "fucking", and neither of those results does a single thing to advance your cause -- matter of fact, they set them back, because all the far-right has to do is point at you and say, "Look, these are the people we have to deal with, there's no reasoning with him." You justify their refusal to talk to you by being so obnoxious in your presentation.

(21-06-2016 12:13 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  To me what you are suggesting is pretending ISIS can be reasonable if you just be polite to them.

There's an insult right there, and an idiotic one at that. You want to compare me or Chas to a group which sets people alight? And then you expect me to listen to you thereafter?

(21-06-2016 12:13 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  The only thing I really want the GOP to stop doing, is allowing the NRA and gun makers control the narrative and stop painting any opposition as being evil.

The irony ... it burns. You just compared folks happy to use guns responsibly to ISIS ... and then complain about being called evil?

Maybe you should exemplify the behavior you wish to see.

Until you change the way you talk to me and to others, I simply won't take a single word you say seriously; I already skip over most of your posts as it is. I refuse to be brow-beaten or harangued and that is exactly what you do every time anyone disagrees with you about anything, not just gun issues.

You impugn your own positions with your childish behavior and incessant rudeness.
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21-06-2016, 12:51 PM
RE: [split] Gun Control (Orlando Mass Shooting)
(21-06-2016 12:36 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  
(21-06-2016 12:13 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  No I don't.

Yes, you do. Shouting at people does not change minds.

(21-06-2016 12:13 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  We've compromised to fucking much and been polite too much and been a doormat too much to one lobby and one industry.

Wait, you got appointed spokesmen for all gun-control advocates? You certainly don't represent me, I didn't get a vote, and I certainly would not have approved had I known of this.

Protip: you will never get anywhere politically without compromise, and gun-control is a political issue. Simple-minded shouting does nothing but inflame everyone involved.

Why in the world would anyone want to listen to someone yelling and cussing at them?

(21-06-2016 12:13 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  If they cannot accept that gun safety advocates are not out to get them for merely saying the status quo is unacceptable. And if they still insist on demonizing anyone who criticizes the the decades of do nothing, I really don't see how being polite helps at this point.

I fail to see how being rude helps anything. You make your points weak when you have to insult your interlocutor, you look uneducated when every fifth word is "fucking", and neither of those results does a single thing to advance your cause -- matter of fact, they set them back, because all the far-right has to do is point at you and say, "Look, these are the people we have to deal with, there's no reasoning with him." You justify their refusal to talk to you by being so obnoxious in your presentation.

(21-06-2016 12:13 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  To me what you are suggesting is pretending ISIS can be reasonable if you just be polite to them.

There's an insult right there, and an idiotic one at that. You want to compare me or Chas to a group which sets people alight? And then you expect me to listen to you thereafter?

(21-06-2016 12:13 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  The only thing I really want the GOP to stop doing, is allowing the NRA and gun makers control the narrative and stop painting any opposition as being evil.

The irony ... it burns. You just compared folks happy to use guns responsibly to ISIS ... and then complain about being called evil?

Maybe you should exemplify the behavior you wish to see.

Until you change the way you talk to me and to others, I simply won't take a single word you say seriously; I already skip over most of your posts as it is. I refuse to be brow-beaten or harangued and that is exactly what you do every time anyone disagrees with you about anything, not just gun issues.

You impugn your own positions with your childish behavior and incessant rudeness.

Yea so glad Susan B Anthony, Martin Luther King Jr and Malcolm X never pissed anyone off.

If you want to play good cop go head. But you are dead wrong to equate cussing as the same as advocating violence. My own mom has had a mostly long term history of voting republican. And I run into lots of gun owners who don't agree with the NRA.

No, sorry. This bullshit cycle of , violence, offering of thoughts and prayers, morning and memorials, is tiresome. Nobody is out to ban all guns, and nobody wants a fascist state. But no, I am tired of being polite to bullshit. If the GOP/NRA claims worked as well as they claim, nobody would be bitching.

The GOP/NRA position on guns is bullshit. Just like claiming evolution is false is bullshit. Just like claiming the earth is flat is bullshit.

If you want to coddle the insecurities of gullible people who buy into their fear marketing, I can't stop you. But I refuse.

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21-06-2016, 01:09 PM
RE: [split] Gun Control (Orlando Mass Shooting)
(21-06-2016 10:24 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(21-06-2016 10:17 AM)Gawdzilla Wrote:  However, you DID admit to "generally". I'm still at "sometimes". Drinking Beverage

Then your perception is faulty. Look at all the gun threads. Drinking Beverage

Asking hard questions is rude to you?
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21-06-2016, 01:09 PM
RE: [split] Gun Control (Orlando Mass Shooting)
Any atheist left or right well read, knows Hitchen's story about "If you asked me to kill my own son, I would say NO and fuck you!"

I am applying the same logic to our flooded gun market. The GOP/NRA sells worship, not pragmatism, but to blind loyalty to a position, not problem solving.

The GOP/NRA is literally asking society to be that child, using the metaphor that the act of blind loyalty and arbitrary loyalty is more important than the child itself.

So I say the same thing to the GOP/NRA that Hitchens said about the sick and vile story of a God asking you to murder your own child. "NO AND FUCK YOU".

The GOD in this the gun in this metaphor and the child is all the death due to blind loyalty to a position.

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21-06-2016, 01:10 PM
RE: [split] Gun Control (Orlando Mass Shooting)
(21-06-2016 11:28 AM)Brian37 Wrote:  
(21-06-2016 07:55 AM)Chas Wrote:  You are clearly confused. Now go fuck yourself.

You said I need help, now I am merely confused? Walking it back now aren't we?

You are confused on the facts. It is with your emotional state that you need help.

Quote:Still does not change our gun death epidemic. Still does not change that the GOP/NRA obstruct every measure after lying saying they want to keep guns out of the wrong hands.

That is simply not the case. They block legislation that has no demonstrable utility, or too little to justify the loss of freedoms.

Quote:You sound like a theist arguing a holy book. You're interpreting it wrong.

And where did I say that? Consider

Quote:You can go fuck yourself too. Nobody wants to ban all guns. Nobody wants a fascist state. We are simply tired of the bullshit lies and obstruction of one lobby and one industry.

Actually, many people do want top ban civilian ownership of most guns. Hillary Clinton for one. She has said more than once that she wants Australian-style gun control.

Quote:You're just being a fucking crybaby because I am not fooled by your shell game.

There is no shell game, and I'm not the one being absurdly emotional here.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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21-06-2016, 01:13 PM
RE: [split] Gun Control (Orlando Mass Shooting)
(21-06-2016 01:09 PM)Gawdzilla Wrote:  
(21-06-2016 10:24 AM)Chas Wrote:  Then your perception is faulty. Look at all the gun threads. Drinking Beverage

Asking hard questions is rude to you?

What are you talking about? Consider

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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21-06-2016, 01:18 PM
RE: [split] Gun Control (Orlando Mass Shooting)
(21-06-2016 01:10 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(21-06-2016 11:28 AM)Brian37 Wrote:  You said I need help, now I am merely confused? Walking it back now aren't we?

You are confused on the facts. It is with your emotional state that you need help.

Quote:Still does not change our gun death epidemic. Still does not change that the GOP/NRA obstruct every measure after lying saying they want to keep guns out of the wrong hands.

That is simply not the case. They block legislation that has no demonstrable utility, or too little to justify the loss of freedoms.

Quote:You sound like a theist arguing a holy book. You're interpreting it wrong.

And where did I say that? Consider

Quote:You can go fuck yourself too. Nobody wants to ban all guns. Nobody wants a fascist state. We are simply tired of the bullshit lies and obstruction of one lobby and one industry.

Actually, many people do want top ban civilian ownership of most guns. Hillary Clinton for one. She has said more than once that she wants Australian-style gun control.

Quote:You're just being a fucking crybaby because I am not fooled by your shell game.

There is no shell game, and I'm not the one being absurdly emotional here.

Yes it is a shell game asshole.

If the GOP/NRA positions worked, nobody would be bitching.

You, " It's gang voilence"

Me, "Ok, lets make it harder for gang members to get guns"

You, "NO"

You, "It's the mentally ill"

Me, "Ok, lets make it harder for the mentally ill to get guns"

You, "No"

You, "It's the terrorists"

Me, "Ok, lets make it harder for the terrorists to get them".

You, "No".

You have an excuse every fucking time and no, I don't believe you when you say you want to keep them out of the wrong hands.

Just admit you don't give a fuck as long as you can have your death toy.

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21-06-2016, 01:24 PM
RE: [split] Gun Control (Orlando Mass Shooting)
(21-06-2016 01:18 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  Just admit you don't give a fuck as long as you can have your death toy.

That ain't Chas, but your post is provocative.

#sigh
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21-06-2016, 01:24 PM (This post was last modified: 21-06-2016 01:34 PM by Chas.)
RE: [split] Gun Control (Orlando Mass Shooting)
(21-06-2016 01:18 PM)Brian37 Wrote:  
(21-06-2016 01:10 PM)Chas Wrote:  You are confused on the facts. It is with your emotional state that you need help.


That is simply not the case. They block legislation that has no demonstrable utility, or too little to justify the loss of freedoms.


And where did I say that? Consider


Actually, many people do want top ban civilian ownership of most guns. Hillary Clinton for one. She has said more than once that she wants Australian-style gun control.


There is no shell game, and I'm not the one being absurdly emotional here.

Yes it is a shell game asshole.

If the GOP/NRA positions worked, nobody would be bitching.

You, " It's gang voilence"

Me, "Ok, lets make it harder for gang members to get guns"

You, "NO"

You, "It's the mentally ill"

Me, "Ok, lets make it harder for the mentally ill to get guns"

You, "No"

You, "It's the terrorists"

Me, "Ok, lets make it harder for the terrorists to get them".

You, "No".

You have an excuse every fucking time and no, I don't believe you when you say you want to keep them out of the wrong hands.

Just admit you don't give a fuck as long as you can have your death toy.

You are delirious. That conversation is entirely in your head.

Stop making shit up and claiming I said it. It is disgustingly dishonest.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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