[split] Ignorance about anarchism
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16-05-2014, 06:45 PM (This post was last modified: 16-05-2014 06:58 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: [split] Ignorance about anarchism
(16-05-2014 05:46 PM)frankksj Wrote:  So most foreign banks don't want the hassle and have a an on American clients.

Just 'cause I'm in Costa Rica don't mean my banking ain't still back in the US. Interwebz and shit.

(16-05-2014 05:46 PM)frankksj Wrote:  And, you will have to file US taxes even if you never return to the US.

That's the deal I made when I used tax-deferred dollars to build up my retirement pot.

(16-05-2014 05:46 PM)frankksj Wrote:  But, expat returns are a lot more complicated and cost a fortune to file.

If I'm in good standing I can move back from Costa Rica to Maryland anytime I want.

#sigh
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16-05-2014, 06:53 PM
RE: [split] Ignorance about anarchism
(16-05-2014 06:28 PM)Chas Wrote:  you have agreed there are laws and regulations that are necessary and desirable at [the federal] level... There are laws and regulations for the protection of people that I think need to be federal, e.g. voting rights, consumer protection, food and drug laws, and the like.

But what rule do you use to determine whether a law needs to be at the federal level? I have an established, pragmatic standard: when one jurisdiction is causing direct, physical damage to property in another jurisdiction (like air and water pollution), fine, there needs to be some remedy from a larger jurisdiction.

But I don't see you applying a standard other than that it's your opinion. For example, why do drug laws need to be federal? The US locks up millions of its citizens, destroying millions of lives, ruining their chances for any sort of future, just because they grew an unapproved weed in their back yard. If Colorado says "Hey, we think is crazy. Kids do stupid things and grow out of it. We want our minority youth to be in college, building a future to become productive members of society, not wallowing in prison so they end up broke, uneducated, unemployable and dependent on welfare." Is it directly hurting the other 49 states if Colorado has their own drug laws? Of course not. It doesn't "need" to be at the Federal level. Florida can still ban pot, and if they light up in Colorado it isn't going to destroy Florida's everglades. You "want" it to be at the federal level. What's missing in your statement is that while YOU may have opinions on things like drugs and consumer protections, OTHERS have equally valid differing opinions, and by making the laws at the Federal level you are only allowing one set of opinions to exist, and everybody else forced to deal with it. Whereas what I'm saying is "Sure, like you, I have an opinion on drugs, etc. BUT, I recognize other people have a different opinion that's just as valid, so we need a way for both opinions to coexist." Why is that offensive to non-libertarians? Why is it called "selfish"?

And why can't you see that when you don't apply a pragmatic, measurable standard to determine what MUST be a federal law, then really there is no standard. "Because I think so" isn't a standard. If we let voters all decide what laws should be local vs. universal, OF COURSE, everybody is going to say their laws need to be universal because everybody thinks they're right, everybody else is wrong, and they need universal laws to save the other morons from their own stupidity. That's the whole point of a constitution. It uses logic and reason to determine what MUST be done at the federal level (ie the enumerated powers) and mandates that everything else must be done at the state level so you don't have this barbaric "might makes right, winner takes all" system we have now that allows for only one set of opinions and everybody else has a gun to their head.

(16-05-2014 06:28 PM)Chas Wrote:  However, if you were free to leave the country with no strings attached, it doesn't really matter whether the laws are local or national, does it?

Of course it does! The city of Boston does NOT have a military and the power to force, say, Costa Rica, to monitor all former Bostonians, report back to Boston their whereabouts and all their activity, and send back any former Bostonians in Costa Rica who don't obey Boston municipal codes. The national government however does have that power and they do just that, such as FATCA, and what happened to Bobby Fischer. So, yes, even though I live in Switzerland and don't expect to ever move back to the US, it DOES have a huge effect on me whether Americans pass laws at the state or national level. State laws have no impact. But I break federal laws, like say Bush's executive order against Fischer playing chess in Yugoslavia, then the US will apply unbearable pressure to foreign governments until they force them to send me back.
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16-05-2014, 06:58 PM
RE: [split] Ignorance about anarchism
(16-05-2014 06:40 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  You're wrong if you think the US Government somehow prevents, restricts or otherwise obstructs you from moving to Costa Rica anytime you please.

That's absurd. The whole point of all those US laws that force American expats to report back to their big brother minders is to make it difficult to leave. Countless Americans have tried to live abroad and found it impossible to live when they have to pay into 2 different country's tax systems, and thus have no choice but to return to the US. And before passing FATCA, Obama even admitted the point was to force those 'benedict arnold traitors' to repatriate their possessions.

It's really disingenuous to say the US government doesn't "prevent, restrict or obstruct" expatriation when you know they push for laws like the "ex-patriot act" which make expatriation challenging at best.
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16-05-2014, 07:00 PM
RE: [split] Ignorance about anarchism
(16-05-2014 06:45 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(16-05-2014 05:46 PM)frankksj Wrote:  So most foreign banks don't want the hassle and have a an on American clients.

Just 'cause I'm in Costa Rica don't mean my banking ain't still back in the US.

Fine, for YOU that may not be an impediment. But what about some other American who hasn't been making $150k a year from Uncle Sam and needs to start a business in Costa Rica? Surely his inability to open a bank account is a huge obstacle. Libertarians are always accused of being selfish, but, what is it when you say 'this law doesn't hurt me so everybody else has to deal with it'?
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16-05-2014, 07:02 PM (This post was last modified: 16-05-2014 07:21 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: [split] Ignorance about anarchism
(16-05-2014 06:58 PM)frankksj Wrote:  Countless Americans have tried to live abroad and found it impossible to live when they have to pay into 2 different country's tax systems, ...

The fuck dude. I gotta file both State and Federal. How many you count there? TurboTax could handle it.

#sigh
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16-05-2014, 07:06 PM
RE: [split] Ignorance about anarchism
(16-05-2014 07:00 PM)frankksj Wrote:  Surely his inability to open a bank account is a huge obstacle.

It's $5 to open an account with my credit union. If I relocate to Costa Rica I will still be using my credit union for my banking.

#sigh
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16-05-2014, 07:09 PM
RE: [split] Ignorance about anarchism
(16-05-2014 07:02 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  The fuck dude. I gotta file both State and Federal. How many you count there?

I meant that, as a resident living in Costa Rica using government services, you would have to pay to Costa Rica obviously. But, assuming you were born in the US, you will ALSO have to pay US taxes, even if you never go back to the US.

This is unquestionably a major burden. If you were born in any country except N. Korea, Cuba or the US, you could move to Costa Rica anytime you wanted, with no strings attached, no obligations to your mother country, and only pay Costa Rica taxes. The fact that the US forces you to keep paying US taxes for life even after you expatriate IS a major barrier that stops lots of Americans from expatriating.
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16-05-2014, 07:09 PM (This post was last modified: 16-05-2014 07:15 PM by Chas.)
RE: [split] Ignorance about anarchism
tags not working ... Dodgy

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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16-05-2014, 07:11 PM
RE: [split] Ignorance about anarchism
????? quote tags fucked up?

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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16-05-2014, 07:29 PM
RE: [split] Ignorance about anarchism
(16-05-2014 07:09 PM)frankksj Wrote:  But, assuming you were born in the US, you will ALSO have to pay US taxes, even if you never go back to the US..

That's the deal I signed when I used tax-deferred dollars to build up my retirement pot.

#sigh
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