[split] LGBT (sub)section?
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
19-06-2017, 11:02 AM
RE: [split] LGBT (sub)section?
(19-06-2017 10:47 AM)Emma Wrote:  Well maybe you stand to easily find another employer. It's not so easy for everyone else. That's why those protections exist.
Yes. I worked hard and educated myself. If I lost my job tomorrow, I'd do whatever it took to take care of my family until I found a better situation. I've done it before, and if need be I'd do it again, but I have educated myself and built a reputation. Everyone should do this.

(19-06-2017 10:47 AM)Emma Wrote:  Also, I never said that the levels of danger and discrimination were comparable. YOU DID.
Okay...

"There is little that most Americans can do to improve conditions for Afghans and Saudi's- that does not mean we should sit on our hands until things either deteriorate to that level of inhumanity or they catch up to our level of inhumanity."

My point was actually that they aren't comparable.

(19-06-2017 10:47 AM)Emma Wrote:  And good for you for contributing to the betterment. Did you fix the situation? Nope.

So what, all or nothing? If you can't make something perfect, do nothing?


(19-06-2017 10:47 AM)Emma Wrote:  And I never said that things were getting worse. But they aren't guaranteed not to.
Already covered.

(19-06-2017 10:47 AM)Emma Wrote:  And I don't think employers should be able to fire employees for any reason whatsoever outside of a contract. I think employees should be protected from flagrant abuse of power. Employees deserve such freedom to be able to live their lives outside the confines of the employers dictation. So long as they can do the job then they should not be fired from it- within reason, of course. That's why protected classes exist. Because employers cannot be trusted to treat employees with such fairness.

Yeah, just going to agree to disagree on this one or else we'll go down a rabbit-hole not worth going down, but if you're truly interested in learning about the effects of protected classes of people, I'd suggest you check out Thomas Sowell, or Milton Friedman.

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
19-06-2017, 11:02 AM
RE: [split] LGBT (sub)section?
(19-06-2017 10:59 AM)Anjele Wrote:  
(19-06-2017 10:47 AM)Emma Wrote:  Well maybe you stand to easily find another employer. It's not so easy for everyone else. That's why those protections exist. Also, I never said that the levels of danger and discrimination were comparable. YOU DID. And good for you for contributing to the betterment. Did you fix the situation? Nope.

And I never said that things were getting worse. But they aren't guaranteed not to.

And I don't think employers should be able to fire employees for any reason whatsoever outside of a contract. I think employees should be protected from flagrant abuse of power. Employees deserve such freedom to be able to live their lives outside the confines of the employers dictation. So long as they can do the job then they should not be fired from it- within reason, of course. That's why protected classes exist. Because employers cannot be trusted to treat employees with such fairness.

Quote:Employment at will law
At-will employment is a term used in U.S. labor law for contractual relationships in which an employee can be dismissed by an employer for any reason (that is, without having to establish "just cause" for termination), and without warning.

A lot of states have this in place. Even if a person is terminated from employment from one of the protected classes...the employee would have to prove that's the reason. All an employer has to say, at most, is that it's a business decision to terminate the employee/employer relationship. They actually have the right to give no reason at all.

I understand that. That is the case for me in Florida. Every job I get, I am at risk of being fired simply for being trans. And I think that is unjust. The same way I think it unjust for companies to fire someone because they are muslim, or because they are a woman, or because they are black. Etc.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
19-06-2017, 11:03 AM
RE: [split] LGBT (sub)section?
(17-06-2017 04:28 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(14-06-2017 09:01 AM)Emma Wrote:  It's not done though. Marriage equality was achieved in the US, sure. But it's not "done". LGBT people still have to deal with living in a hostile country in the US. People still get beat up for being gay or trans. People still get murdered for it. People still get beat up and murdered for being black, too.

It's far bigger than simply marriage equality.

In Afghanistan or Saudi Arabia you're more likely to be killed for being gay. By in large the only gay people being killed in the West (for being gay) is by Muslims

Unless they are dancing in a gay club in Orlando for example.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
19-06-2017, 11:07 AM
RE: [split] LGBT (sub)section?
(19-06-2017 11:03 AM)Born Again Pagan Wrote:  
(17-06-2017 04:28 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  In Afghanistan or Saudi Arabia you're more likely to be killed for being gay. By in large the only gay people being killed in the West (for being gay) is by Muslims

Unless they are dancing in a gay club in Orlando for example.

Uh, no. That psychopath was a child of one of those people, just like I said in the quote you used, and edited out the part that was relevant.

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
19-06-2017, 11:09 AM
RE: [split] LGBT (sub)section?
(19-06-2017 11:02 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(19-06-2017 10:47 AM)Emma Wrote:  Well maybe you stand to easily find another employer. It's not so easy for everyone else. That's why those protections exist.
Yes. I worked hard and educated myself. If I lost my job tomorrow, I'd do whatever it took to take care of my family until I found a better situation. I've done it before, and if need be I'd do it again, but I have educated myself and built a reputation. Everyone should do this.

Yes, as have I. But you don't have the same degree of risk that I have for losing a job and not being able to be rehired because of bias against trans people.

(19-06-2017 11:02 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(19-06-2017 10:47 AM)Emma Wrote:  Also, I never said that the levels of danger and discrimination were comparable. YOU DID.
Okay...

"There is little that most Americans can do to improve conditions for Afghans and Saudi's- that does not mean we should sit on our hands until things either deteriorate to that level of inhumanity or they catch up to our level of inhumanity."

My point was actually that they aren't comparable.

When I said, "or they catch up to our level of inhumanity", that was suggesting that we have a level of inhumanity that is not the same as the level of inhumanity that others endure. To catch up to our level would be an improvement. I'm not arguing that it's not.

I didn't bring this shit up. Your argument is, "They have it worse, sit down and shut up." And I will not. Not until I have the same level of risk that YOU do aside from differences in education and/or skill-level for any given job.

(19-06-2017 11:02 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(19-06-2017 10:47 AM)Emma Wrote:  And good for you for contributing to the betterment. Did you fix the situation? Nope.

So what, all or nothing? If you can't make something perfect, do nothing?

That's the argument you're making, except in reverse. You're suggesting that we don't do anything to continue to improve the lives of LGBTQ individuals in the US because LGBTQ individuals in the ME have it worse. That's an asinine argument at its core.

(19-06-2017 11:02 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(19-06-2017 10:47 AM)Emma Wrote:  And I never said that things were getting worse. But they aren't guaranteed not to.
Already covered.

(19-06-2017 10:47 AM)Emma Wrote:  And I don't think employers should be able to fire employees for any reason whatsoever outside of a contract. I think employees should be protected from flagrant abuse of power. Employees deserve such freedom to be able to live their lives outside the confines of the employers dictation. So long as they can do the job then they should not be fired from it- within reason, of course. That's why protected classes exist. Because employers cannot be trusted to treat employees with such fairness.

Yeah, just going to agree to disagree on this one or else we'll go down a rabbit-hole not worth going down, but if you're truly interested in learning about the effects of protected classes of people, I'd suggest you check out Thomas Sowell, or Milton Friedman.

And I'd suggest that you live the life of an at-risk individual. Live the life of a marginalized group and tell me that it's a level playing-field for them. Yes, we're going to have to agree to disagree.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Emma's post
19-06-2017, 11:13 AM
RE: [split] LGBT (sub)section?
Dark Light and Earmuffs are both victimized little bitches.

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
19-06-2017, 11:15 AM
RE: [split] LGBT (sub)section?
It's not a picnic in the working world as an woman who has been through breast cancer and is nearly 60.

Why do they need to know about the cancer? The gap in employment has to be explained.

The days of loyalty between workers and employers is pretty much a thing of the past.

While I sympathize with the employment hurdles that LGBT people may face, there are a lot of employment hurdles out there.

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
19-06-2017, 11:22 AM
RE: [split] LGBT (sub)section?
@Emma

The quotes are getting too weildy, so I'll just respond to all at once.

You seem to have assumed an awful lot about me without knowing much about me or my situation. Just because we came to different conclusions on particular topics. That being said, I'm not particularly interested in competing for the title of 'who has it worse'. If you want that title, you can have it.

As for 'silencing you' and telling you to 'sit down and shut up', that never happened. Nor was it implied. It's a figment. Engaging you in conversation is about as diametrically opposed to 'silencing you' and I could get.

Your claim of what my argument is is malformed. Why would I claim to have contributed (however little) to equality, and then simultaneously claim that to do so is futile or unworthy? That's a non-sequitur. This should be an obvious sign that have misunderstood me.

As for the last bit, you've made more assumptions, and then confused equity with equality.

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Dark Light's post
19-06-2017, 11:23 AM
RE: [split] LGBT (sub)section?
(19-06-2017 11:22 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  @Emma

The quotes are getting too weildy, so I'll just respond to all at once.

You seem to have assumed an awful lot about me without knowing much about me or my situation. Just because we came to different conclusions on particular topics. That being said, I'm not particularly interested in competing for the title of 'who has it worse'. If you want that title, you can have it.

As for 'silencing you' and telling you to 'sit down and shut up', that never happened. Nor was it implied. It's a figment. Engaging you in conversation is about as diametrically opposed to 'silencing you' and I could get.

Your claim of what my argument is is malformed. Why would I claim to have contributed (however little) to equality, and then simultaneously claim that to do so is futile or unworthy? That's a non-sequitur. This should be an obvious sign that have misunderstood me.

As for the last bit, you've made more assumptions, and then confused equity with equality.

You insulted her and now you're claiming to be friendly with her.

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
19-06-2017, 11:25 AM
RE: [split] LGBT (sub)section?
(19-06-2017 11:13 AM)GenesisNemesis Wrote:  Dark Light and Earmuffs are both victimized little bitches.

This is a predictable and emotional response with no forethought or intellectual consideration at all. Drinking Beverage

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Dark Light's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: