[split] I need to rant to other atheists.
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10-06-2014, 11:14 PM
RE: [split] I need to rant to other atheists.
(10-06-2014 06:02 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  I see posts full of obscenities and hateful language.

I see people calling me a troll and personally attacking me.

I see very little engagement of the points I have made.

And yet you want me to believe you all are somehow 'moral'?

That you all are somehow the bastion of rationality and reason?

How does it help your cause to act the same way as the narrow minded and dogmatic religious you see as being a threat to society?

I agree that calling you a troll and belittling you is immature and childish. You have made it very difficult and very frustrating for people to engage you in meaningful dialogue. So those people have either stopped taking you seriously or have stopped responding (myself included). I wish people would either ignore you or engage you respectfully, but I suspect that this kind of treatment will be about what you can expect for the remainder of your stay.
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10-06-2014, 11:43 PM (This post was last modified: 10-06-2014 11:52 PM by true scotsman.)
RE: [split] I need to rant to other atheists.
(10-06-2014 11:32 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(10-06-2014 11:16 AM)true scotsman Wrote:  You wrote: I was raised to put others needs before my own. I was taught that selfishness is a vice not a virtue. You would have me believe the exact opposite.


I know you were Jeremy and that is precisely the problem. You were raised to be a sacrificial animal. You were taught that one man's good must come at the expense of another man's harm. You were taught that your purpose is to sacrifice your own good for the good of others and your error is that you accepted it. This is the great evil of Christianity that it promotes self abnegation and self sacrifice. It teaches little children that to seek their own happiness is evil. There could not be a more anti-life philosophy than Christianity.

You have never considered the alternative of a rational self interest. Rational self interest is not doing whatever you want on the whim of the moment. A rationally selfish person lives long range. He wants to produce the values he needs for a happy life on his own. He is a trader in life. He does not accept the unearned. He does not accept anyone's sacrifice. Neither does he sacrifice himself to others. He deals with others by trading values not wounds. He does not seek to trample on others to achieve his goals. He treats others with the respect and dignity they deserve as individuals.

You believe it is either cut your own throat for others or cut their throat for yourself. I say let's do away with the entire concept of throat cutting.

Yes Jeremy I want you to accept the exact opposite of what you were taught. I want you to learn the virtue of rational self interest. I want you to live as a man.

I do not consider living selfishly living as a man. I would consider that childish.

You also speak about not accepting what you have not earned. The very freedom afforded to you to sit and speak as you do was something secured for you by those who lived and died that came before you and is thus something you have not earned. The same men who denied themselves and fought and gave their lives so that you can sit in the comfort of your home and talk about being selfish as if it is a virtue and as if you are a man because you think so.

Real men are selfless, not selfish. The real men are the ones who deny themselves and put their lives on the line so children like you can sit here in the safety and security of your home on an internet forum and talk about "living as a man".

The real men are the soldiers, the police officers, the fire fighters and other public servants who make a living out of putting themselves in harms way so those who cannot help themselves might have some small measure of peace of mind. Many of these men have families and children of their own and if they thought like you they would throw their hands up and say to hell with everybody else, im gonna look out for me and my own.

Thank God, people who think like you sir are in the minority.

Maybe not Jeremy. After all people who think like you are in the majority and have been for all of history and look at the state of the world. Yes the world would be a horrible place if everyone wanted to be happy and set about to achieve their own happiness while not interfering with others who are doing the same.

You have been so thoroughly indoctrinated with the morality of Altruism that you think the only way you can live as a real man is to die for someone else. I sincerely hope that those men who came before me and fought did so for their own good and weren't thinking of me at all. Likewise I hope the cops and the firemen are doing it for their own selfish reasons. Yes I benefit from their rational self interest just like I benefit from Bill Gates', Ayn Rand's and the man who invented the internal combustion engine. None of those people did what they did for me, they did it in order to use their mind and their productiveness to trade their best effort for the best effort of others. Who did more for human kind: Bill gates acting in his own self interest or Mother Theresa?

Once again lets consider what it means to be selfless. When we speak of the self we are speaking of the mind. So the desire to be selfless is the desire to be mindless, to have no thought of your own, no ambition for your own life, to have no purpose of your own, to have no pride and no self esteem.

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

Don't sacrifice for me, live for yourself! - Me

The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
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11-06-2014, 12:09 AM
RE: [split] I need to rant to other atheists.
(10-06-2014 11:14 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  
(10-06-2014 06:02 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  I see posts full of obscenities and hateful language.

I see people calling me a troll and personally attacking me.

I see very little engagement of the points I have made.

And yet you want me to believe you all are somehow 'moral'?

That you all are somehow the bastion of rationality and reason?

How does it help your cause to act the same way as the narrow minded and dogmatic religious you see as being a threat to society?

I agree that calling you a troll and belittling you is immature and childish. You have made it very difficult and very frustrating for people to engage you in meaningful dialogue. So those people have either stopped taking you seriously or have stopped responding (myself included). I wish people would either ignore you or engage you respectfully, but I suspect that this kind of treatment will be about what you can expect for the remainder of your stay.

Well said Michael, and I do agree with you. Yes

However, Mr Walker is not innocent in this arena either. He is well aware of how people feel about him, and the anger he stirs up, yet continues to dangle the painfully obvious passive-aggressive bait-on-a-hook everyday. He is well aware of the reactions he will receive! Rolleyes

As a former christian, I can honestly say that he has planted the seeds, which is what we are taught to do! He's actually planted a field by now, and would be better served, by moving on to other projects.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that he enjoys his time here. No one is holding a gun to his head. I suspect there is some serious ego going on for him. All he has to do is post one or two sentences, and 17 pages will explode into existence, within hours. That's fine, but then to vent about people attacking him, is absolutely absurd.

Honestly, I think a real christian would've long since left TTA. The bible teaches them to "come out from among them, and be ye separate"....not camp out at their doorstep, and then complain when they get stepped on. Dodgy

It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled. ~Mark Twain
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11-06-2014, 04:26 AM
RE: [split] I need to rant to other atheists.
(10-06-2014 03:49 PM)Smercury44 Wrote:  
(10-06-2014 03:36 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  Why are you angry?

Oh I don't know, a group that covers up the molestation of children, allows it to continue, and helps those who've committed such a horrible crime escape punishment kinda pisses me off. Dodgy

Why?
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11-06-2014, 04:50 AM
RE: [split] I need to rant to other atheists.
(10-06-2014 01:11 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(10-06-2014 12:58 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  you make it sound like people do not have the capacity to exercise self control.

That they either masterbate or go have sex with someone. How about the third option? Allow your body to get rid of the excess semen via nocturnal emission?

But if you're married with the woman being told that she must be submissive to her husband and both of them must be submissive to God then this means that there is greater chance of there being penetrative sex and thus child birth. Especially for Catholics who are told that contraceptives are a sin.

Now maybe you are like me and don't have a strong sex drive or the need to act upon it, but many people do. If you lead a church and preach that masturbation is wrong then many of your congregation will be those who need to relieve their drives in ways other than through nocturnal emmisions.

If you deliberately refrain from masturbation even though you want to do it then you are also collaborating with this selfish act.

One reason I do not masturbate is because I am in a loving, committed relstionship with a beautiful woman who I love who God has brought into my life.

Out of respect for her, I refrain from masturbating because if I were to masturbate it would be as if I had cheated on her. I do not want to do that because I love her.

Some may say, well just don't think about anything while you do it. To which I would respond, that is not something I wish to do.

Some may say, well think about your girl. To which I would respond, doing thus would be no different than committing pre-marital sex.

So I do not want to do that.

So out of love and respect, I refrain and delight to. I enjoy exercising self control and self denial. I feel better physically, emotionally, and spiritually by living a chaste and pure life in this area.

It is very tough yea impossible for me to do in my own strength, but I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.

Thus no one is "controlling me". I answer to no priest nor do I do what I do because a pastor has ordered me to. I do what I do freely and gratefully and thank God for the opportunity to deny my own lustful passions. In so doing, paradoxically, I am edified and strengthened whilst simultaneously fulfilling my obligation to my beautiful girlfriend.
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11-06-2014, 05:40 AM
RE: [split] I need to rant to other atheists.
(11-06-2014 04:50 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(10-06-2014 01:11 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  But if you're married with the woman being told that she must be submissive to her husband and both of them must be submissive to God then this means that there is greater chance of there being penetrative sex and thus child birth. Especially for Catholics who are told that contraceptives are a sin.

Now maybe you are like me and don't have a strong sex drive or the need to act upon it, but many people do. If you lead a church and preach that masturbation is wrong then many of your congregation will be those who need to relieve their drives in ways other than through nocturnal emmisions.

If you deliberately refrain from masturbation even though you want to do it then you are also collaborating with this selfish act.

One reason I do not masturbate is because I am in a loving, committed relstionship with a beautiful woman who I love who God has brought into my life.

Out of respect for her, I refrain from masturbating because if I were to masturbate it would be as if I had cheated on her. I do not want to do that because I love her.

Some may say, well just don't think about anything while you do it. To which I would respond, that is not something I wish to do.

Some may say, well think about your girl. To which I would respond, doing thus would be no different than committing pre-marital sex.

So I do not want to do that.

So out of love and respect, I refrain and delight to. I enjoy exercising self control and self denial. I feel better physically, emotionally, and spiritually by living a chaste and pure life in this area.

It is very tough yea impossible for me to do in my own strength, but I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.

Thus no one is "controlling me". I answer to no priest nor do I do what I do because a pastor has ordered me to. I do what I do freely and gratefully and thank God for the opportunity to deny my own lustful passions. In so doing, paradoxically, I am edified and strengthened whilst simultaneously fulfilling my obligation to my beautiful girlfriend.

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11-06-2014, 05:41 AM
RE: [split] I need to rant to other atheists.
(11-06-2014 04:50 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(10-06-2014 01:11 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  But if you're married with the woman being told that she must be submissive to her husband and both of them must be submissive to God then this means that there is greater chance of there being penetrative sex and thus child birth. Especially for Catholics who are told that contraceptives are a sin.

Now maybe you are like me and don't have a strong sex drive or the need to act upon it, but many people do. If you lead a church and preach that masturbation is wrong then many of your congregation will be those who need to relieve their drives in ways other than through nocturnal emmisions.

If you deliberately refrain from masturbation even though you want to do it then you are also collaborating with this selfish act.

One reason I do not masturbate is because I am in a loving, committed relstionship with a beautiful woman who I love who God has brought into my life.

Out of respect for her, I refrain from masturbating because if I were to masturbate it would be as if I had cheated on her. I do not want to do that because I love her.

Some may say, well just don't think about anything while you do it. To which I would respond, that is not something I wish to do.

Some may say, well think about your girl. To which I would respond, doing thus would be no different than committing pre-marital sex.

So I do not want to do that.

So out of love and respect, I refrain and delight to. I enjoy exercising self control and self denial. I feel better physically, emotionally, and spiritually by living a chaste and pure life in this area.

It is very tough yea impossible for me to do in my own strength, but I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.

Thus no one is "controlling me". I answer to no priest nor do I do what I do because a pastor has ordered me to. I do what I do freely and gratefully and thank God for the opportunity to deny my own lustful passions. In so doing, paradoxically, I am edified and strengthened whilst simultaneously fulfilling my obligation to my beautiful girlfriend.

This is pathetic and sad. Here's why.

The human body, which is the very essence of who we are, isn’t respected in the bible. Sexuality is denigrated, the “flesh” is evil, passion is sinful, and one’s libido is impure. Health, beauty and physical pleasure are distractions from belief in God. There are no prizes for guessing who promotes these noxious ideas:
“This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would” (Gal. 5:16–17, KJV.)
“Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.” (Gal. 5:19-21, KJV.) Poor old Paul was profoundly anally retentive; unable to drop his guard and have a good time.

If a person’s innermost nature, what’s healthy, instinctive and natural, is wounded, to control them becomes easier. Suppressed sexuality can be channeled into piety and harnessed for the purposes of the Church.

All of us are sexual beings, yet the victims of a Christian upbringing often display circumspection, disdain and even an outright condemnation of sexuality. There are some predictable results, such as self-loathing, denial over sexual orientation, frigid relationships, guilt, loneliness, anger, and regret. Secular society is usually left to pick up the pieces after the damage has been done. I have many patients, particularly older people, who still have sexual problems due to their Christian upbringings, and it’s sometimes very difficult to help them. How tragic and unnecessary!

Some fundamentalist Christians have an obsessive preoccupation with other’s sexual preferences, thereby externalizing their own inner battle against sin. A classic example is a noisy preacher, himself a closet homosexual, babbling on about the evil of being gay.

Jeremy, grow up. Stop being a victim. Have a good wank... you'll clear your head. I bet your girlfriend would rather go out with a real man than a suppressed little weasel.
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11-06-2014, 06:21 AM
RE: [split] I need to rant to other atheists.
(11-06-2014 05:41 AM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  
(11-06-2014 04:50 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  One reason I do not masturbate is because I am in a loving, committed relstionship with a beautiful woman who I love who God has brought into my life.

Out of respect for her, I refrain from masturbating because if I were to masturbate it would be as if I had cheated on her. I do not want to do that because I love her.

Some may say, well just don't think about anything while you do it. To which I would respond, that is not something I wish to do.

Some may say, well think about your girl. To which I would respond, doing thus would be no different than committing pre-marital sex.

So I do not want to do that.

So out of love and respect, I refrain and delight to. I enjoy exercising self control and self denial. I feel better physically, emotionally, and spiritually by living a chaste and pure life in this area.

It is very tough yea impossible for me to do in my own strength, but I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.

Thus no one is "controlling me". I answer to no priest nor do I do what I do because a pastor has ordered me to. I do what I do freely and gratefully and thank God for the opportunity to deny my own lustful passions. In so doing, paradoxically, I am edified and strengthened whilst simultaneously fulfilling my obligation to my beautiful girlfriend.

This is pathetic and sad. Here's why.

The human body, which is the very essence of who we are, isn’t respected in the bible. Sexuality is denigrated, the “flesh” is evil, passion is sinful, and one’s libido is impure. Health, beauty and physical pleasure are distractions from belief in God. There are no prizes for guessing who promotes these noxious ideas:
“This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would” (Gal. 5:16–17, KJV.)
“Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.” (Gal. 5:19-21, KJV.) Poor old Paul was profoundly anally retentive; unable to drop his guard and have a good time.

If a person’s innermost nature, what’s healthy, instinctive and natural, is wounded, to control them becomes easier. Suppressed sexuality can be channeled into piety and harnessed for the purposes of the Church.

All of us are sexual beings, yet the victims of a Christian upbringing often display circumspection, disdain and even an outright condemnation of sexuality. There are some predictable results, such as self-loathing, denial over sexual orientation, frigid relationships, guilt, loneliness, anger, and regret. Secular society is usually left to pick up the pieces after the damage has been done. I have many patients, particularly older people, who still have sexual problems due to their Christian upbringings, and it’s sometimes very difficult to help them. How tragic and unnecessary!

Some fundamentalist Christians have an obsessive preoccupation with other’s sexual preferences, thereby externalizing their own inner battle against sin. A classic example is a noisy preacher, himself a closet homosexual, babbling on about the evil of being gay.

Jeremy, grow up. Stop being a victim. Have a good wank... you'll clear your head. I bet your girlfriend would rather go out with a real man than a suppressed little weasel.

According to the bible, the human body is not the essence of who we are. So this is just incorrect.

Neither is sexuality denigrated but the exact opposite. The ability for a married man and woman to come together and express love for each other via sexual union is something encouraged by God. Hence the command to "be fruitful and multiply" is seen several times in scripture. Even the apostle Paul encourages men and women who are married to express their love for one another via sexual union and to abstain only when both agree and for a specific time.

The Catholic church has largely been responsible for casting sex in a negative light. No where in the bible is it required for a minister of God to be celibate. This is an invention of the Catholic church and is not biblical.

But just like anything God made good, sex can be twisted and perverted.
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11-06-2014, 06:37 AM
RE: [split] I need to rant to other atheists.
(11-06-2014 06:21 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  According to the bible, the human body is not the essence of who we are. So this is just incorrect.
Where *would* we be without the Bible? It sure is lucky we've got some dodgy document written by arseholes several thousand years ago to guide us and tell us what's true.

Quote:But just like anything God made good, sex can be twisted and perverted.
Oh look, it's another douchey tit judging other people Smile Hello douche Smile

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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11-06-2014, 07:22 AM
RE: [split] I need to rant to other atheists.
(11-06-2014 06:21 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(11-06-2014 05:41 AM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  This is pathetic and sad. Here's why.

The human body, which is the very essence of who we are, isn’t respected in the bible. Sexuality is denigrated, the “flesh” is evil, passion is sinful, and one’s libido is impure. Health, beauty and physical pleasure are distractions from belief in God. There are no prizes for guessing who promotes these noxious ideas:
“This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would” (Gal. 5:16–17, KJV.)
“Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.” (Gal. 5:19-21, KJV.) Poor old Paul was profoundly anally retentive; unable to drop his guard and have a good time.

If a person’s innermost nature, what’s healthy, instinctive and natural, is wounded, to control them becomes easier. Suppressed sexuality can be channeled into piety and harnessed for the purposes of the Church.

All of us are sexual beings, yet the victims of a Christian upbringing often display circumspection, disdain and even an outright condemnation of sexuality. There are some predictable results, such as self-loathing, denial over sexual orientation, frigid relationships, guilt, loneliness, anger, and regret. Secular society is usually left to pick up the pieces after the damage has been done. I have many patients, particularly older people, who still have sexual problems due to their Christian upbringings, and it’s sometimes very difficult to help them. How tragic and unnecessary!

Some fundamentalist Christians have an obsessive preoccupation with other’s sexual preferences, thereby externalizing their own inner battle against sin. A classic example is a noisy preacher, himself a closet homosexual, babbling on about the evil of being gay.

Jeremy, grow up. Stop being a victim. Have a good wank... you'll clear your head. I bet your girlfriend would rather go out with a real man than a suppressed little weasel.

According to the bible, the human body is not the essence of who we are. So this is just incorrect.

Neither is sexuality denigrated but the exact opposite. The ability for a married man and woman to come together and express love for each other via sexual union is something encouraged by God. Hence the command to "be fruitful and multiply" is seen several times in scripture. Even the apostle Paul encourages men and women who are married to express their love for one another via sexual union and to abstain only when both agree and for a specific time.

The Catholic church has largely been responsible for casting sex in a negative light. No where in the bible is it required for a minister of God to be celibate. This is an invention of the Catholic church and is not biblical.

But just like anything God made good, sex can be twisted and perverted.

Jeremy - READ YOUR BIBLE! You also are, and always have been, a dishonest weasel.

“Truth does not demand belief. Scientists do not join hands every Sunday, singing, yes, gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! I believe in my heart that what goes up, up, up, must come down, down, down. Amen! If they did, we would think they were pretty insecure about it.”
— Dan Barker —
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